NZ, expensive or not?
Aug 16th 2005, 5:03 am
#1
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Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 68
NZ, expensive or not?
Having read some of the threads here, there appears to be a reluctance from some NZers to accept just how expensive NZ really is.
1. Average salaries, UK is approx 23k and NZ 42k, a rough multiplier of 1.8
2. The average house prices are, again approx, 160k & 300k, so in the UK that means about 6x the average salary and in NZ 7x. But that NZ house will cost you much, much more when you factor in the high legal costs. Even that pales into insignificance, when you calculate your mortgage repayments because of the incredibly high NZ interest rates - £820 (NZ$2,300 & in real terms nearer $1500) in the UK, $3,250 in NZ, per month respectively
There's a myth about NZ having a lower cost of living too, divide that $3 dollar loaf of Vogel by 1.8 and you get UKP1.60 twice the cost of a Granary loaf in Sainsburys. This follows for most of the basic foodstuffs, how much is a tin of beans/tomatoes here, certainly not the 15p or so back in the UK.
For those that think petrol is cheaper, divide the current $1.50 by 3 and it seems cheap, but use that 1.8 figure and there's not too much difference.
Pretty much every consumer item in NZ is more expensive in real terms than in the UK, and there is an astounding lack of choice in both product & retailers. Odd when you think that most similar items are manufactured in the Far East & the shipping costs would be lower to NZ than to the UK. A shirt for sale at Smith & Caugheys (Ben Sherman, made in China) was $200, yet in the UK comes in at about UKP30, less if you shop around - at least you can shop around there.
Like it or not, houses in NZ are not as well constructed in terms of insulation & heating, there seems to be no regard to insulation when building a new house and also energy, be it gas or electricity, is significantly more expensive proportionately, than the UK. In addition, I've yet to see a new home with a 10yr builder's guarantee or indeed any kind of proper warranty. It really is caveat emptor here. For those in the UK checking out NZ property web sites, watch out for the stylish-looking new builds, often the exterior walls are nothing more than polystyrene nailed over potentially untreated timber frames which are then sprayed with concrete. Do a quick search for leaky building syndrome & you'll see what I mean. Much of the building here wouln't pass muster with UK regs. And if you do end up with one, you'll find you have no real come-back as the the developer will probably have sub-contracted via a front company, which will have gone into liquidation shortly after completion of the project.
Don't even get me started on the rip-off that is NZ broadband internet access, Telecom run a state-sponsored monopoly which works to the detriment of the consumer.
What will improve the situation? Proper competition rather than a cartel of self-interested companies that rather than fulfilling the needs of the consumer, decide what the consumer will get and the maximum price they can charge for it
And...
Can we have an IKEA please
1. Average salaries, UK is approx 23k and NZ 42k, a rough multiplier of 1.8
2. The average house prices are, again approx, 160k & 300k, so in the UK that means about 6x the average salary and in NZ 7x. But that NZ house will cost you much, much more when you factor in the high legal costs. Even that pales into insignificance, when you calculate your mortgage repayments because of the incredibly high NZ interest rates - £820 (NZ$2,300 & in real terms nearer $1500) in the UK, $3,250 in NZ, per month respectively
There's a myth about NZ having a lower cost of living too, divide that $3 dollar loaf of Vogel by 1.8 and you get UKP1.60 twice the cost of a Granary loaf in Sainsburys. This follows for most of the basic foodstuffs, how much is a tin of beans/tomatoes here, certainly not the 15p or so back in the UK.
For those that think petrol is cheaper, divide the current $1.50 by 3 and it seems cheap, but use that 1.8 figure and there's not too much difference.
Pretty much every consumer item in NZ is more expensive in real terms than in the UK, and there is an astounding lack of choice in both product & retailers. Odd when you think that most similar items are manufactured in the Far East & the shipping costs would be lower to NZ than to the UK. A shirt for sale at Smith & Caugheys (Ben Sherman, made in China) was $200, yet in the UK comes in at about UKP30, less if you shop around - at least you can shop around there.
Like it or not, houses in NZ are not as well constructed in terms of insulation & heating, there seems to be no regard to insulation when building a new house and also energy, be it gas or electricity, is significantly more expensive proportionately, than the UK. In addition, I've yet to see a new home with a 10yr builder's guarantee or indeed any kind of proper warranty. It really is caveat emptor here. For those in the UK checking out NZ property web sites, watch out for the stylish-looking new builds, often the exterior walls are nothing more than polystyrene nailed over potentially untreated timber frames which are then sprayed with concrete. Do a quick search for leaky building syndrome & you'll see what I mean. Much of the building here wouln't pass muster with UK regs. And if you do end up with one, you'll find you have no real come-back as the the developer will probably have sub-contracted via a front company, which will have gone into liquidation shortly after completion of the project.
