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-   -   Income suggestions (https://britishexpats.com/forum/philippines-155/income-suggestions-928342/)

EwanD Oct 6th 2019 11:45 pm

Income suggestions
 
I am thinking about moving to the Philippines within the next few years and have plans to build a multi unit apartment building there which I’m currently saving for - we have already purchased the lot. However, if we do or don’t go through with this, I would need another source of income on my part, my partner has work but I’m aware it’s near impossible to be employed by an employer there. I’d be open to any suggestions except for teaching English as I do not have the qualifications to be doing so.
Also, I’d be living in Laguna, Luzon
Cheers

Gazza-d Oct 7th 2019 8:53 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by EwanD (Post 12744824)
I am thinking about moving to the Philippines within the next few years and have plans to build a multi unit apartment building there which I’m currently saving for - we have already purchased the lot. However, if we do or don’t go through with this, I would need another source of income on my part, my partner has work but I’m aware it’s near impossible to be employed by an employer there. I’d be open to any suggestions except for teaching English as I do not have the qualifications to be doing so.
Also, I’d be living in Laguna, Luzon
Cheers

Before you even consider work you need to think about what visa you will on. Not all visas allow you to work.

EwanD Oct 7th 2019 12:36 pm

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by Gazza-d (Post 12744934)
Before you even consider work you need to think about what visa you will on. Not all visas allow you to work.

I intend to get the 13a visa since it makes the most sense
Cheers

Gazza-d Oct 7th 2019 10:40 pm

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by EwanD (Post 12745024)

I intend to get the 13a visa since it makes the most sense
Cheers

Something that can be sorted before you arrive then. The Philippines can be a great place to retire on a pension from your home country, any sort of local income will be an uphill struggle.

mikek1 Oct 8th 2019 12:46 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by Gazza-d (Post 12745294)
Something that can be sorted before you arrive then. The Philippines can be a great place to retire on a pension from your home country, any sort of local income will be an uphill struggle.

Exactly, and good advice. I have looked at options to seek an income via a business. Having researched and asked foreigner owned bussinesmen for there opinion I have realized that the risks are extremely high, and the rewards very poor.
One of the problems is the buracracy and paperwork are daunting.To succeed you would need substantial capital and even if you had such funds your ROI would take years, if ever.
I looked at Building a boarding House on a large scale and the Final nail in the confin was the cost of a sprinkler system which was 1.5 million php. Without a sprinkler system it would be impossible to get the Building validated for a permit of use. The other downside, where do you get staff that are reliable,competant, and trustworthy to manager the business.
I dropped the project because I am retired and did not want to become a slave to the business, head aches are not for me.

Andrew_AJP Oct 10th 2019 1:09 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by mikek1 (Post 12745313)


Exactly, and good advice. I have looked at options to seek an income via a business. Having researched and asked foreigner owned bussinesmen for there opinion I have realized that the risks are extremely high, and the rewards very poor.
One of the problems is the buracracy and paperwork are daunting.To succeed you would need substantial capital and even if you had such funds your ROI would take years, if ever.
I looked at Building a boarding House on a large scale and the Final nail in the confin was the cost of a sprinkler system which was 1.5 million php. Without a sprinkler system it would be impossible to get the Building validated for a permit of use. The other downside, where do you get staff that are reliable,competant, and trustworthy to manager the business.
I dropped the project because I am retired and did not want to become a slave to the business, head aches are not for me.

The wife's family of course lol

mikek1 Oct 10th 2019 1:15 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by Andrew_AJP (Post 12746350)
The wife's family of course lol


After reading P11s family saga, I would prefer to trust a double glazing salesman, estate agent, or worse, a polotician.....lol.

Andrew_AJP Oct 10th 2019 1:52 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by Gazza-d (Post 12745294)
Something that can be sorted before you arrive then. The Philippines can be a great place to retire on a pension from your home country, any sort of local income will be an uphill struggle.


