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What is REALLY uncool about NZ

What is REALLY uncool about NZ

Old Nov 28th 2010, 6:42 am
  #136  
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Default Re: What is REALLY uncool about NZ

Originally Posted by BEVS
Do you know. I have absolutely no idea what your post means.

If it is in reference to my post , then I will repeat. We have been forced to take leave to cover quiet times for the employer (s). We are now faced with the compulsory shut down over the Christmas period for which there will be no pay. We can't do anything with this 2 weeks which will be without pay ,other than to retrench and try to not spend anything. Now, I can quite see the ' look there are loads of free things ' type posts building up to this, but hey, trips cost petrol. Camping needs to be got to & paid for. Food needs to be bought. Bills need to be paid. and it is all at the most expensive time when it is crowded. Nil points.

We need for my husband to go back to the UK to visit his 83 year old Mum. It's a trade off , to be sure, for the move here and being allowed to use the holiday accrual would have helped this , but the employer dictates when days off will be taken . Not us !
Those could well be in short 3 or 4 day working weeks over winter. Not a week or 2 week period. .So. If he goes back, then that will be more unpaid leave. As we live week to week with no built up savings , this time it will be go into debt to achieve this.
there are two many people , who move to nz expecting it to be like uk and if not why not, people keep on about migrants coming to uk should speak English, but they don't most people know about nz shut down at xmas if they didn't they never done there research properly,
whats wrong with taking your holiday pay at xmas theres so many thing appealing about nz a lot of people are trying to change that why move in the first place, and no this quote was not about you just in general
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Old Nov 28th 2010, 7:56 am
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Default Re: What is REALLY uncool about NZ

Originally Posted by BEVS
As we live week to week with no built up savings
IME, this is the one really really uncool thing about NZ.

Originally Posted by concretepump
whats wrong with taking your holiday pay at xmas theres so many thing appealing about nz a lot of people are trying to change that why move in the first place
Two things:
1) It's lovely that you enjoy taking your much earned AL over Xmas but it shouldn't be mandatory to.
2) When we move here and make NZ home that doesn't mean we just have to "put up and shut up" to integrate. I'm never just going to shrug my shoulders and say "when in Rome" about the suicide rate, the loony drivers, the domestic violence rates, the health-wealth inequality along cultural lines and so on. That doesn't make me less of a citizen of NZ, it makes me more of one This is my home, I'm entitled to want to be part of its inevitable growth and change- I haven't moved here to shackle NZ to my dream of a bygone utopia.
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Old Nov 28th 2010, 9:45 am
  #138  
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Default Re: What is REALLY uncool about NZ

Originally Posted by bourbon-biscuit
IME, this is the one really really uncool thing about NZ.



Two things:
1) It's lovely that you enjoy taking your much earned AL over Xmas but it shouldn't be mandatory to.
2) When we move here and make NZ home that doesn't mean we just have to "put up and shut up" to integrate. I'm never just going to shrug my shoulders and say "when in Rome" about the suicide rate, the loony drivers, the domestic violence rates, the health-wealth inequality along cultural lines and so on. That doesn't make me less of a citizen of NZ, it makes me more of one This is my home, I'm entitled to want to be part of its inevitable growth and change- I haven't moved here to shackle NZ to my dream of a bygone utopia.
there are two different cultures between the to countries, there were things that attracted you to nz , which is why your there, but you cant change one countries cultures, for your own my point is people go to different places then complain its not the same as where they came from, i have no problem about people trying for a better life ,
nz has always shut down over xmas and the jan, and i don't think that will change all the things you mentioned in your post we still have in uk
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Old Nov 28th 2010, 2:23 pm
  #139  
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Default Re: What is REALLY uncool about NZ

You know if you can make a business case for more flexible leave taking then make it, but using words like 'unfair' 'should' 'shouldn't' won't sway any kiwi business manager and nor should it. Kiwi managers are no less interested in making a buck than anyone else so if you can demonstrate the advantages of staying open over Christmas when everyone else is on holiday then I'm sure they'll listen. Might not be so popular with your colleagues though, most of whom are not expats and not interested in taking long trips to Britain, and managers will of course need to take into account the needs of ALL their employees, not just you.

I remember arriving in the UK a fresh faced kiwi, and being very surprised at how Brits seemed to expect their employers and their Government to look after them. It seemed almost feudal to me. This is part of the social contract you have in the UK that you don't have in NZ. There are different social contracts in NZ and no doubt local people appreciate the benefits they accrue from these. It may be a way forward to observe your kiwi colleagues and see how they cope with the trauma of such 'unfairness'. One of the things I don't like about the social contract in the UK is the degree to which you are expected to give allegiance to the organisation. You'll find this less so in NZ. Is this good or bad? Neither probably. Just different, and it takes a bit of getting used to.
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Old Nov 28th 2010, 9:30 pm
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Default Re: What is REALLY uncool about NZ

Originally Posted by concretepump
whats wrong with taking your holiday pay at xmas
Nothing at all if you have holiday pay to take and that is what you choose to do with it.