Don't even get me started on the rip-off that is NZ broadband internet access, Telecom run a state-sponsored monopoly which works to the detriment of the consumer.
What will improve the situation? Proper competition rather than a cartel of self-interested companies that rather than fulfilling the needs of the consumer, decide what the consumer will get and the maximum price they can charge for it
And...
Can we have an IKEA please
Last edited by Dave in Auckland; Aug 16th 2005 at 5:53 am.
Aug 16th 2005, 7:12 am
#2
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Joined: May 2005
Location: Canberra, ACT
Posts: 1,222
Re: NZ, expensive or not?
That is the most realistic post I have ever read.
It is the truth.
It is the truth.
Aug 16th 2005, 7:49 am
#3
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Joined: Apr 2005
Location: Beachlands, East Auckland
Posts: 2,957
Re: NZ, expensive or not?
Yep I agree thats a good post.
Anyway, Dave in Auckland.... where abouts in Auckland are you?..and welcome to the site.
Anyway, Dave in Auckland.... where abouts in Auckland are you?..and welcome to the site.
Aug 16th 2005, 7:55 am
#4
Just Joined
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 4
Re: NZ, expensive or not?
Please don't imagine that I disagree with anything that you are saying but could we not find a great list of negatives wherever we live? Should we question our original reasons for being in NZ?
Aug 16th 2005, 8:37 am
#5
Joined: Apr 2005
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 692
Re: NZ, expensive or not?
Originally Posted by Taneth
Please don't imagine that I disagree with anything that you are saying but could we not find a great list of negatives wherever we live? Should we question our original reasons for being in NZ?
Aug 16th 2005, 9:58 am
#6
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,606
Re: NZ, expensive or not?
Originally Posted by bookemjano
Good point - it is sounding as though the cost of living is more expensive than us expats originally thought, but for most of us this is a small price to pay (excuse the pun) bearing in mind our individual reasons for wanting to be in New Zealand.
I agree with you completely, the cost of living for those who have researched it well (which thankfully the internet allows you to do) is generally higher than in the UK.
I say generally since it is more expensive compared to the UK for those in the UK who take advantage of economies of scale through shopping at Tesco's & Asda etc. For those with high disposable income, they will not feel the impact to the same degree as they are not buying the cheaper things in the UK which is exactly what NZ lacks.
So as long as people are aware and can afford the increase in living costs they will be fine. I suppose my concern from reading posts from those on this forum is for those people who do not have much disposable income today and high savings/capital to use in forming the new life overseas. Hence these people may be in for anything from an affordable shock to serious financial trouble like some of those currently in NZ who post on this forum. Then the 'lifestyle/children's safety' reasons pale into insignificance when it is hard to pay basic bills and feed a family.
Understandably, no-one wants to hear these things. Personally I would advise those who don't want to read 'negative postings' to ask themselves a very serious 'why?', listen to the answer and work it through to conclusion.
Aug 16th 2005, 10:00 am
#7
Galaxy 1: Cadbury's 0
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,606
Re: NZ, expensive or not?
Originally Posted by Dave in Auckland
Having read some of the threads here, there appears to be a reluctance from some NZers to accept just how expensive NZ really is.
1. Average salaries, UK is approx 23k and NZ 42k, a rough multiplier of 1.8
2. The average house prices are, again approx, 160k & 300k, so in the UK that means about 6x the average salary and in NZ 7x. But that NZ house will cost you much, much more when you factor in the high legal costs. Even that pales into insignificance, when you calculate your mortgage repayments because of the incredibly high NZ interest rates - £820 (NZ$2,300 & in real terms nearer $1500) in the UK, $3,250 in NZ, per month respectively
There's a myth about NZ having a lower cost of living too, divide that $3 dollar loaf of Vogel by 1.8 and you get UKP1.60 twice the cost of a Granary loaf in Sainsburys. This follows for most of the basic foodstuffs, how much is a tin of beans/tomatoes here, certainly not the 15p or so back in the UK.
For those that think petrol is cheaper, divide the current $1.50 by 3 and it seems cheap, but use that 1.8 figure and there's not too much difference.