Originally Posted by EwanD (Post 12745024)

I intend to get the 13a visa since it makes the most sense
Cheers

As I understand if you get the 13a in the UK you don't have to go through the "probationary" period of a year in the Philippines and the reapply is this the case?

mikek1 Oct 10th 2019 2:00 am

Re: Income suggestions
 
Not sure. I got my 13a in the Philippines and it was easy. I have served my probationary 1 year and have a 5 year 13a visa. Will have to report once a year to establish that my circumstances have not changed. Very simple, just make sure that all the paperwork you need to supply is correct and where a document needs authentication it is done. A marriage certificate Will have to be authenticated if the marriage was in the UK.

Gazza-d Oct 10th 2019 2:35 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by Andrew_AJP (Post 12746364)
As I understand if you get the 13a in the UK you don't have to go through the "probationary" period of a year in the Philippines and the reapply is this the case?

It was the case but the information is now conflicting if you read the Philippines embassy london website. As it is your wife that applies on your behalf I assume she would need to be abroad with you when the application is made.

Andrew_AJP Oct 10th 2019 7:20 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by Gazza-d (Post 12746370)
It was the case but the information is now conflicting if you read the Philippines embassy london website. As it is your wife that applies on your behalf I assume she would need to be abroad with you when the application is made.

Yes that would be the case we have been together 10 years in the UK

EwanD Oct 10th 2019 10:30 am

Re: Income suggestions
 
Thank you for your replies, 13a would be the way to go, although I’ve never heard of getting past the 1 year probationary so I’ll look into that. As for the income, I’m in my early 20s so I can’t rely on a pension...
‘the cost of a sprinkler system which was 1.5 million php’ that’s an insane amount for just one part of the building. However, small individual units won’t require sprinkler systems so it’s still the main option in terms of how I’ll make money over there. One thing I’m unsure of is if I’d need to declare it as a business since it’s multiple units? If so I know I can only own 40% which isn’t a big deal since it will just be me and my partner, whose name is on the land title anyway. So does anyone know if it would have to be made a business/corporation?

mikek1 Oct 10th 2019 11:24 am

Re: Income suggestions
 
No problem the yearly review is exactly that. If your circumstances have not changed no problem. If however for some reason you and your wife split up the 13a Will be revoked, and you would then have to make do with a Tourist visa. You cannot own land ,run a business ,have a Bank account, or have a driving license on a Tourist visa .

You need to do some very serious research before coming to live in the Philippines. How many times have you visited the Philippines and what is the maximum period you have spent there.

nonthaburi Oct 11th 2019 6:09 am

Re: Income suggestions
 
How much money are you looking to invest in the Philippines and what's your expected return?

Have you considered buying property in the UK and renting it out? Might be a while lot easier and less hassle, and it's yours.

Do you have a degree? If you do aTESOLcert there are plenty of Chinese companies out there for teaching online that will pull in a couple of thousand dollars a month without too much difficulty.

mikemike Oct 11th 2019 8:45 am

Re: Income suggestions
 
''there are plenty of Chinese companies out there for teaching online that will pull in a couple of thousand dollars a month without too much difficulty.''


there are?

mikek1 Oct 11th 2019 9:09 am

Re: Income suggestions
 
Would have thought for US$ 2000p/m there would be many Filipinos applying, they speak exellent English. There are many call Centres in the Philippines where English is the chosen language. Many call center workers also have degrees in verying subjects, teaching amongst them.
Internet access is obviously a must, however on US$ 2000 pm it would certainly not be a problem.


Simples.

Gazza-d Oct 11th 2019 9:38 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by mikek1 (Post 12746956)
Would have thought for US$ 2000p/m there would be many Filipinos applying, they speak exellent English. There are many call Centres in the Philippines where English is the chosen language. Many call center workers also have degrees in verying subjects, teaching amongst them.
Internet access is obviously a must, however on US$ 2000 pm it would certainly not be a problem.


Simples.

Also the market is over saturated.

nonthaburi Oct 11th 2019 10:35 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by mikemike (Post 12746950)
''there are plenty of Chinese companies out there for teaching online that will pull in a couple of thousand dollars a month without too much difficulty.''


there are?

