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"Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

"Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

Old Jan 21st 2022, 8:29 am
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Default "Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

I've heard this comment quite a lot but I'm curious as to how much more expensive than for example the UK.

Is it that used cars hold their value very well in PT? Are new cars priced similarly to the UK and it is just used cars in PT that are expensive compared to the UK? What is availability of used like, eg is there loads of junk out there and you have to be very careful when looking?

If used cars are so expensive would it make more sense to just buy a new car with all the advantages this brings?

This is still a few years away for us but I would be thinking of a good quality 4 x 4 suitable for the dirt track in the mountains that we would inevitably end up living at the end of!
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Old Jan 21st 2022, 9:25 am
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Default Re: "Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

If you are planning for a move to Portugal whereby you become officially resident then your situation is different from those of us who do not have or seek residency.

Because NEW residents may bring in one vehicle which they already own and have it legalized on Portuguese plates ( subject to various rules and whatnot but that is the gist of it ) without paying the massive import / registration duties which would otherwise apply.

So you could familiarize yourself with the applicable rules and plan to acquire your desired ( for Portugal ) 4x4 a year or so before the intended move ( you have to have owned the vehicle for a year I think for it to qualify ).

I have always got by in the UK with cheapo second hand cars. But having looked at what is available in Portugal ( and having a mortal fear of breakdown, as I have no mechanical knowledge ) I have ended up veering towards buying a new car ( probably a Dacia Duster 2021 version which has garnered only good reviews as far as I can tell ) for use and maintenance in Portugal.

It looked to me that to buy something likely to be reliable second hand in Portugal would need nine or ten grand ( as opposed to the three or four I would pay in England ). And even then of course, with a second hand car you might still end up with an unreliable nightmare and have no recourse to a guarantee.
So I have sort of psyched myself up to being prepared to buy new ( albeit probably one of the cheapest new cars ) , which I calculate is a better deal for a non mechanically minded person.

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Old Jan 21st 2022, 12:46 pm
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Default Re: "Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

Originally Posted by nb888 View Post
I've heard this comment quite a lot but I'm curious as to how much more expensive than for example the UK.

Is it that used cars hold their value very well in PT? Are new cars priced similarly to the UK and it is just used cars in PT that are expensive compared to the UK? What is availability of used like, eg is there loads of junk out there and you have to be very careful when looking?

If used cars are so expensive would it make more sense to just buy a new car with all the advantages this brings?

This is still a few years away for us but I would be thinking of a good quality 4 x 4 suitable for the dirt track in the mountains that we would inevitably end up living at the end of!
Below's a link to one of the sites with secondhand vehicles to give you an idea of what people are asking and what variety is available. One thing to be aware of is that though older cars may be expensive (also the men average wage here is lower then UK) the local garages have experience of them so looking at the selection of vehicles in, say, a supermarket carpark will give an idea of what makes/types are in common use. Rather pointless having a cheaper import if parts are not easily available and no-one works on that make/type. I did bring over an older UK reg Citroen Diesel and the local mechanic here fitted a new cam belt, tensioner and water pump ( the water level in the rad would drop over a period of time) for 100 euro parts and labour, took it in one day and collected the next, his wife also gave me a lift into town. The "matriculation" of imported UK cars is also an added cost with the Right hand drive specific bits like headlights.

In case the link doesn't work then search for OXL in Portugal.

4X4 - Carros - OLX Portugal


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Old Jan 21st 2022, 3:39 pm
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Default Re: "Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

Yes second hand cars expensive but so are new and importation tightly controlled to keep market as it is .
Good sites to check
https://www.standvirtual.com/carros
https://volantesic.pt/carros-a-venda...leageMin=10000

In the process now and my old X5 from 2006 if I tried to replace with a 4/5 year model would be up around €40.000,- When I bought it living in Spain it was 4 years old and I paid €27.000,- so gives you an idea.
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Old Jan 21st 2022, 4:43 pm
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Default Re: "Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

I bought (a long time ago) a 2 or 3 year old car from the Toyota dealer in Faro. So:
(a) it's delivered to you with a pretty good background
(b) someone else has taken the hit of initial depreciation.
Then drive it for ever! I only managed 15 years, but on returning to the UK I've done the same thing here.
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Old Jan 21st 2022, 6:09 pm
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Default Re: "Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

Originally Posted by nigel.b View Post
I bought (a long time ago) a 2 or 3 year old car from the Toyota dealer in Faro. So:
(a) it's delivered to you with a pretty good background
(b) someone else has taken the hit of initial depreciation.
Then drive it for ever! I only managed 15 years, but on returning to the UK I've done the same thing here.
Agree - one of the reasons that second-hand cars from a dealer are so expensive is because they have to provide a fairly comprehensive warranty.

However, it depends what you buy - last year we bought a low-mileage 3 year-old Ford from the dealer at a similar price as they are now asking in the UK and the Portuguese one is better specced. On the other hand, the high initial cost of a new car and the high second-hand cost from a "stand" makes those selling privately bump up their prices too.
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Old Jan 21st 2022, 6:10 pm
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Default Re: "Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

I bought a 50,000 euro car for just 3,000 euros.
Here's how;
I simply waited 20 years.

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Old Jan 21st 2022, 6:57 pm
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Default Re: "Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

Cars start off more expensive due to high taxes (and the same expensive taxes applied to cars imported) and depreciate more slowly due to low maintenance costs.