Pretty much every consumer item in NZ is more expensive in real terms than in the UK, and there is an astounding lack of choice in both product & retailers. Odd when you think that most similar items are manufactured in the Far East & the shipping costs would be lower to NZ than to the UK. A shirt for sale at Smith & Caugheys (Ben Sherman, made in China) was $200, yet in the UK comes in at about UKP30, less if you shop around - at least you can shop around there.
Like it or not, houses in NZ are not as well constructed in terms of insulation & heating, there seems to be no regard to insulation when building a new house and also energy, be it gas or electricity, is significantly more expensive proportionately, than the UK. In addition, I've yet to see a new home with a 10yr builder's guarantee or indeed any kind of proper warranty. It really is caveat emptor here. For those in the UK checking out NZ property web sites, watch out for the stylish-looking new builds, often the exterior walls are nothing more than polystyrene nailed over potentially untreated timber frames which are then sprayed with concrete. Do a quick search for leaky building syndrome & you'll see what I mean. Much of the building here wouln't pass muster with UK regs. And if you do end up with one, you'll find you have no real come-back as the the developer will probably have sub-contracted via a front company, which will have gone into liquidation shortly after completion of the project.
Don't even get me started on the rip-off that is NZ broadband internet access, Telecom run a state-sponsored monopoly which works to the detriment of the consumer.
What will improve the situation? Proper competition rather than a cartel of self-interested companies that rather than fulfilling the needs of the consumer, decide what the consumer will get and the maximum price they can charge for it
And...
Can we have an IKEA please
1. Average salaries, UK is approx 23k and NZ 42k, a rough multiplier of 1.8
2. The average house prices are, again approx, 160k & 300k, so in the UK that means about 6x the average salary and in NZ 7x. But that NZ house will cost you much, much more when you factor in the high legal costs. Even that pales into insignificance, when you calculate your mortgage repayments because of the incredibly high NZ interest rates - £820 (NZ$2,300 & in real terms nearer $1500) in the UK, $3,250 in NZ, per month respectively
There's a myth about NZ having a lower cost of living too, divide that $3 dollar loaf of Vogel by 1.8 and you get UKP1.60 twice the cost of a Granary loaf in Sainsburys. This follows for most of the basic foodstuffs, how much is a tin of beans/tomatoes here, certainly not the 15p or so back in the UK.
For those that think petrol is cheaper, divide the current $1.50 by 3 and it seems cheap, but use that 1.8 figure and there's not too much difference.
Pretty much every consumer item in NZ is more expensive in real terms than in the UK, and there is an astounding lack of choice in both product & retailers. Odd when you think that most similar items are manufactured in the Far East & the shipping costs would be lower to NZ than to the UK. A shirt for sale at Smith & Caugheys (Ben Sherman, made in China) was $200, yet in the UK comes in at about UKP30, less if you shop around - at least you can shop around there.
Like it or not, houses in NZ are not as well constructed in terms of insulation & heating, there seems to be no regard to insulation when building a new house and also energy, be it gas or electricity, is significantly more expensive proportionately, than the UK. In addition, I've yet to see a new home with a 10yr builder's guarantee or indeed any kind of proper warranty. It really is caveat emptor here. For those in the UK checking out NZ property web sites, watch out for the stylish-looking new builds, often the exterior walls are nothing more than polystyrene nailed over potentially untreated timber frames which are then sprayed with concrete. Do a quick search for leaky building syndrome & you'll see what I mean. Much of the building here wouln't pass muster with UK regs. And if you do end up with one, you'll find you have no real come-back as the the developer will probably have sub-contracted via a front company, which will have gone into liquidation shortly after completion of the project.
Don't even get me started on the rip-off that is NZ broadband internet access, Telecom run a state-sponsored monopoly which works to the detriment of the consumer.
What will improve the situation? Proper competition rather than a cartel of self-interested companies that rather than fulfilling the needs of the consumer, decide what the consumer will get and the maximum price they can charge for it
And...
Can we have an IKEA please
Aug 16th 2005, 10:07 am
#8
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Joined: Apr 2005
Location: Beachlands, East Auckland
Posts: 2,957
Re: NZ, expensive or not?
I think they need Argos here!! 
Aug 16th 2005, 10:14 am
#9
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Re: NZ, expensive or not?
Originally Posted by SarahB
I think they need Argos here!!
Aug 16th 2005, 10:30 am
#10
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Joined: Apr 2005
Location: Beachlands, East Auckland
Posts: 2,957
Re: NZ, expensive or not?