Yeah, there are. I've looked into it myself if my current gig in the Middle East goes tits up and I need to keep myself ticking over.

nonthaburi Oct 11th 2019 10:39 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by mikek1 (Post 12746956)
Would have thought for US$ 2000p/m there would be many Filipinos applying, they speak exellent English. There are many call Centres in the Philippines where English is the chosen language. Many call center workers also have degrees in verying subjects, teaching amongst them.
Internet access is obviously a must, however on US$ 2000 pm it would certainly not be a problem.


Simples.

The companies I've looked at don't want Filipinos. They want US/UK/AUS/NZ/SA etc.

mummy and daddy in China won't pay good money for their kid to learn from a filipino.

nonthaburi Oct 11th 2019 10:52 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by mikemike (Post 12746950)
''there are plenty of Chinese companies out there for teaching online that will pull in a couple of thousand dollars a month without too much difficulty.''


there are?

Sorry , I'll explain that better. There are many companies catering to the Chinese Market, but they're not Chinese.

EwanD Oct 14th 2019 11:36 pm

Re: Income suggestions
 
I do not expect large, fast growing returns on the apartments investment, just a steady income. Together with what my partner makes, we'd make it work for us. I was just wondering if anyone had any ideas for a little extra to make in my spare time, most probably online. Does anyone know of any?
I had considered teaching English but have found that it would be more me in reality with so many already jumping on it and it becoming more competitive for me and my level of English qualifications.

Gazza-d Oct 15th 2019 2:11 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by EwanD (Post 12748400)
I do not expect large, fast growing returns on the apartments investment, just a steady income. Together with what my partner makes, we'd make it work for us. I was just wondering if anyone had any ideas for a little extra to make in my spare time, most probably online. Does anyone know of any?
I had considered teaching English but have found that it would be more me in reality with so many already jumping on it and it becoming more competitive for me and my level of English qualifications.

One of the biggest headaches seems to be reliable and fast internet. Something you didn't need to work on in realtime would be best. Levels of occupancy could be the undoing of any property speculation.

mikek1 Oct 15th 2019 3:59 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by Gazza-d (Post 12748439)
One of the biggest headaches seems to be reliable and fast internet. Something you didn't need to work on in realtime would be best. Levels of occupancy could be the undoing of any property speculation.

Getting the rent paid on time and without default will be your biggest problem.

nonthaburi Oct 15th 2019 4:37 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by EwanD (Post 12748400)
I do not expect large, fast growing returns on the apartments investment, just a steady income. Together with what my partner makes, we'd make it work for us. I was just wondering if anyone had any ideas for a little extra to make in my spare time, most probably online. Does anyone know of any?
I had considered teaching English but have found that it would be more me in reality with so many already jumping on it and it becoming more competitive for me and my level of English qualifications.

I wouldn't worry about any of that if you do think again about teaching. Exponential growth in the Chinese Market right now.

mikemike Oct 15th 2019 5:26 am

Re: Income suggestions
 
I have been teaching IELTS on line for a few years and can find nothing like the income figures suggested. I have this week spoken with 5 expat teachers, some very experienced teachers who have taught in China. They too, are struggling to get anything like these figures. One teaches 10 hours a day to earn 65,000per month. These people are not muppets. One teaches almost exclusively to the business market for Chinese, Japanese and Korean students. A significant amount of who are direct students, no third party involved.

I would be grateful please, as would they; if your could identify which on line schools/resources offer such packages.

Thank you

nonthaburi Oct 15th 2019 6:23 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by mikemike (Post 12748505)
I have been teaching IELTS on line for a few years and can find nothing like the income figures suggested. I have this week spoken with 5 expat teachers, some very experienced teachers who have taught in China. They too, are struggling to get anything like these figures. One teaches 10 hours a day to earn 65,000per month. These people are not muppets. One teaches almost exclusively to the business market for Chinese, Japanese and Korean students. A significant amount of who are direct students, no third party involved.

I would be grateful please, as would they; if your could identify which on line schools/resources offer such packages.

Thank you

Figures are based on $20 an hour. Companies will normally require you to work a minimum of 10 hours a week. Obviously, the more you work, the more you earn.

Average rates range from $15-25 depending on company and experience.

Like I said previously, I looked into it a while back as a stopgap if things went wrong for me in the Gulf. I was offered $18 an hour by one company I got taking to. I didn't start but I've got no reason to believe they were lying.

