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Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

Old Jun 5th 2010, 5:23 pm
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Default Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/educ...t-NZ-varsities

"Foreign students should be allowed to become permanent residents if they graduate from New Zealand universities, the chairman of the vice-chancellor's committee says.

Students reacted angrily yesterday to a Government push for more international students to come to New Zealand.

The New Zealand Union of Students Associations says it is unfair the welcome mat is rolled out for foreigners while entry to university study for Kiwis gets tougher.

But the chairman of the New Zealand Vice-Chancellors' Committee, Derek McCormack, welcomed the move.

Mr McCormack, vice-chancellor of Auckland University of Technology, said the proportion of international students now enrolled was not high.

"We certainly can move up and we should be seeking to do so," Mr McCormack said.

The Government should consider making it easier for foreign graduates to become permanent New Zealand residents if they studied at and graduated from one of the eight Kiwi universities.

"Why not keep as many of those people as we can?" he said. "... they've [foreign graduates of New Zealand universities] got good qualifications that are accepted here."

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NZ will turn into India if thats the case. Most of these students cant speak English and probably come from fake Universities in Asia!

It should be difficult to get into NZ for everyone!

And Local NZ folk should be encouraged to go to uni, not being looked over due to the $$$$
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Old Jun 5th 2010, 10:41 pm
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Default Re: Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

Kaz, have you had much to do with university in NZ. What makes you think that NZ will turn into India? What does that even mean?
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Old Jun 5th 2010, 11:43 pm
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Default Re: Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

The point i made about India (or any other country for that matter)
Is that loads of people from the Less developed world will turn up in NZ and abuse the uni system to claim residency if they make this a policy

In the UK there have been cases of overseas students from fake high schools, i'm sure many of those apply to NZ as well
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Old Jun 6th 2010, 1:54 am
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Default Re: Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

Originally Posted by KazUK View Post
The point i made about India (or any other country for that matter)
Is that loads of people from the Less developed world will turn up in NZ and abuse the uni system to claim residency if they make this a policy
From places like the UK maybe?
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Old Jun 6th 2010, 2:19 am
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Default Re: Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

So are we saying that only people from richer, developed countries should be allowed residency?
The fact remains that anyone who studied at a New Zealand University gets additional points during the EOI process, so somebody with a degree from one of these Univeristies has a good chance of getting residency anyway. Anyone with the right qualifications can get on the degree courses, and anyone with the brains can pass the course.
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Old Jun 6th 2010, 2:27 am
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Default Re: Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

Originally Posted by KazUK View Post

NZ will turn into India if thats the case. Most of these students cant speak English and probably come from fake Universities in Asia!
This seems to be a rather wild, inflamatory, racist and untrue statement.

Or to put it another way ... What a load of crap!
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Old Jun 6th 2010, 2:31 am
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Default Re: Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

it isn't a very sensible thing to do.

they drive us crazy (more and more) I think.

Last edited by crap coffee; Jun 6th 2010 at 2:33 am.
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Old Jun 6th 2010, 3:01 am
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Default Re: Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

Originally Posted by KazUK View Post

NZ will turn into India if thats the case. Most of these students cant speak English and probably come from fake Universities in Asia!
$$$$
I work with international university students and find this comment quite offensive. In the past I have been responsible for assessing applications to study and it can be quite a rigourous process I can tell you, much harder than it is for NZ students. In fact if domestic students had to meet the international entry requirements quite frankly many wouldn't (literacy/English language being a prime example).

And yes a small number of international students do abuse the system and arrive here with no intention of being a genuine student but let's compare that to the large number of domestic studrnts who have the same attitude shall we? I'm pretty sure most if not all reading this will have heard of the fun domestic students have at a certain NZ uni - couch burning or Undie 500 ring any bells?

I could parade a far larger number of hard working high achieving international students than I could of lazy ones who are here to abuse the system. Mind you, if domestic students had to pay anywhere near as much in fees as internationals maybe they wouldn't take their uni education quite so much for granted and more would work as hard.

Here's another thing - just how many of our wonderful domestic students turn their back on their country once they have the coverted qualification and take the benefit elsewhere?

I'm not saying that I agree with the idea of automatically granting PR, but I can't condone the sweeping statement that you have made.
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Old Jun 6th 2010, 7:35 am
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Default Re: Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

I agree with your sentiments regarding overseas students entirely Woodpigeon, but think that this comment is a bit out of order.