Originally Posted by uk+kiwi
yes another good one. in view of our trip in december i started thinking about booster seats for the trip. £9 in Argos with arms!!!! No equivalent in NZ that I could find, but I now know about Plunkett (spelling) who will hire them to us - probably for a lot more than £9 equiv. though for 3 weeks!!!!
Aug 16th 2005, 10:36 am
#11
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Joined: Nov 2002
Location: NZ since 2003.
Posts: 1,433
Re: NZ, expensive or not?
Originally Posted by uk+kiwi
yes another good one. in view of our trip in december i started thinking about booster seats for the trip. £9 in Argos with arms!!!! No equivalent in NZ that I could find, but I now know about Plunkett (spelling) who will hire them to us - probably for a lot more than £9 equiv. though for 3 weeks!!!!
There are branches throughout the 2 islands
Gill
Aug 16th 2005, 11:48 am
#12
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Joined: Feb 2005
Location: Back in NZ & loving it - living in Orewa
Posts: 1,183
Re: NZ, expensive or not?
I think this is a realistic post, although I have to question your housing cost comparisons. For a start, there is no stamp duty in NZ; if I were to move within the UK from my £300k house to a similarly-priced one (which I'd need to do if I don't emigrate), I can kiss £9k goodbye - more than my relocation costs to NZ! Are legal costs really so much higher in NZ? Not an area I've researched, I must admit. Secondly, for migrants, it is hoped thatyou'll be taking some capital to NZ - and this will go a long way; if you own 50% of your average UK house and take this to NZ, you've got 2/3 of an average NZ house, even at today's poor exchange rate.
I agree with your bottom line, NZ isn't cheaper and you'd be misguided to move there to be better off unless you're taking a lot of capital. However, what price do you put on clean air, uncrowded countryside and beaches, a better climate and not being stuck in a traffic jam every time you go within 10 miles of the coast?
I agree with your bottom line, NZ isn't cheaper and you'd be misguided to move there to be better off unless you're taking a lot of capital. However, what price do you put on clean air, uncrowded countryside and beaches, a better climate and not being stuck in a traffic jam every time you go within 10 miles of the coast?
Originally Posted by Dave in Auckland
Having read some of the threads here, there appears to be a reluctance from some NZers to accept just how expensive NZ really is.
1. Average salaries, UK is approx 23k and NZ 42k, a rough multiplier of 1.8
2. The average house prices are, again approx, 160k & 300k, so in the UK that means about 6x the average salary and in NZ 7x. But that NZ house will cost you much, much more when you factor in the high legal costs. Even that pales into insignificance, when you calculate your mortgage repayments because of the incredibly high NZ interest rates - £820 (NZ$2,300 & in real terms nearer $1500) in the UK, $3,250 in NZ, per month respectively
There's a myth about NZ having a lower cost of living too, divide that $3 dollar loaf of Vogel by 1.8 and you get UKP1.60 twice the cost of a Granary loaf in Sainsburys. This follows for most of the basic foodstuffs, how much is a tin of beans/tomatoes here, certainly not the 15p or so back in the UK.
For those that think petrol is cheaper, divide the current $1.50 by 3 and it seems cheap, but use that 1.8 figure and there's not too much difference.
Pretty much every consumer item in NZ is more expensive in real terms than in the UK, and there is an astounding lack of choice in both product & retailers. Odd when you think that most similar items are manufactured in the Far East & the shipping costs would be lower to NZ than to the UK. A shirt for sale at Smith & Caugheys (Ben Sherman, made in China) was $200, yet in the UK comes in at about UKP30, less if you shop around - at least you can shop around there.
Like it or not, houses in NZ are not as well constructed in terms of insulation & heating, there seems to be no regard to insulation when building a new house and also energy, be it gas or electricity, is significantly more expensive proportionately, than the UK. In addition, I've yet to see a new home with a 10yr builder's guarantee or indeed any kind of proper warranty. It really is caveat emptor here. For those in the UK checking out NZ property web sites, watch out for the stylish-looking new builds, often the exterior walls are nothing more than polystyrene nailed over potentially untreated timber frames which are then sprayed with concrete. Do a quick search for leaky building syndrome & you'll see what I mean. Much of the building here wouln't pass muster with UK regs. And if you do end up with one, you'll find you have no real come-back as the the developer will probably have sub-contracted via a front company, which will have gone into liquidation shortly after completion of the project.
