Riots.

Old Aug 14th 2011, 10:47 pm
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Default Re: Riots.

Originally Posted by Charismatic View Post
Next you’ll be appealing for a reasoned response . Can we not do something about these ghastly poor permanently unemployed people, I’m sure we could outsource this problem to China or send them in lieu of food aid to North Korea?

Honestly though we do need a more permanent solution than water cannon and tear gas, one that breaks the cycle of intergeneration welfare dependence and gets people (especially the young) back on track to being productive members of society . Snuff out the problem at the root now so it isn't a problem later.
The situation over the last week in English towns has created a united disgust of the greed and violence that occurred. There are family members turning in their own family members to the police and friends shopping friends. According to the press this wasn't all about people with nothing protesting by looting and stealing from business owners, there were rich kids doing the same. It seems as if it was seen as a game, fuelled by the ability to use social networking to get people to target specific areas. I don't think the perpetrators ever thought the whole country would be disgusted by them, they thought we would feel sorry for them, they failed - we don't
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Old Aug 14th 2011, 11:23 pm
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Default Re: Riots.

Originally Posted by Charismatic View Post
Yeah...brutality worked on the coal miners and it only took 14 years ('72 - '85):
June didn't mention the other extreme, physical brutality & neither did I.


My Dad was a union man and he went to stand on those picket lines. My Mum was Irish , so both the above you mention were relevant to me and my family.

Last edited by BEVS; Aug 14th 2011 at 11:27 pm.
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Old Aug 14th 2011, 11:33 pm
  #228  
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Default Re: Riots.

Originally Posted by MNandMN View Post
The situation over the last week in English towns has created a united disgust of the greed and violence that occurred. There are family members turning in their own family members to the police and friends shopping friends. According to the press this wasn't all about people with nothing protesting by looting and stealing from business owners, there were rich kids doing the same. It seems as if it was seen as a game, fuelled by the ability to use social networking to get people to target specific areas. I don't think the perpetrators ever thought the whole country would be disgusted by them, they thought we would feel sorry for them, they failed - we don't
Thank heavens for that. Some sense at last from the general public we hope. What is sad about this is that those with genuine need & who wanted to have a voice about their issues, will no longer be properly heard because of the disgraceful behaviour that has ensued.
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Old Aug 14th 2011, 11:39 pm
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Default Re: Riots.

Originally Posted by lardyl View Post
This is funny if you're from Glasgow, it's footage of rioting in Edinburgh:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=N2kC1jMKZco
Just spotted this, had to give Karma as so funny and true no matter where in Scotland your from
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Old Aug 15th 2011, 1:02 am
  #230  
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Default Re: Riots.

Originally Posted by MNandMN View Post
The situation over the last week in English towns has created a united disgust of the greed and violence that occurred. There are family members turning in their own family members to the police and friends shopping friends. According to the press this wasn't all about people with nothing protesting by looting and stealing from business owners, there were rich kids doing the same. It seems as if it was seen as a game, fuelled by the ability to use social networking to get people to target specific areas. I don't think the perpetrators ever thought the whole country would be disgusted by them, they thought we would feel sorry for them, they failed - we don't
See I said it was all bollocks and psychobabble suggesting that this was caused by the haves and have not. Just, nasty greedy shits having it away cos they could. Shame 40 roiters did not die rather than 4 poor innocents souls. Utter bastards the lot of them.
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Old Aug 15th 2011, 10:48 am
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Smile Re: Riots.

Originally Posted by Genesis View Post
See I said it was all bollocks and psychobabble suggesting that this was caused by the haves and have not. Just, nasty greedy shits having it away cos they could. Shame 40 roiters did not die rather than 4 poor innocents souls. Utter bastards the lot of them.
Amongst those arrested it was reported were a teaching assistant, a millionaires daughter and others with jobs, students who were on courses to become, I think, social workers (no hope after being arrested hey!) Some people have ruined their careers by their actions.

There are discussions going on today about removing benefits from those arrested for riot offences - not sure how that would work, but another deterrent.

My husband spoke to a police officer yesterday, who had been deployed to a riot area - when they got back to base in their riot gear after a horrendous night there was a line of people cheering and clapping as they walked back in - the police on the ground did a really good job in horrible circumstances Pretty proud to be British at the moment!
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Old Aug 15th 2011, 11:36 am
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Default Re: Riots.

Originally Posted by MNandMN View Post
Amongst those arrested it was reported were a teaching assistant, a millionaires daughter and others with jobs, students who were on courses to become, I think, social workers (no hope after being arrested hey!) Some people have ruined their careers by their actions.

There are discussions going on today about removing benefits from those arrested for riot offences - not sure how that would work, but another deterrent.

My husband spoke to a police officer yesterday, who had been deployed to a riot area - when they got back to base in their riot gear after a horrendous night there was a line of people cheering and clapping as they walked back in - the police on the ground did a really good job in horrible circumstances Pretty proud to be British at the moment!
Last week was most definately not a week when I was proud to be British, especially not being a Londoner. However, the rallying of the 99% of decent folk cleaning up the mess and uniting against the mindless idiots was some solace. And yes, absolutely agree with the news of the friends and families shopping those they know for the looting also goes to show that the majority were pretty disgusted. I believe it was an example perhaps of a kind of mass hysteria and the absolute belief that they had an opportunity that they thought was too good to miss - what a price they will now pay - and quite rightly so.

