Now leaving NZ

Old Nov 2nd 2010, 3:09 am
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Smile Now leaving NZ

Hi all - we moved here in 2005. I am a research scientist and left Oxford to fill the skills shortage in NZ. Unfortunately there really is no science or skills shortage in NZ and so we are off. Nowhere is perfect and everywhere is different. There are things we will miss but if you cannot earn a decent living then there is no point in being in NZ. Earning only $50k a year for advanced medical research going into clinical trial is no good. The people I work with tell me that $50k is a good salary. Most people outside of my work in NZ think it is a poor salary! May be we will return one day but at the moment the UK, USA, Canada and Europe beckon.
< wee snip here - please place in classifieds>
We are looking forward to relatives, good roads, historic buildings, castles, warm sunny hols, twice the annual leave you get in NZ and more than twice the salary with much lower living costs. We'll continue jet skiing and scuba diving when we leave.

Last edited by BEVS; Nov 9th 2010 at 1:18 am. Reason: No advertising on the open forums.Sorry. You can place in the classifieds and then link to your sig.
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Old Nov 3rd 2010, 6:01 am
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Good luck with your relocation, hope you find your place in the world. Bevissa
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Old Nov 3rd 2010, 6:24 am
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Default Re: Now leaving NZ

Originally Posted by scubadoo
Hi all - we moved here in 2005. I am a research scientist and left Oxford to fill the skills shortage in NZ. Unfortunately there really is no science or skills shortage in NZ and so we are off. Nowhere is perfect and everywhere is different. There are things we will miss but if you cannot earn a decent living then there is no point in being in NZ. Earning only $50k a year for advanced medical research going into clinical trial is no good. The people I work with tell me that $50k is a good salary. Most people outside of my work in NZ think it is a poor salary! May be we will return one day but at the moment the UK, USA, Canada and Europe beckon. We have a good 265sqm, 5 bedroom, 2 bathroom, 2 living area house here. Fully central heated with double glazing. It is very warm and dry, everybody says it is very English. We would not be able to afford this in the UK but, on my salary in NZ, then we can't really afford it here either! We also have a 5 acre section with decent costal views. Unfortunately all this will have to be sold to return to the UK. There are TradeMe ads if anybody is interested: http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/List...x?id=325599088
The estate agent is also about to start marketing. We are looking forward to relatives, good roads, historic buildings, castles, warm sunny hols, twice the annual leave you get in NZ and more than twice the salary with much lower living costs. We'll continue jet skiing and scuba diving when we leave.
$50k for what you do is shite as you well know!! Over 3 years ago I was working for the council in a fairly lowish key post (needing no quals) and I was on about $47k pro rata full time. Even then I did not think that was much..but what you are doing in 2010 for $50k???? WTF springs to mind. In this country unless you have a very 'special' job the pay really is crap.
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Old Nov 3rd 2010, 7:52 am
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Default Re: Now leaving NZ

When you say research scientist I presume you hold a PhD and are not a research technician? What is your research in down in Dunedin? Good luck with the relocation by the way...
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Old Nov 3rd 2010, 8:15 am
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Default Re: Now leaving NZ

Hi Stormer999 - I see you have a Honda Blackbird image Avitar, I assume you ride. I had a Blackbird until 2005 when we left England. I did have an ST1300 here for a year but have just sold it. Not too happy about that!!
I work for the Spinal Cord Society NZ. I have been isolating, culturing and characterizing adult multipotent stromal cells (ie 'Stem cells'). We are due to have a clinical trial going ahead fairly soon based on the previous work of Carlos Lima in Portugal. Used to have sabbaticals at Yale, Harvard etc with international conferences all fully funded. I have had nothing in NZ and this will continue until I leave. Simply much better science, equipment and funding elsewhere in the world.
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Old Nov 3rd 2010, 9:47 am
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Default Re: Now leaving NZ