It is not just expats that struggle with this you know. Many Kiwi's have family living overseas and find the same difficulty vice versa. They wish to use their paid holiday entitlement to help with visiting relatives but are unable to use this because the employer has dictated when that time off will be taken. That means they need to find more $$$ from somewhere and on a kiwi wage that can be very hard to do.

This is about choice. The OH's standard NZ employment contract states 20 days paid holiday a year. It does not state that this must be taken when the employer dictates but that is what happens. Reminds me of the 1960's /1970's when I started work. Factories had an annual shutdown and you took that holiday then and at no other time. Difference being that at least you had accrued pay to cover that period.
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Old Nov 29th 2010, 3:14 am
  #141  
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Default Re: What is REALLY uncool about NZ

Originally Posted by Expat Kiwi
Londonescapee have you ever driven up Ruapehu in a white out in winter?

You should give it a go some day.

(does anyone drive a Metro in NZ?)
I've driven round quite a few mountain roads both here and in North America in a whiteout. This isn't my first trip to NZ. Didn't phase us too much apart from getting a bit of a headache concentrating. I'd say the North American experience was far worse as we were miles away from anywhere remotely resembling civilsation. And actually, come to think of it, driving in the States was far far worse than anything I've experienced here.

Last edited by londonescapee; Nov 29th 2010 at 3:18 am.
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Old Nov 29th 2010, 3:26 am
  #142  
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Default Re: What is REALLY uncool about NZ

Originally Posted by jmh
Might not be so popular with your colleagues though, most of whom are not expats and not interested in taking long trips to Britain, and managers will of course need to take into account the needs of ALL their employees, not just you.
If that were the case then they would realise how much money they are losing out on by shutting down for such an extended period of time whilst the rest of the world is, erm, working Also it's not just us complaining about it at work, many of my Kiwi colleagues are furious as well at losing over a half of our annual leave entitlement at the most expensive time of year to go away at. NZ is at risk of being stuck in the dark ages whilst the rest of the world moves on, if this is the rate of change in employment law.

Originally Posted by jmh
I remember arriving in the UK a fresh faced kiwi, and being very surprised at how Brits seemed to expect their employers and their Government to look after them. It seemed almost feudal to me. This is part of the social contract you have in the UK that you don't have in NZ.
I couldn't disagree more. I just sat through a session at work on a proposed renumeration strategy and well over half the employees there seemed to think that it was their right to be employed by the company and that the sole purpose of being for my employer was to provide them, as individuals, with a job (not to say this doesn't happen in the UK of course, but I have never seen it so blatantly before). I was seriously surprised and asked around. Feedback from colleagues in my sector, and also in the corporate world suggests that people think they join somewhere and are entitled for a job for life. It's a massive problem here in NZ and it is VERY difficult to get rid of people here as well if they are underperforming, much harder than in the UK.

Last edited by londonescapee; Nov 29th 2010 at 3:40 am.
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Old Nov 29th 2010, 9:55 am
  #143  
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Default Re: What is REALLY uncool about NZ

You may see it as under performing, they may just see it as normal. Working practices are different in the two countries, most people move to NZ because of the slower pace of life - that applies in the workplace as much as anywhere else. Perhaps you need to step down a gear or two?

It may help to look at it this way - those people are working, paying their taxes and contributing. Thousands of others in New Zealand are very content to sit back their whole lives and live off the benefits you pay for.

If that were the case then they would realise how much money they are losing out on by shutting down for such an extended period of time whilst the rest of the world is, erm, working Also it's not just us complaining about it at work, many of my Kiwi colleagues are furious as well at losing over a half of our annual leave entitlement at the most expensive time of year to go away at. NZ is at risk of being stuck in the dark ages whilst the rest of the world moves on, if this is the rate of change in employment law.
They can't be that furious or they'd be voting with their feet. They will work the system to their advantage and use sick leave over the coming year to make up for what they feel they've lost

Saying that NZ is stuck in the dark ages made me laugh!! did they have paid leave back then?

Last edited by Expat Kiwi; Nov 29th 2010 at 10:03 am.
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Old Nov 29th 2010, 9:51 pm
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Default Re: What is REALLY uncool about NZ

Originally Posted by Expat Kiwi

They will work the system to their advantage and use sick leave over the coming year to make up for what they feel they've lost

That's just so true.
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Old Nov 30th 2010, 3:29 am
  #145  
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Default Re: What is REALLY uncool about NZ

I think also Genesis that letting a 15yr old behind the wheel of a car is like giving them a loaded gun i have been in NZ 35yrs now and i still cannot believe the age has never been raised esp when they can drive these souped up things that just about scrape the road they are so low....