I like that story about the police returning to cheers from the general public. I'd not heard that.
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Old Aug 15th 2011, 11:55 am
  #233  
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Default Re: Riots.

Originally Posted by Am Loolah View Post
I like that story about the police returning to cheers from the general public. I'd not heard that.
me neither, now that makes me proud to be British
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Old Aug 15th 2011, 2:05 pm
  #234  
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Default Re: Riots.

Originally Posted by Genesis View Post
Well look why don't we worry every time we put one in prison, they might come out REALLY angry and hurt lots of people?? If the law was passed you are likely to be shot if you riot two things would happen. 1st forewarned is forearmed..rellies would have not much to complain about, 2nd rioting would not happen..well it might once but unlikely to again with a few dead rats in the street for other rats to see.
Or 3, people would still riot and more people would have died? If you are advocating such levels of violent response, its no better than the perpetrators and just escalates the issue. Quite a Dystopian future lies ahead with this line of thinking.

Luckily, on the whole, you are in a more egalitarian society. Issues manifest themselves in different ways in NZ, but they are there alright.

I moved back to the UK 2 weeks ago (great timing). For info, I think a more aggressive response early on would have nipped things in the bud and the vast majority of perptrators (its just pointless rhetoric to call them scum or morons) who were just kids, would have melted away. In my opinion

Personally I am very pleased to be back in the UK, but clearly there is a very imbalanced society in evidence. I don't know what the answer is, but its certainly not capital punishment or shoot on sight.
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Old Aug 15th 2011, 3:47 pm
  #235  
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Default Re: Riots.

As the announcement to-day that 16,000 police are to be 'lost' from the countryside policing, then where will be safe to live in England? Rural police numbers are low already and those enforcement officers left admit they are no match for 'townies' travelling to remote areas to rob. If London rioting kicks off again then where will the "extra" police numbers come from?
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Old Aug 15th 2011, 11:22 pm
  #236  
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Default Re: Riots.

So when Cameron promised the police "whatever they needed" what he actually meant "whatever you need, as long as it costs us less money than yesteryear"? I don't remember one of his "big society" measures including giving people shotguns and bean bag rounds .

IMO they are making a big mistake if only in that when they need to rehire the police it'll be at twice the price with training etc.
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Old Aug 15th 2011, 11:40 pm
  #237  
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Default Re: Riots.

Originally Posted by turkeys View Post
Or 3, people would still riot and more people would have died? If you are advocating such levels of violent response, its no better than the perpetrators and just escalates the issue. Quite a Dystopian future lies ahead with this line of thinking.

Luckily, on the whole, you are in a more egalitarian society. Issues manifest themselves in different ways in NZ, but they are there alright.

I moved back to the UK 2 weeks ago (great timing). For info, I think a more aggressive response early on would have nipped things in the bud and the vast majority of perptrators (its just pointless rhetoric to call them scum or morons) who were just kids, would have melted away. In my opinion

Personally I am very pleased to be back in the UK, but clearly there is a very imbalanced society in evidence. I don't know what the answer is, but its certainly not capital punishment or shoot on sight.
I think that the reason the police were held back was political. I also think it was a ploy by the police leaders to let the rioters have ago and then lets see if you want the decrease our numbers.
So the rioters got what they wanted and the police management got what they wanted.
The police budget presently must be out of sight. I would want a budget for wages for men who are on the beat and a budget for those on desk jobs and then I would like to see whats going for equipment, vans, BMWs, Audis and so on. Saying this another way, what percentage of the funding is going to the policeman who is out on the beat?
Anyone any ideas how much a year a policeman makes in London?
As for this idea for the super cop from the US, that is fantasy. Totally off the wall.
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Old Aug 16th 2011, 12:46 am
  #238  
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Default Re: Riots.

Of course the police held back, they were making a point.

Isn't it strange that the number of officers draughted in to London was exactly the same as the number of officers being cut by the government. What does that mean: does London need 16,000 or 32,000 extra bobbies to keep the peace?

Riots, almost by definition, have political origins, don't let David Cameron pontificating in front of a youth centre's graffited wall tell you differently.

What was is that Nick Clegg said April 2010 about Greek style rioting if the Tories brought in spending cuts? (I'd forgotten about the poll tax riots)

http://news.sky.com/home/politics/article/15599056
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Old Aug 17th 2011, 9:18 am
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Default Re: Riots.

Here we go.......this is exactly why the whole thing started...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-14553330
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Old Aug 17th 2011, 5:11 pm
  #240  
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Default Re: Riots.

Originally Posted by Stormer999 View Post
Here we go.......this is exactly why the whole thing started...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-14553330
As I read this from the BBC I think what they were saying is the rioters were poor innocent regular people and should let out of jail and be able to enjoy their newly acquired bounty.
Maybe the BBC is partly responsible for this attitude of anything goes that prevails.
BBC mentioned some of the minor offenses. How about some of the other offenses could be mentioned.
BBC could and should produce programs that make people think.
Also as others have said people should take the streets back for use of responsible citizens. I'm thinking of the madness that takes place in cities and towns all over Britain where drunken people take to the streets and among other things bait the police.
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