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Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

Old Oct 21st 2008, 6:33 am
  #31  
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Default Re: Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

[QUOTE=southerner;6894541]Actually the first few posts were immediately cynical of the information. Then somebody had a go at the OP, and then it all got even more aimless.


Maybe we should pose the question, does the average Brit have an idealised view of what living in NZ must be like? Like Neighbours without the snakes and spiders.[/QUOTE]

Excellent
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Old Oct 21st 2008, 9:13 am
  #32  
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Default Re: Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

Originally Posted by janek
Well they haven't heard of this forum have they?

Are people really so gullible they would migrate to a country where life is portrayed as perfick? I don't think migrants are so stupid. A country is what you make it, some are better at making it than others... they don't need some bank to tell them where to live
Interesting choice of word, gullible. I prefer to say that they do not know, what they don't know. New Zealand does an extremely good job of portraying itself to the world outside as perfect and still continues to do so, despite factual and statistical evidence to the contrary. That idealogy is the only view from afar and nothing other than boots on the ground will reveal the realities of day to day normal life.

Of the thousands of people that emigrate here each year, a very, very small minority visit this or other forums - that does NOT make them gullible. Not everyone's first port of call is the internet, far less knowing where to look and what to look for. It's like walking into a library full of books, and not knowing what you need to know. Despite advice to the contrary, we are always led by what is on the cover.

People who do visit the forums are better placed to know what to expect, however that's not necessarily the best thing. How many times have we seen it written, yeah come on over, go for it, she'll be right, no worries, life's great and you'll be fine. I don't know how those people can give such a recommendations to people they do not know, I would not recommend New Zealand to any one of my own family, let alone a complete stranger. I could not live with myself, had I sold them a lie and it did not work out. Much in the same reason I do not give holiday recommendations - because I like it doesn't mean anyone else will. My only advice would be, do not come here seeking a BETTER life. Because better is better than what? It is neither measurable nor quantifiable.

The migrant process is a lot like a wedding with a huge build up and people get swept away with the excitement, planning and organising stuff, filling in forms, step by step until booking the plane tickets and the big day arrives. Up to this point nobody wants to hear the negative stuff, period. Everything they need to know appears repeatedly throughout the threads on this forum , yet that does not matter, they will already form an opinion on who they would rather believe. The rosy blinkers are there firmly in place, no matter how much one tries to take them off, it is not conceivable to imagine anything other than a happy ending. All negativity is brushed aside as an attitude problem, or bitterness of the poster and they will be absolutely adamant that this will not ever happen to them or that it will touch upon their own life in any way. We all start out like this, nothing will get in our way, nothing can stop us living our dream and positivity is the name of the game.

We are all aware of heaps of immigrants who are here without a clue that these forums existed, far less any desire to join one. They're often not disadvantaged for missing out on all this valuable and often useless information, they certainly would not consider themselves as stupid.
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Old Oct 21st 2008, 10:08 am
  #33  
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Default Re: Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

Interesting choice of word, gullible. I prefer to say that they do not know, what they don't know. New Zealand does an extremely good job of portraying itself to the world outside as perfect and still continues to do so, despite factual and statistical evidence to the contrary. That idealogy is the only view from afar and nothing other than boots on the ground will reveal the realities of day to day normal life.

So maybe Kiwi's aren't quite as dumb as some would like to think they are.

That's a joke by the way

NZ doesn't suit everyone but hey if we all were the same and liked the same things we would all be living on top of each other.

I come in here because my Brit neighbour likes to read BE and has no computer. Her husband conned her to sell up and come to NZ, they rented next door, he scappered back to his UK hot chick and left her alone with 2 kids and no money.

Sometimes my posts are her words and sometimes they are mine.

What I often see is NZ getting a bagging in here because it doesn't come up to expectations and woe betide anyone who dares to post a view to balance the topic..

Personal opinions, experiences of others or a few weeks holiday here are just that. The reality is NZ is not a small version of the UK as many expect it to be.

Some of you will settle and some wont and will move on. It is not about right or wrong, good or bad. It's about lifestyle preferences and personal choice.
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Old Oct 21st 2008, 11:02 am
  #34  
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Default Re: Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

What I see here is a frank exchange of views, which is good but I also see some people's opinions singled out as being "excessively negative" because they have had a bad experience of moving accross the world. I also see that many posters who berate their views or refuse to acknowledge their legitimacy then suggest that "all this negativity" is becasue they are gullible, did poor research or would never be happy anywhere. This is pretty trite and rather patronising, sometimes the world is getting us down so we need to vent and sometimes we need to see other people are taking some notice of what we are thinking/feeling. They seem to post, in the main, in order to add balance. I can't see the general slant of this forum as being either excessively pro- or anti- happy clappy or doom and gloom, although there are cycles of threads where one or another "camp" post more stuff.

People researching ther move come here for some facts, some opinions and specific answers to questions. If all the people who had suffered in NZ or the UK for that matter decided to stop posting because they believed their views were not reasonable or relevant the site would be devalued.

