Stupid immigration situation
Mar 17th 2014, 12:36 am
#1
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Joined: May 2008
Location: Up in dem hills.........
Posts: 1,458
Stupid immigration situation
We have are PR and been living in NZ for ten years now. Recently my wife's passport expired, she is a Finnish citizen and as part of their passport renewal process, she has to make a application in person, you cant send it off by post.
The problem is, there is no Finnish consulate in NZ, the nearest is in Canberra.
So apart from the monumental pain in arse it is to fly to Canberra to get a new passport, plus all the expenses. We have now been told by Immigration NZ, that she would have to get her residency visa transferred, before she re enters NZ! So now the process would potentially take four weeks!!!!!!!
Despite phone calls to Immigration and to Customs, no one will tell me common sense will prevail, instead I have been told that she may or may not, be sent back at the border unless her PR is in her new passport.
ARRGGHHHHH!
Stand by for updates.
The problem is, there is no Finnish consulate in NZ, the nearest is in Canberra.
So apart from the monumental pain in arse it is to fly to Canberra to get a new passport, plus all the expenses. We have now been told by Immigration NZ, that she would have to get her residency visa transferred, before she re enters NZ! So now the process would potentially take four weeks!!!!!!!
Despite phone calls to Immigration and to Customs, no one will tell me common sense will prevail, instead I have been told that she may or may not, be sent back at the border unless her PR is in her new passport.
ARRGGHHHHH!
Stand by for updates.
Mar 17th 2014, 12:58 am
#2
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 34,649
Re: Stupid immigration situation
Perhaps it would be simpler to apply for New Zealand citizenship (if eligible), then get a New Zealand passport?
Mar 18th 2014, 9:02 pm
#3
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Joined: May 2008
Location: Up in dem hills.........
Posts: 1,458
Re: Stupid immigration situation
Yes it would be, but takes about six months.
Sadly her grandmother is unlikely to last that long, so this is the situation we are in.
Sadly her grandmother is unlikely to last that long, so this is the situation we are in.
Mar 18th 2014, 10:39 pm
#4
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 38,611
Re: Stupid immigration situation
Rats! I did mull this around a little but came up with precisely nothing useful.
Mrs Catchafire should have the residency visa transferred to the new passport BUT I can't see why a *note can't be placed within the electronic system that application is in process. So, that could be seen back here at the NZ end.
I'll move this to the main NZ forum.
Mrs Catchafire should have the residency visa transferred to the new passport BUT I can't see why a *note can't be placed within the electronic system that application is in process. So, that could be seen back here at the NZ end.
I'll move this to the main NZ forum.
Mar 18th 2014, 11:22 pm
#5
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Joined: Oct 2009
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Posts: 3,312
Re: Stupid immigration situation
Can't she come back on a six month visitors visa ?
Mar 18th 2014, 11:34 pm
#6
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Re: Stupid immigration situation
And then what happens to her permanent resident status??
I doubt anyone on a forum is likely to know the answer as to whether a new permanent visa stamp is mandatory to re-enter New Zealand as a permanent resident, or just recommended. And since advice from the government over the phone is normally useless, the only reasonable step seems to be to find a competent New Zealand immigration lawyer and pay for some advice in writing. And availability if necessary if problems occur when trying to re-enter New Zealand.
So how long is she going to have to spend in Australia? Unless the Finnish Embassy can give her a temporary passport to travel back to New Zealand while her full passport application is being processed. And if they take away the old one (to accompany the application for the new one), which will have her existing evidence of permanent residence, that also could be a problem.
Forcing people to physically cross a border to renew a passport makes life very difficult for those without an alternative citizenship/passport, and the blame for this lies entirely with the Finnish government.
I doubt anyone on a forum is likely to know the answer as to whether a new permanent visa stamp is mandatory to re-enter New Zealand as a permanent resident, or just recommended. And since advice from the government over the phone is normally useless, the only reasonable step seems to be to find a competent New Zealand immigration lawyer and pay for some advice in writing. And availability if necessary if problems occur when trying to re-enter New Zealand.