Hi scubadoo Yes I ride a 2002 model which I have had now for 5 years so as you have owned a Bird then I need say no more... I do like the Pan a fantastic mile gobbler and in the right hands a bike that will show clean heels to most.
Wifey will be our ticket into NZ round about Aug 2011 she is a Clinical Scientist and is just Applying for registration as a Medical Laboratory Scientist with NZ authorities. Her interest in host-pathogen interactions led her to complete a PhD on the immune responses to colonising bacteria in the respiratory tract of patients with chronic lung disease. Further work in this field involved investigations of T-cell responses to respiratory pathogens and studies of respiratory epithelial cell cytokine responses to bacterial cell wall components.
She has gained experience in a wide range of immunological and microbiological techniques and has supervised a variety of undergraduate and postgraduate students through part or all of their projects.
The shocking pay scale that you are on makes it very clear to us that we will not be contemplating a move without a satisfactory job offer though after a lot of research we will be expecting to pay financially for our move to NZ.
She did spend some time in Buffalo NY a time back and said the finances available for medical research in the USA made us Brits look like cave men!....worth considering?
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Old Nov 3rd 2010, 11:33 am
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Default Re: Now leaving NZ

Hi - thanks for the comments. Yes I had a 2003 Blackbird until we left in 2005. The performance is no use in NZ, especially in the South. Legal speeds are low and the roads horrendous! With the UK liability system contracters, councils etc are liable if they leave the road surface in poor condition leading to an accident. In NZ tons of stones strewn across the road are the norm, no liability. You can't go anywhere without finding the road removed and loose stones left where the tarmac was a week before. Pays to take great care on NZ roads. Still I've had no accidents in 20 years of riding, touch wood.
I used to work with Sir Walter Bodmer at WIMM Oxford. You can google him, we did a good but of immunological work and illiciting T-cell respose to tumour etc. His wife Lady Julia Bodmer was one of the pioneers in the field of HLA. Medical Laboratory Scientists generally tend to have higher pay in NZ than those in academic research, I guess this is often the case. I have been fully designing and validating PCR's for nearly 20 years but could not get a job running routine molecular diagnostic tests here because I am not a Med Lab Scientist. They employed a Med Lab Scientist with no experience or expertise in PCR. Go figure! Hope the move goes well. If we can offer any assistance or advice just shout.
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Old Nov 3rd 2010, 11:40 am
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Wink Re: Now leaving NZ

PS - you can take a look at another expat site for a different point of view on NZ. Google expats exposed. The more info you have the better your decision will be. We found it near impossible to get a balanced view of NZ immigration before we left the UK. We are not returning to the UK for ever but I can sped some more time at Oxford or cambridge and then head to US/Canada etc. Maybe I'll head back to NZ in the future when I've progressed my career a bit further. Also considering retraining as a Radiographer. A 2 year accelerated course supported by NHS. Gives me another string to my bow, always useful.
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Old Nov 3rd 2010, 11:53 am
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Thanks for the help scubadoo.. Will be selling the Bird and the wife's VTec VFR before we depart and are both looking at Triumph Street Triples for NZ but we are heading (work deciding) for the North Island. Good luck with your life plan......p.s lovely house...
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Old Nov 3rd 2010, 7:46 pm
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Having given NZ a try (not for as long as you tho') we have now settled back here in UK....more contented, more appreciative of all our home land has to offer and more able to take the rough with the smooth, we got the 'if only' and what if's' out of our system!
Still absolutely love NZ and know how hard your decision to return must have been, good luck and thank goodness the UK is still able to attract scientist who do research that is important for all of us.....even if you head off to 'greener grass' at some point!
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Old Nov 3rd 2010, 8:07 pm
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Red face Re: Now leaving NZ

Hi MnB,
thanks for the comments. We are not in England yet but like you we feel that we will be much more appreciative and accomodating of England when we return. We know what to expect when we get back, unlike moving to NZ where the facts are very different from the propoganda you are fed as a skilled migrant. Even extensive research and a few trips cannot fully prepare you for the facts of living in NZ.
For all the issues in the UK, which continue, it is still one of the best Countries (If not the best) in the world. There are reasons that so many flock to England from around the world, it is a leading light. No, it is far from perfect but better than most. NZ is certainly not the best Country in the world, as the kiwis keep trying to force down my throat. England is mature enough to take constructive critisism on the chin and English will agree with many criticisms. However kiwis will not hear or accept any criticism, no matter how small or constructive. See no evil, Hear no evil, Speak no evil. Everything is rosey in paradise. This is not productive! It is a false image and not real!
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Old Nov 3rd 2010, 10:55 pm
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Default Re: Now leaving NZ