Don't even get me started on the rip-off that is NZ broadband internet access, Telecom run a state-sponsored monopoly which works to the detriment of the consumer.
What will improve the situation? Proper competition rather than a cartel of self-interested companies that rather than fulfilling the needs of the consumer, decide what the consumer will get and the maximum price they can charge for it
And...
Can we have an IKEA please
1. Average salaries, UK is approx 23k and NZ 42k, a rough multiplier of 1.8
2. The average house prices are, again approx, 160k & 300k, so in the UK that means about 6x the average salary and in NZ 7x. But that NZ house will cost you much, much more when you factor in the high legal costs. Even that pales into insignificance, when you calculate your mortgage repayments because of the incredibly high NZ interest rates - £820 (NZ$2,300 & in real terms nearer $1500) in the UK, $3,250 in NZ, per month respectively
There's a myth about NZ having a lower cost of living too, divide that $3 dollar loaf of Vogel by 1.8 and you get UKP1.60 twice the cost of a Granary loaf in Sainsburys. This follows for most of the basic foodstuffs, how much is a tin of beans/tomatoes here, certainly not the 15p or so back in the UK.
For those that think petrol is cheaper, divide the current $1.50 by 3 and it seems cheap, but use that 1.8 figure and there's not too much difference.
Pretty much every consumer item in NZ is more expensive in real terms than in the UK, and there is an astounding lack of choice in both product & retailers. Odd when you think that most similar items are manufactured in the Far East & the shipping costs would be lower to NZ than to the UK. A shirt for sale at Smith & Caugheys (Ben Sherman, made in China) was $200, yet in the UK comes in at about UKP30, less if you shop around - at least you can shop around there.
Like it or not, houses in NZ are not as well constructed in terms of insulation & heating, there seems to be no regard to insulation when building a new house and also energy, be it gas or electricity, is significantly more expensive proportionately, than the UK. In addition, I've yet to see a new home with a 10yr builder's guarantee or indeed any kind of proper warranty. It really is caveat emptor here. For those in the UK checking out NZ property web sites, watch out for the stylish-looking new builds, often the exterior walls are nothing more than polystyrene nailed over potentially untreated timber frames which are then sprayed with concrete. Do a quick search for leaky building syndrome & you'll see what I mean. Much of the building here wouln't pass muster with UK regs. And if you do end up with one, you'll find you have no real come-back as the the developer will probably have sub-contracted via a front company, which will have gone into liquidation shortly after completion of the project.
Don't even get me started on the rip-off that is NZ broadband internet access, Telecom run a state-sponsored monopoly which works to the detriment of the consumer.
What will improve the situation? Proper competition rather than a cartel of self-interested companies that rather than fulfilling the needs of the consumer, decide what the consumer will get and the maximum price they can charge for it
And...
Can we have an IKEA please
Aug 16th 2005, 12:01 pm
#13
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 311
Re: NZ, expensive or not?
Originally Posted by uk+kiwi
Good post. I may work on an Ikea solution for NZ myself!!!
Aug 16th 2005, 12:13 pm
#14
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,606
Re: NZ, expensive or not?
Originally Posted by ukkiwi
Someone already beat you to it http://www.simplydesign.co.nz/
So is there an Argos equivalent then?
Aug 16th 2005, 12:44 pm
#15
Joined: Apr 2005
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 692
Re: NZ, expensive or not?
Originally Posted by lapsed kiwi
I think this is a realistic post, although I have to question your housing cost comparisons. For a start, there is no stamp duty in NZ; if I were to move within the UK from my £300k house to a similarly-priced one (which I'd need to do if I don't emigrate), I can kiss £9k goodbye - more than my relocation costs to NZ! Are legal costs really so much higher in NZ? Not an area I've researched, I must admit. Secondly, for migrants, it is hoped thatyou'll be taking some capital to NZ - and this will go a long way; if you own 50% of your average UK house and take this to NZ, you've got 2/3 of an average NZ house, even at today's poor exchange rate.
I agree with your bottom line, NZ isn't cheaper and you'd be misguided to move there to be better off unless you're taking a lot of capital. However, what price do you put on clean air, uncrowded countryside and beaches, a better climate and not being stuck in a traffic jam every time you go within 10 miles of the coast?
I agree with your bottom line, NZ isn't cheaper and you'd be misguided to move there to be better off unless you're taking a lot of capital. However, what price do you put on clean air, uncrowded countryside and beaches, a better climate and not being stuck in a traffic jam every time you go within 10 miles of the coast?