However, Portugal has been under pressure from the EU over the import taxes and has partially reduced them (keeping them high only for large capacity engines/high CO2 values). The EU continues to pressure (ongoing legal case) so it's possible the import taxes may go away entirely in future (but don't hold your breath)

Depending what you want, it can be viable to import (albeit a bit of hassle) and allegedly around 30% of cars in Portugal have been imported (on the secondary market). Have a look on here to see the price differences: https://www.mobile.de/?lang=en

This gives a pretty comprehensive import guide (in Portuguese) https://impostosobreveiculos.info/
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Old Jan 23rd 2022, 12:16 pm
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Default Re: "Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

I have been looking at several new cars in Portugal in the 20k-30k range and wouldn't say they are more expensive than in the UK (maybe cheaper depending on exchange rate)

One caveat, models are not always directly comparable so maybe differences there.

Example Nissan Qashqai Accents DIG-T 140CV (103kW) Mild Hybrid 12V Portugal €29,550 (which as far as I can see includes IVA and most other costs except delivery and admin), UK Accenta Premium model seems comparable £27,155 (€32.5k at 1.2 rate. Although there is a cheaper Visia model in the UK)

However I think depreciation is lower so second hand values are comparatively more expensive.

Happily get other views as will help in my decision making.
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Old Jan 23rd 2022, 1:25 pm
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Default Re: "Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

Originally Posted by appman999 View Post
I have been looking at several new cars in Portugal in the 20k-30k range and wouldn't say they are more expensive than in the UK (maybe cheaper depending on exchange rate)

One caveat, models are not always directly comparable so maybe differences there.

Example Nissan Qashqai Accents DIG-T 140CV (103kW) Mild Hybrid 12V Portugal €29,550 (which as far as I can see includes IVA and most other costs except delivery and admin), UK Accenta Premium model seems comparable £27,155 (€32.5k at 1.2 rate. Although there is a cheaper Visia model in the UK)

However I think depreciation is lower so second hand values are comparatively more expensive.

Happily get other views as will help in my decision making.
I'd agree, I was looking at a Puma last year, which was on offer in Portugal at the time - it was actually cheaper than in the UK, although, as you say, models are not always directly comparable.
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Old Jan 23rd 2022, 1:26 pm
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Default Re: "Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

List price is (in normal times) much more negotiable in the UK, with brokers like https://www.drivethedeal.com/ often offering discounts of 20% or more on some models ordered new and pre-registered "ex-demo" always available at a good discount (last car I bought in the UK was 29.5K list, bought from the dealer at 1 year old for 20K)

I notice Standvirtual has started giving some "possible discount" guidelines on new cars in PT, which is useful, but there are no brokers here as far as I know?

Rental/PCP deals are OK'ish in PT though, helped by the lower depreciation I guess
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Old Jan 23rd 2022, 1:49 pm
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Default Re: "Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

Very true and still deals to be had in UK but Portugal is not a 'very expensive' location.

Interesting point about lease deals, using the Qashqai example over 25 months, 6,000 with similar £3k deposits, Nissan PT offer APR 7.79% £313/month, £26.6k balloon payment, Nissan UK offer APR 4.9% £372/month, £16.6k balloon payment!!

As you say lower depreciation is probably the cause but doesn't that make buying new more attractive?
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Old Jan 23rd 2022, 2:18 pm
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Default Re: "Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

Originally Posted by Alan PT View Post
List price is (in normal times) much more negotiable in the UK, with brokers like https://www.drivethedeal.com/ often offering discounts of 20% or more on some models ordered new and pre-registered "ex-demo" always available at a good discount (last car I bought in the UK was 29.5K list, bought from the dealer at 1 year old for 20K)

I notice Standvirtual has started giving some "possible discount" guidelines on new cars in PT, which is useful, but there are no brokers here as far as I know?

Rental/PCP deals are OK'ish in PT though, helped by the lower depreciation I guess
My comment was on a Ford-driven deal through main dealers against th cost of a similar vehicle at the Ford main dealer in the UK (I know, I did a test drive and initial negotiation). It may have been possible to achieve a better price in the UK, but by distance buying etc., which not everyone does.
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Old Jan 23rd 2022, 2:31 pm
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Default Re: "Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

Originally Posted by Alan PT View Post
List price is (in normal times) much more negotiable in the UK, with brokers like https://www.drivethedeal.com/ often offering discounts of 20% or more on some models ordered new and pre-registered "ex-demo" always available at a good discount (last car I bought in the UK was 29.5K list, bought from the dealer at 1 year old for 20K)

I notice Standvirtual has started giving some "possible discount" guidelines on new cars in PT, which is useful, but there are no brokers here as far as I know?

Rental/PCP deals are OK'ish in PT though, helped by the lower depreciation I guess
I think rental /pcp rates are driven more by interest rates than anything else and, unlike the UK there does not seem to be the huge company car market which means second hand values remain high as there is not the regular throughput of 3 /4 year company cars being dumped in the market. Checking through sites such as Standvirtual and similar what always strikes me is the high kms that many second hand cars have, difficult to find the "Low mileage, One careful owner from new" type offering.
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Old Jan 23rd 2022, 3:58 pm
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Default Re: "Cars are very expensive to buy in Portugal"

mileage is less important than it used to be.
Engineering has improved a lot in the last few decades, and mechanical parts last much, much longer.
My petrol Mercedes has 380,000km on it and my Diesel Mitsubishi 320,000km. Both engines run just fine.
Of course maintenance has been done as required; clutch, timing belt, wheel bearings, suspension parts, lots of tires, etc.
Parts fail more due to age than use, and rust remains the biggest enemy.
Check your fuel hoses!
However, the powerful Portuguese sun also does huge damage to cars parked outside. It will burn the paint off and cook the interior plastics.
A garaged car with little or no weather damage is a better deal than a low mileage car.
In my opinion at least.
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