So how long is she going to have to spend in Australia? Unless the Finnish Embassy can give her a temporary passport to travel back to New Zealand while her full passport application is being processed. And if they take away the old one (to accompany the application for the new one), which will have her existing evidence of permanent residence, that also could be a problem.
Forcing people to physically cross a border to renew a passport makes life very difficult for those without an alternative citizenship/passport, and the blame for this lies entirely with the Finnish government.
Last edited by JAJ; Mar 18th 2014 at 11:38 pm.
Mar 18th 2014, 11:41 pm
#7
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Posts: 34,649
Re: Stupid immigration situation
Either way, it's probably recommended to apply for New Zealand citizenship straight away. Sometimes actual processing times vary from posted targets.
Last edited by JAJ; Mar 18th 2014 at 11:52 pm.
Mar 18th 2014, 11:44 pm
#8
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Joined: Dec 2007
Location: In NZ!
Posts: 4,785
Re: Stupid immigration situation
Ok, this is what the operational manual says:
Look under Border entry.
Best of luck C
Edit: the iPad hasn't copied the numbering system so it might be easier to read if you go here: http://www.immigration.govt.nz/opsmanual/index.htm click on border entry and look for section Y3.45
Look under Border entry.
Y3.45 People with expired resident visa (including expired returning resident’s visas (RRVs) issued under the Immigration Act 1987)
See also Immigration (Visa, Entry Permission, and Related Matters) Regulations 2010, reg 6
A person who has previously held a resident visa will be referred to an immigration officer on arrival in New Zealand, whether or not they appear to meet the requirements for entry as a resident, if their resident visa has expired.
Note: an RRV of limited duration issued under the Immigration Act 1987 is deemed to be a resident visa allowing travel to New Zealand for an unlimited number of journeys valid until the date of expiry of the RRV.
Note: Under section 63 (2) of the Immigration Act 2009, the date a resident visa expires is the earlier of:
~ the day and time the holder left New Zealand, if the visa has no travel conditions allowing further travel to New Zealand;
~ the beginning of the day after the date that is specified by the travel conditions of the visa as the last day of the period of time within which travel is allowed to New Zealand.
If the person's foreign passport shows that they have held a resident visa, an appropriately delegated officer may :
give a special direction under regulation 34 of the Immigration (Visa, Entry Permission, and Related Matters) Regulations 2010 to waive any requirements for entry permission, if necessary; and
grant a resident visa, if the officer determines that the principal applicant:
would have met the criteria to be granted a variation of travel conditions had they applied for it on the date their resident visa expired and those travel conditions would still be valid on the date the application for a second or subsequent resident visa was made; or
would have met the criteria to be granted a permanent resident visa had they applied for it on the date their resident visa expired and that date was less than 24 months before the date the application for a second or subsequent resident visa is made.
If the person is not eligible for a resident visa, the officer may grant a one month temporary visa.
If the person's passport does not show that they have held a resident visa but the person claims to have been a New Zealand resident, an immigration officer must establish whether the person has in fact been a resident and held a resident visa.
If the officer clearly establishes that the person has been a resident and held a resident visa then they may permit the person entry under (b) above.
If the officer cannot clearly establish whether the person has been a resident and held a resident visa but is satisfied that the person is more likely than not to have been a resident and held a resident visa the officer may:
give a special direction under regulation 34 of the Immigration (Visa, Entry Permission, and Related Matters) Regulations 2010 to waive any entry
grant a one month temporary visa.
If the officer cannot clearly establish whether the person has been a resident and held a resident visa and is not satisfied that the person is more likely than not to have been a resident and held a resident visa the officer may:
grant a one month temporary visa, if the person meets the requirements for a temporary visa; or
refuse entry under section 107 of the Immigration Act 2009, if the person does not meet the requirements for a temporary visa.