Originally Posted by scubadoo
Hi MnB,
thanks for the comments. We are not in England yet but like you we feel that we will be much more appreciative and accomodating of England when we return. We know what to expect when we get back, unlike moving to NZ where the facts are very different from the propoganda you are fed as a skilled migrant. Even extensive research and a few trips cannot fully prepare you for the facts of living in NZ.
For all the issues in the UK, which continue, it is still one of the best Countries (If not the best) in the world. There are reasons that so many flock to England from around the world, it is a leading light. No, it is far from perfect but better than most. NZ is certainly not the best Country in the world, as the kiwis keep trying to force down my throat. England is mature enough to take constructive critisism on the chin and English will agree with many criticisms. However kiwis will not hear or accept any criticism, no matter how small or constructive. See no evil, Hear no evil, Speak no evil. Everything is rosey in paradise. This is not productive! It is a false image and not real!
IMO NZ is probably along with Oz one of the best places to bring up young kids. I miss much of the UK but really prefer that they have their formative years here. Kids seem to be kids longer here and have less crappy peer pressure re all that trainer, clothing et al crap that seems rife in the UK.

NZ has many, many burning issues and as a country generally I am not sure its that good per se but for kids it is awesome. No doubts that UK is an amazing place. It is just so stupidly overcrowded.
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Old Nov 3rd 2010, 11:30 pm
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Default Re: Now leaving NZ

Originally Posted by Genesis
IMO NZ is probably along with Oz one of the best places to bring up young kids. I miss much of the UK but really prefer that they have their formative years here. Kids seem to be kids longer here and have less crappy peer pressure re all that trainer, clothing et al crap that seems rife in the UK.

NZ has many, many burning issues and as a country generally I am not sure its that good per se but for kids it is awesome. No doubts that UK is an amazing place. It is just so stupidly overcrowded.
Don't totally disagree with you Genesis, fortunately our kids grew up in rural Somerset when peer pressure re trainer's, clothing et al crap was not an issue. They spent their formative years having the sort of lifestyle that would rival today's NZ child and which is (from talking to colleagues) less available now.
Had we been younger and our 'kids' come with us, I know the lifestyle on offer for today's NZ kids would have been a reason for us to stay.
The density of population is an issue here (UK) but you can 'get away from the masses! for the last few weekends we've had some brilliant walks on local moors, hills and beaches without meeting more than 3 or 4 other people....OH did comment 'are we still in NZ?', not only because there were so few people about but because those that were all greeted us
Absolutely!!..the UK is an amazing place and I'm indebted to NZ for the discovery of roots I didn't know I had!
Hope you have a good trip back (soon, I think?)......pm me if you're likely to be passing, I'll get the jug on!!!
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Old Nov 3rd 2010, 11:41 pm
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Unhappy Re: Now leaving NZ

I can only sympathise scubadoo. The mood amongst expats is changing now and it’s difficult to see how New Zealand can improve its quality of life without addressing some issues.

Good luck wherever you travel, come back and visit us sometimes .
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Old Nov 4th 2010, 12:11 am
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Default Re: Now leaving NZ

Originally Posted by Charismatic
I can only sympathise scubadoo. The mood amongst expats is changing now and it’s difficult to see how New Zealand can improve its quality of life without addressing some issues.

Good luck wherever you travel, come back and visit us sometimes .
NZ ain't the place it was. I have seen it slide in my 5 years. If my kids were grown up I may well be out of here. But where next?? I want peace and quiet and low density pop. NZ is sooooooooooo far from addressing them issues. Spineless administration. That is why I will not vote. They are mostly a shower!!
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