Wiz'n'Ton

We have a lovely house. Really. Surveyors are impressed with its robust nature, and beautiful build quality. Only thing is, it was built over 50 years ago when insulation was a dirty word.

It has none. None in the floor, none in the walls, none in the flat roof.

It's a 2 storey place, and we've got quotes in to get it insulated. They stack up as follows:

Floor, with recylcled woolen stuff - $3K. Can't do polystyrene - even that squishy stuff, as limited access to the underneath
Walls, with that injected foam stuff - $8k. This will leave our interior walls full of holes, as the exterior is rendered. We will need to redecorate the entire house to get it looking decent.
Ceilings, with pink batts - $12k. As we have a flat roof, they will pull down our internal ceilings and fill the immediate air space with pink batts. To remove the roof and do it from the top would be close to 20k, plus some of the ceilings need replastering anyway.

Or - 2 x heat pumps in living area: $10k
Electricity to run them flat out over 10 winters: $????

Or - wood to burn in wood burner: $500 to $700 per winter.

The upshot is that to make what heating we have anywhere near efficient, we need to spend over 20k. That's a hell of a lot of electricity and wood, but would lead to a more comfortable house overall.

The other issue is that we wouldn't get anything near that back should we have to sell the place. It's just not valued as a selling point here. We have no intentions on moving, just something to consider.

So - what would you do? Leave it? Spend the dosh? Do a bit of each? Anything we've not thought of?

I'm just not looking forward to another cold winter. How I miss my central heating.......

seraphnina

What about the windows? They ok?

Am Loolah

We've just had a quote for heat pumps and are mulling over our options too. Confusing isn't it?!

But I think without adequate insulation you'll just be wasting money to be honest. Heatpumps only heat the room they are in and I'd imagine once you turn them off the temperature will reduce pretty quick with nothing to retain the warmth in the room?

Rugs and thermal curtains probably won't do all that much for where you live.

If you have ceiling space and where going to have some ceilings taken down anyway have you looked into a DVS system of some sort? Taking the heat from other rooms through pipework in the ceilings and distributing the heat through vents in to other areas of the house?

Failing that - set fire to it - that'll keep you warm whilst it burns and then you can have a nice new house with radiators in it's place ...

http://www.dvs.co.nz/index.php/pi_pageid/131

simonmarkellis

Would generating your own electricity be an option...

Wiz'n'Ton

Single glazing unfortunately, but we've been told that once we get decent drapes, we'll only lose 10% or less through them and to replace them would be the thick end of 30k on its own!

Wiz'n'Ton

Sure is confusing. Some folks say 'sod the insulation, think how much heat 20k will buy you' whilst others see the advantage of keeping a heat-efficient environment which takes small inputs to heat/ cool.

We'd love DVS, but have no heat sinks such as a gabled roof space, for them to work. The flat roof is a pig in that respect.

Wiz'n'Ton

Enlighten me...? You thinking solar/ wind/ fart....? We got loads of the latter

nelsonpom

If you can get under the house even flat on your back you could use the metal insulation (like foil) you just staple it to the beams and has a higher r rating then other more common products (mitre 10 stock it). I did my house this way and although it took a while cost was only about few hundred. With windows use curtains with a double layer (doesn't have to be thermal but must be 2 layers) and make them go all the way to the ground. Also seal the gap at the top of curtain rail this is better than double glazing. Putting foam in walls is very unreliable a better solution if possible would be to do it room by room. Remove plaster board and put pink batts or similar in and then put fresh plasterboard on top. Plaster board sheets only cost about $20 and not difficult to do. Heat pumps are pretty good but get some expert advice and a few free quotes. We have had fujitsu, panasonic and mitsubishi so far and daikon coming round tomorrow. Price is down to about $2000 now. Can't think of better way to do ceiling though. Good luck Darren.

seraphnina

I would probably do the floor first and maybe south facing? side of the house.

P2L

You looked at this?
http://www.eeca.govt.nz/residential/...nts/index.html

http://www.cea.co.nz/insulation-subsidies

Might be also worth a call to DBH and ask what help you might be able to get, particularly being in the Graden City and the whole eCan thing

CAN2NZ

I am sorry to say that I marvel that many houses are purchased as they are. However, if you are intent on staying you may want to consider the cost of selling and moving against the cost of doing up the house. If you are handy, I do like the suggestion that another poster made of spending some time and going through the house a room at a time. However, this takes discipline as the job may go on and on. you could take the plaster down and put the pink bats in yourself and then pay a fixer/stopper to come and put up the new boards and you paint. This would move you along and be cheaper than having a contractor do it all.

Genesis

So - what would you do? Leave it? Spend the dosh? Do a bit of each? Anything we've not thought of?

I'm just not looking forward to another cold winter. How I miss my central heating.......[/QUOTE]

We have invested in double glazing, euro style CH, 6 dehumidifiers and a log burner. Whilst the aforementioned was not cheap the house is comfortable (but not perfect) and the money was spent with a long term view..ie 20 years here, thus the capital outlay does not seem so bad spread over 20 years!! Dehumidifiers are worth their weight in gold and as you have a flat roof like us they are the only alternative to DVS. The moisture the average family give out daily is amazing. We run our dehumidifiers during night on Genesis half price leccy, they do an amazing job, are cheap to run and give off an ambient heat. Buy them 2nd hand off trademe.

nelsonpom

We have invested in double glazing, euro style CH, 6 dehumidifiers and a log burner. Whilst the aforementioned was not cheap the house is comfortable (but not perfect) and the money was spent with a long term view..ie 20 years here, thus the capital outlay does not seem so bad spread over 20 years!! Dehumidifiers are worth their weight in gold and as you have a flat roof like us they are the only alternative to DVS. The moisture the average family give out daily is amazing. We run our dehumidifiers during night on Genesis half price leccy, they do an amazing job, are cheap to run and give off an ambient heat. Buy them 2nd hand off trademe.[/QUOTE]

Double glazing is great but a much cheaper solution is to double layer your curtain and seal the top, this does exactly the same as double glazing, but if you can afford to do both you will double your insulation.

P2L

Can't you find a pedal powered generator to run your heating off!!! That way you can heat your house while you train for the Coast to Coast

Oh and think how environmentally friendly you'd be too

Mgee

Hi Wiz'n'Tom,

I posted some information and told quite a lot about my own experiences on how to live comfortably in a very cold climate (I'm a Finn) in an earlier thread titled "Heat pumps". You might want to check that one out, as there were a lot of good posts -and not just mine .

Were the quotes and calculations about the amount of needed energy/money for heating based on your current situation or taking into account the solution you outlined? Insulation does save a lot of money and energy, so do take that into account when making calculations -sorry if this is self-evident, just making sure.

Insulation really is the key to a comfortable and dry house. If the house is not insulated, most of the heat energy radiates out, making heating inefficient and expensive. Insulated houses also retain the heat in better, which means that the house stays drier and thus healthier.

I would also consider the solar energy option, especially if there's any kind of financial help available for it. It may not be feasible as the only heating option, but it could help you to cut down the cost of heating.

And if you decide to sell, I bet a lot of the expats, also on this forum, would rather buy your insulated house than a standard Kiwi house! I know I most certainly would We are a long way from moving, but have already decided that we either spend the extra money on an insulated house or buy an old one and do all the work needed. We are also considering the solar energy options if they are feasible (here they aren't due to lack of sunlight in winter). And if the younger one of our dogs doesn't calm down with age, we can always build a border collie -powered giant hamster wheel generator.

It will be interesting to move to NZ and start talking to the builders and contractors. The first one to tell us to put on another jersey and to toughen up is in for one heck of a surprise