bons

'I suppose if nothing else it does prove the one value of Britons to most countries, the money they spend on holiday!
Very rarely a good word said about them from the rest of Europe but smile while we take their money!'
I hate to get invovled with this kind of argument, but you said 'the rest of Europe' in your orriginal post that triggered this discussion, implying that the Brits are hated by the rest of Europe, not just on here.

Moses2013

I'm surprised people are even questioning this. It's not my personal view but if you've lived in other European countries and talk to people, you kind of know how Brits are seen abroad (Based on tourism).
It's just something one has to live with and in countless surveys, it's mainly the Russians, Brits, Germans and French who are badly rated in Europe. I'm not a fan of surveys and people shouldn't take it personal, though there is some truth to it.

macliam

I'm questioning it because it's simply not true - particularly in Portugal, where most people know about the long relationship (even if most Brits don't). People may express their views on the "politics" and/or the behaviour of some tourists, but to say there's "never a good word said about" the UK suggests an over-sensitivity to such criticism.

Moses2013

"Never a good word said about" was probably the wrong wording by chislenko and "particularly in Portugal, where most people know about the long relationship" is probably not 100% correct either.
The views are there, no matter if we like them or not. Yes there will be people who like and know Brits and the majority of people probably don't have a relationship with Britain and still have an opinion.

macliam

So, you're saying that some people, sometimes, criticise the UK on some issues. Hardly surprising, eh?

Moses2013

What I say is irrelevant. You have to look at the wider picture and what do the majority of people think. How many people in Europe have a view on Trump and the US, although they have never been to the country and never met him personally. Just watch the news around Europe, talk to people abroad (all ages) and read articles from different countries. How many times do you think Brits are seen as the most welcome tourists when asked? People have views and we can't change that.

macliam

What you say may be true, but it is also irrelevant to this discussion and far from the inference of the original post - particulartly on a thread about the lifting of the UK quarantine rule for Portugal. The suggestion was that local people are two-faced and happy to take the cash whilst speaking ill of the donor. The fact that the UK projects itself as a "big beast", like the US, and therefore draws criticism, is simply not relevant to that view.

Moses2013

I agree and back to topic:-)

macliam

On that point .... I heard reports of crazy increases in prices after lifting of quarantine..... However, I checked my flight and the cost has tripled (from silly to cheap), and a car I was looking to hire has increased by about 25% (though still FAR below the kind of prices I'd expect at this time of year). Neither of the increases is a surprise, given that I'm travelling next week! So, has there been a significant up;lift in prices, apart from those who want to travel "tomorrow"?

I guess any increase will be limited by the proximity to term time and the fact that many people in the UK have just decided not to travel this year. Has anyone noticed a significany rise in tourism?

GeniB

Ok were in.. What ? did you read Eric

GeniB

Do tell.. who are your 'conspiracy mongers' ? You are coming across as rather too smug on this subject now Eric. if you have 'insider' knowledge I am sure we would all like to share in it. As it is Boris has left us in Portugal with these 'wild speculations '. You have to admit that it doesn't make any real sense when stacked up against the other 72 countries who were allowed to use the air bridge.

P.S Sorry couldn't come back to this sooner. I see the thread has moved on to Brit bashing ....

Red Eric

I'll refer us to the post that occasioned that remark :
I have no idea where that's come from. I never heard any such thing coming out of the mouth of any government spokesperson.

They have been entirely consistent about the reporting in terms of breaking the numbers down area-wise. There were some teething problems at the very beginning, due to statistics being collated by various bodies before being submitted to central government, which resulted in some minor inconsistencies until the reporting chain was altered so that individual institutions reported direct. That was long before the period we're talking about here though and did not have the effect you mention anyway.

The matter of where precisely the infections were most prevalent is entirely irrelevant as far as Portugal not being put on the UK's quarantine whitelist goes and that was what the PT government's grievance was about. The numbers have always been by far the highest in the north and the Greater Lisbon area, with very little incidence in Alentejo, Algarve or the autonomous regions. At one point, pretty much all the new cases were in the outer Lisbon area and this was nothing whatsoever to do with misreporting or attempts at massaging the figures - it was a perfectly natural evolution.

The measure used by the UK to determine a threshold above which countries don't get on the whitelist doesn't take into account regional differences, so although the regions most sought after by tourists and most dependent economically on that activity (particularly Algarve and Madeira) also happen to be amongst those with the lowest of incidence, they were included in the quarantine requirement. The calculation that occasioned it was done on the entire national figures, though, not, as per your suggestion, triggered by a single region exceeding the threshold.

That is what has consistently been reported in print and broadcast news here.

Do you have any source for the other version?

Red Eric

Conspiracy mongers - people who are spreading rumours about there being some ulterior motive for Portugal's having been left off the quarantine whitelist without giving sources and without making any attempt at providing a plausible explanation.

I don't have 'insider' knowledge. I have a knowledge of what has been printed in newspapers and broadcast on radio and TV. A lot of it is either direct from the mouths of spokespersons for the government or the public health authority and is backed up by a website full of information about the statistics, broken down by individual day, going back to the beginning of the pandemic. I have also watched quite a few of the press conferences at which journalists have been free to ask any question they want of the panel present and at which honest attempts have always been made at responses, with promises to return asap with the answers following investigation, should any not be to hand at first time of asking.

We may or may not agree with the approach taken by the UK but I don't think they're applying their criteria inconsistently - unless you've got specific evidence to the contrary, in which case I'll happily reconsider on seeing it.