GeniB

It is a social norm that has been allowed to grow since the breaking down of the barriers in the swinging 60's

The British do not have a history of social interaction between age groups. Unlike in Europe where all ages mix together quite naturally .It is endemic in the language of the British that you 'Get rid of the kids' park grandma in a home.'get away from family... Having a good time..means getting drunk.

When society breaks up into groups like this ,you get get gangs that respect no one but their peers.Have no respect for anyone else.

One of the first delights of living in NL for us was to see how totally natural it was to see all ages mixed together. at music festivals. local event.s eating out etc. We were stunned to see whole travelling fairgrounds park themselves in the very centre of villages and small towns.Just to give the kids and families some fun before they returned to school. It must have been hell for those shops and flats next door to them for four nights or so.. but everyone joined in..never any trouble.no drunken brawls etc.

GeniB

I have a friend in Mallorca that I email regularly Quite by chance she told me that this question had come up on a British forum only last week...Someone had posted a complaint about Ryan air being 'mean' by not seating a group of 15 women together who were going on a hen party (used to be one night in my day ) Ryan air wasn't thinking about it's other clients... it was demanding extra payment ...


This post however got 40 responses. some for and against. of course but what shocked my friend was just how many of the 40 had experienced horrific ,or frightening behaviour on flights they had taken in the past year.

One where a man's MIL was hit on the head with a bottle for complaining about the drunken man behind her.
One where the pilot had to abhort a landing because a drunk was running up and down the gangway..they were 100ft from the runway. The man had spit at and punched the stewardess.
One where a father had asked the stewardess to ask a group of 10 revellers to tone down their foul language in front of his 10 yrs old daughter..She had refused saying 'I'm not their mother' the men had then jeered at the father for the rest of the fight.
Many many more but you get my drift.No one complains when your 35,000 ft up in the air with maniacs

macliam

I don't know what the reason for this bad behaviour is - there are many factors - but a major one is the lack of coverage - or partisan coverage - of such events by the British press. I recall on event in Dublin where a group of football fans had decided to trash the bar they were in. They even broke every one of the toilets - including the ladies - and not just the seats, they smashed the bowls! Then the guards came and arrested them - but not before one of them tried to punch his way out of trouble....

The British press coverage, on about page 8, was that an England fan had been hit with a baton after "an altercation" in a Dublin bar.... heavily suggesting that it was anti-English behaviour!!

Until these animals are shamed - and prosecuted in the UK for such events, they'll continue.

mfesharne

Not sure I agree with that........ I remember the 60s & beyond & the behaviour of Brits abroad was nowhere near as bad in the late 60 to the mid to late 80s as it is now.

I'd put it down more to the collapse of society & lack of parenting skills that developed in the 90s & beyond......... So many parents failed to hold their 'little darlings' accountable for their misbehaviour who in turn are now passing the same attitudes onto their 'little darlings'

all this lily livered PC liberal BS has a lot to be blamed for.

007Steve

...V, V true.
Billericay on a weekend.
The travel agency seems to have made a nice fat profit out of all this. Wonder if they'll stump up some of it for the damage?

EMR

Nothing to do with PC etc , changes in UK licensing laws ,etc.
We did not have clubs on almost every street corner.
Pubs closed at 10.30 at least 5 days week.
We did not have the same amount of disposable income.
We simply could not afford to do what they do now.
I can remember the Spanish police dealing with young drunk Brita in the early 70s.
I was in a French ski resort that was locked down on Swedish transfer day so that hoteliers and property owners could deal with the mayhem of their last night.
Nothing new in what happened in Albufeira that night, just the scale of the event., the police will have probably intervened every night since but just with smaller groups or individuals.

morpeth

Nothing to do with PC liberal attitude and ideological changes ? I don't say that is all of the reason, but certainly part of it. My grandparents certainly had more control on their children than parents today- and if for no other reasons my grandfather had authority which he could enforce, and really no one would question it.

Though I agree in the 70's I saw the same sort of thing in France, in Spain , of such behavior but now it seems the norm- but also at least where I was born in UK behavior has gone down as well.

morpeth

But if parents do hold them accountable, then they can be questioned for being too strict.

johnwoo

Does no one remember the Mods and Rockers fighting on the south coast beaches during the early 60s.

AllanB

Lets go back a further 20 years to the early 40's, when their was "proper respect", the good old days.

Grow up girls.... boys will be boys and they will drink and fight, no one died here. they just woke up a few old farts. I can't believe I am the same generation as you lot.

Like I said, if you don't like it there move house, I am sure house prices are high there with all that excitement.

Or move to Syria/Iraq, I believe there is some action their.. also started by us.

GeniB

I mean't it started in the UK then..mfesharne..Suddenly you had the MODS and ROCKERS kicking off in seaside towns.Large groups of young men (mostly) on bikes and mopeds brawling in some town they chose to visit.

I quite agree about the collapse of society.. and for me that mean't the total lack of support for mother's in the home. It didn't take a brain surgeon to see that if you demanded that the woman worked (let's be realistic, no one could afford not to with rising prices on everything and rising social expectations,the pressure on women to work outside the home was enormous.)

The British ignored this.. Married women with families didn't work in the Netherlands until way into the late 80's early 90's .You actually had to e able to afford it in the first place,as your OH would be taxed on your income.By then however there had been many social improvements made,which included good after school clubs,nurseries within the workplace,flexible working hrs. etc etc.

In other words a recognition that at least one parent should be available to a child at all times ,from babies to when they left the education system and were deemed self sufficient...If you relinquish that responsibility you get the society we have now

Ingles

It's not just the youngsters , on a flight back to UK the early 80's 2 couples in there late 30's +/- got on as if they had just left the beach , after take off they started to try to drink the plane dry, they got exceeding loud & very obnoxious
In the end the stewardess refused to sever them any more , then the problems really started, it got so bad that when we landed the authorities appeared to escort them off the plane , the rest off us had to sit there until they where "under control"

AllanB

Please drop this Mods and Rockers story, it is nonsense drummed up by the press, less damage was done during the big Bright weekend than an average weekend, but it sold papers and had old farts chunnering for the next 10 years.

It was a large number of young people running around, none of which could knock the skin off a rice pudding. They had a similar one in Bridport when we were there, a lot of tough talking, "lets get 'em" and when we got there, there was no one there.

Have you guys heard of a a thing called war, a little more serious that a few fat lips and black eyes. We haven't had a proper one for a few years, these people are just those people letting off some steam. You are making this sound like a war, maybe you would prefer another one.

This has always gone on, well for at least 100 years, my grandfather told me, nothing changes apart from we grow older and some of us begin to act holier than thou..

morpeth

It seems our view of the past influenced by age but also ideology. I wasbnorn in poor part of North East, but certainly standards of behavior have declined.

rhody

I think the word you meant to use is censure not sensor or censor. Censure is to express severe disapproval of (someone or something), especially in a formal statement. I believe this is what you would like the British Embassy in Lisbon to do and I wholeheartedly agree!