I'm glad I joined well before we arrived and read all those positive and negative posts. Thanks to all the posters for bearing their souls...........
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Old Oct 21st 2008, 7:55 pm
  #35  
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Default Re: Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

Originally Posted by Bo-Jangles
Interesting choice of word, gullible. I prefer to say that they do not know, what they don't know. New Zealand does an extremely good job of portraying itself to the world outside as perfect and still continues to do so, despite factual and statistical evidence to the contrary. That idealogy is the only view from afar and nothing other than boots on the ground will reveal the realities of day to day normal life.

Of the thousands of people that emigrate here each year, a very, very small minority visit this or other forums- that does NOT make them gullible. Not everyone's first port of call is the internet, far less knowing where to look and what to look for. It's like walking into a library full of books, and not knowing what you need to know. Despite advice to the contrary, we are always led by what is on the cover.

People who do visit the forums are better placed to know what to expect, however that's not necessarily the best thing. How many times have we seen it written, yeah come on over, go for it, she'll be right, no worries, life's great and you'll be fine I don't know how those people can give such a recommendations to people they do not know, I would not recommend New Zealand to any one of my own family, let alone a complete stranger. I could not live with myself, had I sold them a lie and it did not work out. Much in the same reason I do not give holiday recommendations - because I like it doesn't mean anyone else will. My only advice would be, do not come here seeking a BETTER life. Because better is better than what? It is neither measurable nor quantifiable.

The migrant process is a lot like a wedding with a huge build up and people get swept away with the excitement, planning and organising stuff, filling in forms, step by step until booking the plane tickets and the big day arrives. Up to this point nobody wants to hear the negative stuff, period. Everything they need to know appears repeatedly throughout the threads on this forum , yet that does not matter, they will already form an opinion on who they would rather believe. The rosy blinkers are there firmly in place, no matter how much one tries to take them off, it is not conceivable to imagine anything other than a happy ending. All negativity is brushed aside as an attitude problem, or bitterness of the poster and they will be absolutely adamant that this will not ever happen to them or that it will touch upon their own life in any way. We all start out like this, nothing will get in our way, nothing can stop us living our dream and positivity is the name of the game.

We are all aware of heaps of immigrants who are here without a clue that these forums existed, far less any desire to join one. They're often not disadvantaged for missing out on all this valuable and often useless information, they certainly would not consider themselves as stupid.

Well if 'they do not know what they do not know' they may well be open to being easily deceived but I was asking a question, I give people a little more credit...

' yeah come on over, go for it, she'll be right, no worries, life's great and you'll be fine'

really?? I don't think people fall for that, I haven't see it written round these parts, this forum seems quite well balanced but I don't trail through years of internet posts.
We don't know how many people use the internet or forums to research their migration process, but I bet in the 21st century its a lot more that you give credit for.

I too would not recommend any country I have lived in to anyone either, stranger or friend because everywhere has its down-sides.

'positivity is the name of the game.'
yip a bit of it sure does help, I don't think a migrant with a negative attitude would get off the starting blocks.
Imagine getting married with a negative attitude!! I guess some people do! Or going for a job interview or migrating
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Old Oct 21st 2008, 10:57 pm
  #36  
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Default Re: Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

Originally Posted by janek
'positivity is the name of the game.'
yip a bit of it sure does help, I don't think a migrant with a negative attitude would get off the starting blocks.
Imagine getting married with a negative attitude!! I guess some people do! Or going for a job interview or migrating
A migrant with 'a negative attitude'?? What does that mean?!! I think you're confusing someone armed with (or forewarned of, if you will) the negatives and someone with a negative attitude, when the two are completely and entirely different.
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Old Oct 21st 2008, 11:07 pm
  #37  
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Default Re: Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

Originally Posted by Black Sheep
A migrant with 'a negative attitude'?? What does that mean?!! I think you're confusing someone armed with (or forewarned of, if you will) the negatives and someone with a negative attitude, when the two are completely and entirely different.
Its the opposite of a positive attitude
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Old Oct 21st 2008, 11:07 pm
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Default Re: Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

Originally Posted by janek
' yeah come on over, go for it, she'll be right, no worries, life's great and you'll be fine'

really?? I don't think people fall for that
There are some things which should be discussed openly which are not opinions but actual facts. They can inform potential migrants. Research the weather. The crime stats. The houses. The job market. Etc.
I am very very careful about telling someone to move to NZ. It is not a way to solve all of your problems. It can improve some things, but then again, so could a move within the UK. NZ is not for everyone. It has it's own vibe. It's too hard to generalise. I know some friends who love it, and others who hate it. Seems to polarise people quite a bit! It is a long way to come to find out - and expensive too. So beware!In a lot of ways moving to NZ is the safe option, though. It's an English speaking country. It has similar culture. basically my summary of NZ is some good things, some bad things. Good people, bad people. Like anywhere else really. Best standard of living in the world? Nope. It's OK.