A person who is granted entry under (b) or (e) above must be advised that, in order to facilitate future travel to New Zealand they must apply for further travel conditions on their resident visa or a permanent resident visa.
See also Immigration (Visa, Entry Permission, and Related Matters) Regulations 2010, reg 6
A person who has previously held a resident visa will be referred to an immigration officer on arrival in New Zealand, whether or not they appear to meet the requirements for entry as a resident, if their resident visa has expired.
Note: an RRV of limited duration issued under the Immigration Act 1987 is deemed to be a resident visa allowing travel to New Zealand for an unlimited number of journeys valid until the date of expiry of the RRV.
Note: Under section 63 (2) of the Immigration Act 2009, the date a resident visa expires is the earlier of:
~ the day and time the holder left New Zealand, if the visa has no travel conditions allowing further travel to New Zealand;
~ the beginning of the day after the date that is specified by the travel conditions of the visa as the last day of the period of time within which travel is allowed to New Zealand.
If the person's foreign passport shows that they have held a resident visa, an appropriately delegated officer may :
give a special direction under regulation 34 of the Immigration (Visa, Entry Permission, and Related Matters) Regulations 2010 to waive any requirements for entry permission, if necessary; and
grant a resident visa, if the officer determines that the principal applicant:
would have met the criteria to be granted a variation of travel conditions had they applied for it on the date their resident visa expired and those travel conditions would still be valid on the date the application for a second or subsequent resident visa was made; or
would have met the criteria to be granted a permanent resident visa had they applied for it on the date their resident visa expired and that date was less than 24 months before the date the application for a second or subsequent resident visa is made.
If the person is not eligible for a resident visa, the officer may grant a one month temporary visa.
If the person's passport does not show that they have held a resident visa but the person claims to have been a New Zealand resident, an immigration officer must establish whether the person has in fact been a resident and held a resident visa.
If the officer clearly establishes that the person has been a resident and held a resident visa then they may permit the person entry under (b) above.
If the officer cannot clearly establish whether the person has been a resident and held a resident visa but is satisfied that the person is more likely than not to have been a resident and held a resident visa the officer may:
give a special direction under regulation 34 of the Immigration (Visa, Entry Permission, and Related Matters) Regulations 2010 to waive any entry
grant a one month temporary visa.
If the officer cannot clearly establish whether the person has been a resident and held a resident visa and is not satisfied that the person is more likely than not to have been a resident and held a resident visa the officer may:
grant a one month temporary visa, if the person meets the requirements for a temporary visa; or
refuse entry under section 107 of the Immigration Act 2009, if the person does not meet the requirements for a temporary visa.
A person who is granted entry under (b) or (e) above must be advised that, in order to facilitate future travel to New Zealand they must apply for further travel conditions on their resident visa or a permanent resident visa.
Edit: the iPad hasn't copied the numbering system so it might be easier to read if you go here: http://www.immigration.govt.nz/opsmanual/index.htm click on border entry and look for section Y3.45
Last edited by Persephone; Mar 19th 2014 at 12:02 am. Reason: Clarity as not easy to read :(
Mar 19th 2014, 12:33 am
#9
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Joined: Dec 2010
Location: Manurewa, AKL
Posts: 165
Re: Stupid immigration situation
I had a similar situation with one of the passengers at work earlier this week. He was looking to travel on a new South American passport but hadn't had the PR visa label applied to it so was concerned about being let back in.
He was however also carrying his expired passport with the PR label. After a call to immigration they advised as long as he was still carrying this and able to show on return they would let him in.
(He was also carrying his citizenship certificate as he had just completed the ceremony but hadn't applied for a NZ passport yet)
He was however also carrying his expired passport with the PR label. After a call to immigration they advised as long as he was still carrying this and able to show on return they would let him in.
(He was also carrying his citizenship certificate as he had just completed the ceremony but hadn't applied for a NZ passport yet)