Also when buying a car dont you think a drivers licence should be produced?I know of a young lady (aged 20) who went and bought herself a car..... has owned 3 cars been caught once already for driving with no licence which also means she has no insurance and just thinks its funny.....Drove past her dad waving the other day they just think they are so invincible it truly is ridiclous....OK rant over ive had a glass on wine so i better get down off my soap box now b4 i fall off lol.....

Originally Posted by Genesis
The road deaths. This weekend just gone 13 people are dead. A pregnant woman amongst them and 2 cyclists, all taken out by idiots on the wrong side of the road. It is IMO the worst, worst thing about NZ. It could touch any of us whereas all the other shit that abounds you can dodge and are most likely to find a way round it. But driving is summat we all have to do and no matter how carefully you drive there is always the chance some pissed up, speeding bastard could kill you, your partner or worse your kids. On the same day these figs were announced our roading minister flatly refuses to drop our high alco/blood levels citing that it will make no difference. That is utter, utter bollocks. A load of international research came out last month proving the opposite. He said "what if we lower it and nothing happens?" So ******* what????? At least it is worth a try. It surely ain't going to increase deaths is it???? They are simply worried about losing votes. Another reason I will never vote for any politician ever again. I think they are all out for themselves, have their own agendas and are not interested in my safety or yours. Stuff 'em. Does any one have anything they consider less cool??
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Old Nov 30th 2010, 4:02 am
  #146  
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Default Re: What is REALLY uncool about NZ

Originally Posted by Expat Kiwi
Saying that NZ is stuck in the dark ages made me laugh!! did they have paid leave back then?
Only just introducing a probation period? I'd say that's pretty out of date in terms of employment law when compared to other western nations.

The chopping and changing around of annual leave law is just nuts. As others have said. So you may 'laugh' at my analogy - I don't see you living over here trying to improve things and make the system better.......it's all so easy to preach at others to not complain when you aren't living it day to day.

Originally Posted by Expat Kiwi
You may see it as under performing, they may just see it as normal. Working practices are different in the two countries, most people move to NZ because of the slower pace of life - that applies in the workplace as much as anywhere else. Perhaps you need to step down a gear or two?
Why thank you for making a sweeping judgement on how I live my life based on a couple of posts on a forum. You don't know what I do for a living and what pressures I might be under in the workplace - but all that aside I can assure you that the attitudes of most of the people I work with are totally professional and people work very very hard. Sometimes harder than what I experienced in the UK.

Not got much of an opinion of your fellow countrymen have you?

Originally Posted by Expat Kiwi
It may help to look at it this way - those people are working, paying their taxes and contributing. Thousands of others in New Zealand are very content to sit back their whole lives and live off the benefits you pay for.
So what's new. That happens in the UK. It's flaws within the system. Would you prefer to see a return to the 'dark ages' in that case? Are you perchance a devotee of the Daily Mail?

In the grand scheme of things the employment law is hardly the worst thing in the world. Life here is pretty cool.

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Old Nov 30th 2010, 4:25 am
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Default Re: What is REALLY uncool about NZ

Originally Posted by BEVS
That's just so true.
Then that's a fault of the system and not necessarily of the person. The sick leave thing is very strange.
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Old Nov 30th 2010, 5:23 am
  #148  
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Default Re: What is REALLY uncool about NZ

Originally Posted by Browner_
The drivers , drunk or otherwise. It is truely frightening out there.

The cars, modified peices of junk driving by spotty teens with a serious bad attitude.

Boy racers who think its essential to make their car 20 times as loud as normal.

Drivers who think that speeding away from police is the norm, and regularly kill some innocent sod.

A police system that tolerates all the above.
Complete lack of any justice system.

The locals - serious lack of conversation, humour, comaraderie and culture. If it wasnt for the immigrants, it would be absolutely dire here.

The remoteness and complete lack of anywhere worth visiting after you have been here more than 6 months.

The "pubs'. The best ones are like the worst ones in UK, and there arent many of them at that.

The houses. Overpriced pieces of leaky and cold junk, for the most part.

The dress sense. Ha what a laugh.
True about the remoteness but you knew that before you came. Likewise the pubs. Dress sense? Unless you're in a large UK city there is no dress sense there either. I do agree about the crime tolerance though, way too lenient
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Old Nov 30th 2010, 5:24 am
  #149  
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Default Re: What is REALLY uncool about NZ

[QUOTE=Amazulu;8991654]The fact that NZ is a borderline 3rd world country is really uncool.[/QUOTE
Rubbish!!!]
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Old Nov 30th 2010, 5:35 am
  #150  
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Default Re: What is REALLY uncool about NZ

Originally Posted by BEVS
Reminds me of the 1960's /1970's when I started work. Factories had an annual shutdown and you took that holiday then and at no other time. Difference being that at least you had accrued pay to cover that period.
LOL NZ=1950s timewarp theory....a good example.
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