PM me for some company names. I'd be interested to know how it all checks out myself.

But going on what I looked at and what people I know are doing I've no reason to believe that $2000 per month isn't unobtainable.

The one big drawback was having to work long hours at the weekends when there is a lot of work, as the students are off school then.

nonthaburi Oct 15th 2019 6:29 am

Re: Income suggestions
 
Also , that 10 hours a day, is that every day 5 days a week ?

Because a rough calculation on that if that's true makes it about $6 an hour, which is absolutely terrible.

mikemike Oct 15th 2019 7:19 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by nonthaburi (Post 12748523)
Also , that 10 hours a day, is that every day 5 days a week ?

Because a rough calculation on that if that's true makes it about $6 an hour, which is absolutely terrible.

yes that is the figure but no weekend work

Stokkevn Nov 23rd 2019 1:46 pm

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by EwanD (Post 12748400)
I do not expect large, fast growing returns on the apartments investment, just a steady income. Together with what my partner makes, we'd make it work for us. I was just wondering if anyone had any ideas for a little extra to make in my spare time, most probably online. Does anyone know of any?
I had considered teaching English but have found that it would be more me in reality with so many already jumping on it and it becoming more competitive for me and my level of English qualifications.

Something that may have been missed on here is the need to be on site 24/7. You are obviously not an old codger as most of us are on here but suppliers will short deliver, workers will short mix concrete, instead of international standards of 4 to 1 here 6 or 7 to one is not unusual, the other 2/3 bags sold off to another construction site. 16mm steel bar suddenly turns into 12mm or less.

See
this building was less than 5 years old when it collapsed, substandard workmanship and materials.

EwanD Dec 8th 2019 9:03 pm

Re: Income suggestions
 
Damn... I certainly won’t be building any tower blocks...
However, I have recently been thinking about purchasing a condo in Manila. I think it’s ultimately a safer investment considering I’m not overly knowledgable on construction. The idea is to find a unit close to office buildings so that the unit can be occupied by multiple tenants as a sort of boarding house. I know a few people who are renting like this as it’s a cheap option for lower income workers. They’re very much in demand as a lot of people can’t afford to rent somewhere of their own and a plus for me as I can own the unit myself.

Gazza-d Dec 8th 2019 9:40 pm

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by EwanD (Post 12775752)
Damn... I certainly won’t be building any tower blocks...
However, I have recently been thinking about purchasing a condo in Manila. I think it’s ultimately a safer investment considering I’m not overly knowledgable on construction. The idea is to find a unit close to office buildings so that the unit can be occupied by multiple tenants as a sort of boarding house. I know a few people who are renting like this as it’s a cheap option for lower income workers. They’re very much in demand as a lot of people can’t afford to rent somewhere of their own and a plus for me as I can own the unit myself.

A brit friend of ours has just let go a condo in Manila because of the tax implications in the UK. He already has a condo in subic so do not now if it only effects you third property onward . Something to check into.

EwanD Dec 8th 2019 10:13 pm

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by Gazza-d (Post 12775758)
A brit friend of ours has just let go a condo in Manila because of the tax implications in the UK. He already has a condo in subic so do not now if it only effects you third property onward . Something to check into.

‘the tax implications in the UK’? that’s an interesting thought. I’d imagine he’d be living in the UK at the time? With the ownership of a condo I would be living there permanently in order to maintain the unit, if I moved back chances are I’d sell it before doing so.

mikemike Dec 9th 2019 4:13 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by EwanD (Post 12775762)

‘the tax implications in the UK’? that’s an interesting thought. I’d imagine he’d be living in the UK at the time? With the ownership of a condo I would be living there permanently in order to maintain the unit, if I moved back chances are I’d sell it before doing so.

There would not be uk income tax implications if you are non resident in the Uk for tax purposes. As the asset is earning income in the Philippines, you would be liable for local income tax and capital gains tax on disposal.

AS for capital gains tax in the UK on disposal, yes there would be a liability if a Uk resident. there maybe offset against local CGT as I believe there may be a double taxation treaty with the UK. Something to be looked at.