Here's another thing - just how many of our wonderful domestic students turn their back on their country once they have the coverted qualification and take the benefit elsewhere?

We (I am a kiwi) don't turn our back on our country, the reality is that we often have to venture overseas to gain experience in our chosen field...or just to broaden our horizons. A large number also return to NZ, in fact there was an artical in NZNewsUK (Feb 2010) that stated numbers returning to NZ outnumbered those leaving. I guess there is a "problem" with brain drain in NZ, but that is the nature of the size of population. Unfortunately not everyone wants to live in Auckland, that was the choice I faced, move to Auckland or move overseas, I chose the UK.

http://www.nznewsuk.co.uk/recruitment/?id=6344

Back to the topic. International students generally have a reputation as working extremely hard (and paying extortionate fees). What confuses me is if we have such a bad standard of education why do we attract so many overseas students
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Old Jun 6th 2010, 9:20 am
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Default Re: Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

The biggest issue for integration would be speaking good levels of English, as regards India the biggest issue there is that the populations is over qualified and without well paying employment.

NZ must be careful with this as Australia has found the flood gates opening with hairdressing students and the like, who then get PR. The education industry for such things has become big business, so now they are having to tackle the thorny issue the economy suffers whilst a business sector (education) readjusts to a lower level of income.
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Old Jun 6th 2010, 12:53 pm
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Default Re: Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

Originally Posted by Robbo25 View Post
The biggest issue for integration would be speaking good levels of English, as regards India the biggest issue there is that the populations is over qualified and without well paying employment.

NZ must be careful with this as Australia has found the flood gates opening with hairdressing students and the like, who then get PR. The education industry for such things has become big business, so now they are having to tackle the thorny issue the economy suffers whilst a business sector (education) readjusts to a lower level of income.
Integration is the key here
When i was in NZ i saw plenty of Asian (indian, chinese, Hong Kong) students who had awful english. Obviously the Universities are looking at how much money they cn make. How can these students integrate in NZ when they cant speak english

If this policy was put into practice NZ would end up a mess like the UK, where ghettos of minorities exist, where people dont have to learn english ever

NZ should be tougher on tackling the scammers who try and exploit the system

i'm not being inflammatory, just warning of the dire future nz could face by possibly turning into the uk
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Old Jun 6th 2010, 1:21 pm
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Default Re: Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

This notion of the UK being a mess because of immigration always makes me laugh, the UK is a mess for a variety of reasons, many much more so than immigration.
Every western economy, the Uk and Nz included, will suffer in the next 50 years from declining birth rates and and increased life expectancy, meaning that fewer numbers of working people will be paying for a greater number of dependents. The only way to solve that problem is to allow more people in from abroad of a working age.
In any case, anyone seeking residency in Nz has to pass English language tests, so what's the problem? If they're able enough and have enough qualifications then they're allowed in, if not then they re not. After all, who's more valuable to NZ, a 22 year old Asian graduate with 45 working years ahead of them or a middle aged Englishman with about 20 years working life left and possible impending health problems?
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Old Jun 6th 2010, 1:50 pm
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Default Re: Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

With respect Kaz..you are 24, you have only ever spent a few weeks in the north island. How do you get make these generalisations?

How many students did you meet? How could you tell that they were not holiday makers? How do you not know that they were not here as language students?

I think you might have to spend a bit more time here to have a qualified opinion.

NZ is a different country to the UK.
It does not exist purely to give recent UK grads a chance at utopia.
plenty of people come here expecting a less buggered version of britain
it's not. It's New Zealand and no longer a colony.

Seriously, if migrants bother you - don't come.
If languages other than English bother you - don't come as NZ has 3 official languages.
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Old Jun 6th 2010, 2:50 pm
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Default Re: Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

Fair enough, i know i shouldnt be making generalisations

Just dont want NZ to jump to 5 million people overnight and be ruined

Its a great place

I like the mix of people and cultures

just dont want NZ to have a border problem like the UK
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Old Jun 6th 2010, 3:46 pm
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Default Re: Disgraceful if Overseas Students Allowed to Get Residency in NZ!

Originally Posted by KazUK View Post
just dont want NZ to have a border problem like the UK
On that point alone I would agree BUT I believe NZ has pretty good control of its borders with appropriate (tough) immigration rules and few if any shortcuts.

Lets face it the UK is even PREVENTED from applying an english language test for European doctors - a profession if ever there was one where speaking english properly is a matter of life and death...
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