Last edited by Jokerman; Oct 21st 2008 at 11:11 pm.
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Old Oct 21st 2008, 11:33 pm
  #39  
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Default Re: Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

Seems that facts are what some of us want to discuss and (some) others want to dismiss theses as "generalisations and vitriol"........or avoid, side-step or better still not discuss them at all.

As far as "negative attitude" goes, as I have said before, dismissing someone's experiences or opinions because of *your* perception of *their attitude* is not helpful and can be downright rude.

This personalises the debate and while the rest of us begin in the position of discussing these things without reference to personal traits, etc we get drawn into a pesonal debate. Seems to me that once we get to a "you're negative and would be negative anywhere" then the debate is either lost or the point of discussing it is lost. Either way there isn't much point responding.....

But can we at least agree that this marketing document from A&L is not a poll, nor is much of it useful or even accurate.......as "facts" go......??
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Old Oct 22nd 2008, 12:23 am
  #40  
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Default Re: Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

Originally Posted by lardyl
Seems to me that once we get to a "you're negative and would be negative anywhere" then the debate is either lost or the point of discussing it is lost. Either way there isn't much point responding.....
But the problem is that people are negative for negatives sake, and say things that are just exaggerations. I appreciate that people need to vent at times and without real human interactions it can come across badly on the Internet.

However if you look across all the sub-forums on this site you will see these negatives being repeated in just about every country that expats decide to migrate to. Whatever the country, Canada, the US, Australia or NZ, there seems to be exactly the same sort of whingers. And I'm not having a go at genuine criticism or if someone is feeling down and looking for support.

None of these countries hide their statistics, or lie to immigrants, the facts are there for all to see.

And in my opinion if you are unhappy where you live and the main reason for emmigrating is because you are unhappy with your life, rather than you emmigrating because you have a desire to live somewhere else, then your chances of not enjoying your destination are much higher.
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Old Oct 22nd 2008, 12:39 am
  #41  
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Default Re: Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

Originally Posted by sr71
But the problem is that people are negative for negatives sake, and say things that are just exaggerations.......However if you look across all the sub-forums on this site you will see these negatives being repeated in just about every country that expats decide to migrate to. Whatever the country, Canada, the US, Australia or NZ, there seems to be exactly the same sort of whingers. .....
You've made my points very succinctly thanks.......the problem is with the people whinging and not with the country/system.......
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Old Oct 22nd 2008, 12:45 am
  #42  
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Default Re: Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

Originally Posted by sr71
...
And in my opinion if you are unhappy where you live and the main reason for emigrating is because you are unhappy with your life, rather than you emigrating because you have a desire to live somewhere else, then your chances of not enjoying your destination are much higher.
I agree.
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Old Oct 22nd 2008, 12:48 am
  #43  
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Default Re: Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

Originally Posted by sr71
And in my opinion if you are unhappy where you live and the main reason for emmigrating is because you are unhappy with your life, rather than you emmigrating because you have a desire to live somewhere else, then your chances of not enjoying your destination are much higher.

That is so true and I've met people who fall into this category. As one of my friend's said to me when I moved here 'Brand new country, same old sh*t'.

I complain a lot about things but the truth of the matter is most of those things would have happened wherever I lived.

I hear people saying NZ is amazing and other's who claim it's some kind of money-draining and completely overrated hellhole. Each to their own I reckon. I'm sure there's cheaper/hotter/more vibrant places but everywhere has it's pros and cons. At the end of the day everyone has their own opinion and these are a lot better when tempered by experience rather than just generalisations/sweeping statements.

At the end of the day a lot of people have valid points when they complain/rave about a place which is great. Some people just like a good old whinge - which is fine (to an extent).
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Old Oct 22nd 2008, 12:52 am
  #44  
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Default Re: Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

Originally Posted by RobClubley
I agree.
In fact I do too.........anyone trying to get away from something, be it environmental or to do with their lives will be at risk of finding it amost anywhere they go.....but the other points still remain
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Old Oct 22nd 2008, 1:13 am
  #45  
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Default Re: Poll: NZ Ideal Place to Live

Originally Posted by waynepfry
....I hear people saying NZ is amazing and other's who claim it's some kind of money-draining and completely overrated hellhole. Each to their own I reckon. I'm sure there's cheaper/hotter/more vibrant places but everywhere has it's pros and cons. At the end of the day everyone has their own opinion and these are a lot better when tempered by experience rather than just generalisations/sweeping statements.....
indeed but the fact remains that one man's "sweeping generalisation" is another man's "what I've learned by bitter experience"......

and I doubt there are many more generalisations being made on one side of the debate than the other - just think about the generalisations (or at least implied generalisations) flying around at the end of the thread, such as "Pomms whinge wherever they end up" and "people who are amazingly anti-NZ are so because of some event that was their fault, due to poor planning, overblown expectations, neagtive thinking or whatever...."

Some other posters here have tried to turn those around by quoting ex-pat Kiwis "whinging" about their old and new countries and giving their opinions....but still it comes back to the same old record, just another track.....
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