CGT here is 6% flat against the sales value as opposed to any gain. just a badly worded sales tax. In addition this is an upfront tax paid before receiving the proceeds of the sale!

Gazza-d Dec 9th 2019 7:35 am

Re: Income suggestions
 
In the UK you are only allowed one property free of capital gains tax, therefore one of the properties in either the Philippines or UK would attract capital gains tax. When I next see my friend I'll ask him what the problem was. He has property in the UK , a condo in Subic, it was the third property a condo in Manila he pulled out of when it came time to pay for it.

mikek1 Dec 11th 2019 12:12 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by Gazza-d (Post 12775891)
In the UK you are only allowed one property free of capital gains tax, therefore one of the properties in either the Philippines or UK would attract capital gains tax. When I next see my friend I'll ask him what the problem was. He has property in the UK , a condo in Subic, it was the third property a condo in Manila he pulled out of when it came time to pay for it.


There is no capital gains tax on a UK property provided it is your place of residency. There is a certain amount of time that you must have lived in the property to establish it was your residency. We own a buy to let and should we decide to sell capital gains tax Will have to be paid as we have never lived in the property. Eventhough we live permanently in the Philippines I am still required to submit a self assesmemt return every year, due to rental income and investments.

Reguarding purchase of a condo, in my opinion it is not a good investment. Better put your money in a time deposit, we get 3.75% interest and can very the time of maturity from as Little as 30 days ( Eastwest Bank). Similarly you could ivest in Philippine Government bonds although the rate of interest is not good at the moment. The last bonds we bought had a 4.1% yeild.

Renting out condos is not easy, the market is saturated. Any rent would have to take into account the Service charge, which could be high. Should you wish to sell a condo it is very difficult to sell used units as there are so many new units being built. My advice would be to spent a long period of time in the Philippines, listen and learn how things are done, then make a decision. Above all take your time, I have made mistakes by being to hasty, and impatient.

David Mashael Dec 11th 2019 6:48 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by nonthaburi (Post 12746917)
How much money are you looking to invest in the Philippines and what's your expected return?

Have you considered buying property in the UK and renting it out? Might be a while lot easier and less hassle, and it's yours.

Do you have a degree? If you do aTESOLcert there are plenty of Chinese companies out there for teaching online that will pull in a couple of thousand dollars a month without too much difficulty.

That wasn't my experience in London. I had 2 apartments in Docklands, and in 2 years I never made a penny. Even assuming you can find decent tenants it's an uphill struggle. They were both rented out furnished, one of them was brand new with all new furniture and appliances, but that didn't stop claims from the tenants each and every month claiming that something or other had stopped working. Was always having to pay plumbers and electricians bills, and by the time I'd paid the management fees and income tax, it just wasn't worth it. Plus the sheer hassle was driving me nuts.

mikek1 Dec 11th 2019 7:02 am

Re: Income suggestions
 

Originally Posted by David Mashael (Post 12777058)
That wasn't my experience in London. I had 2 apartments in Docklands, and in 2 years I never made a penny. Even assuming you can find decent tenants it's an uphill struggle. They were both rented out furnished, one of them was brand new with all new furniture and appliances, but that didn't stop claims from the tenants each and every month claiming that something or other had stopped working. Was always having to pay plumbers and electricians bills, and by the time I'd paid the management fees and income tax, it just wasn't worth it. Plus the sheer hassle was driving me nuts.

i have to agree, although in 15 years my apartment has only been empty 1 month ( I asked the tennant to leave). There have been various maintainence problems, usually small although a new boiler to conform with new regulations was not cheap. The main problem now is the reduction in tax relief of the mortgage interest.
Unfortunatly, I may have to sell the apartment next year because my state pension is due then. The state pension, investments, and the profit on the rental income will mean I will be way over the tax free allowance and will have to pay tax.

EwanD Dec 16th 2019 3:58 pm

Re: Income suggestions
 
The whole tax issue is a lot to think about. However that has cleared one thing up, not having to deal with UK taxes if I;m not living here anymore. Also, thank you for the investment ideas as it would be a good option, although i would prefer to look into that whilst living there and settled.


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