Can’t believe this has happened!
#1
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 22
Can’t believe this has happened!
My husband & I along with our four children have been living in NZ for almost two years & after a very rocky start (for those of you that have read my other post you’ll know what I mean) everything has been going great, my husband’s job is going well, the kids are enjoying school & we’ve made some very good friends. It’s almost time for us to renew or work/school permits etc & something has recently happened that we are really worried will ruin everything....
Our 16 year old daughter got picked up by some friends & it turns out the person driving had taken his parents car without consent, our daughter got out of the car as soon as she knew it had been stolen. The boy who had taken the car set fire to it trying to hide what he had done & obviously the police are involved. Along with the others involved they are charging my daughter with ‘unlawfully gets into a motor vehicle & arson’. There were four people involved (including my daughter) & three (including my daughter) are saying my daughter didn’t know the car had been stolen & didn’t help with setting it on fire, but the boy who took the car has is trying to blame everyone else & is saying she did. So it’s going to court. My daughter has never been in any kind of trouble before but all the others have history with the police (my daughter didn’t know this as she hadn’t known them for long).
Obviously we know we have to tell immigration but how do you think this will affect our permit applications? Will they turn us down for this & send us back to the UK? The court date isn’t due until a couple of months after our permits need renewing. Any advice or help is greatly appreciated.
Our 16 year old daughter got picked up by some friends & it turns out the person driving had taken his parents car without consent, our daughter got out of the car as soon as she knew it had been stolen. The boy who had taken the car set fire to it trying to hide what he had done & obviously the police are involved. Along with the others involved they are charging my daughter with ‘unlawfully gets into a motor vehicle & arson’. There were four people involved (including my daughter) & three (including my daughter) are saying my daughter didn’t know the car had been stolen & didn’t help with setting it on fire, but the boy who took the car has is trying to blame everyone else & is saying she did. So it’s going to court. My daughter has never been in any kind of trouble before but all the others have history with the police (my daughter didn’t know this as she hadn’t known them for long).
Obviously we know we have to tell immigration but how do you think this will affect our permit applications? Will they turn us down for this & send us back to the UK? The court date isn’t due until a couple of months after our permits need renewing. Any advice or help is greatly appreciated.
#2
Re: Can’t believe this has happened!
Eh? You don't have to tell Immigration anything about anything at the moment.
What type of permits are you on. Temporary work permits?
....edit....
Have read the previous posts. Must be temp work permits then. Were/are you not in a position to go on to apply for PR then? Just asking seeing as you are thinking to renew work permits .
Character checks are for those aged 17 and over I believe.
Please have a read HERE
What type of permits are you on. Temporary work permits?
....edit....
Have read the previous posts. Must be temp work permits then. Were/are you not in a position to go on to apply for PR then? Just asking seeing as you are thinking to renew work permits .
Character checks are for those aged 17 and over I believe.
Please have a read HERE
Last edited by BEVS; Jan 26th 2011 at 4:50 am.
#3
Banned
Joined: Jul 2010
Location: Queensland, Australia
Posts: 1,010
Re: Can’t believe this has happened!
I'd forget about it.
If you need to supply a police check for her visa it could possibly come up then, but only if she has a record - which she won't if the court hearing is after the visa application.
Why on earth did this kid torch his parents' car?!
Count your blessings that she's still in one piece.
When my daughter was that age there's no way I would have let her mates drive her anywhere. I know its hard to chose your kids mates and tell them who they can/can't associate with but some parental weeding-out may be needed. If she's got any sense she'll have realised herself that some of her mates are Trouble
If you need to supply a police check for her visa it could possibly come up then, but only if she has a record - which she won't if the court hearing is after the visa application.
Why on earth did this kid torch his parents' car?!
Count your blessings that she's still in one piece.
When my daughter was that age there's no way I would have let her mates drive her anywhere. I know its hard to chose your kids mates and tell them who they can/can't associate with but some parental weeding-out may be needed. If she's got any sense she'll have realised herself that some of her mates are Trouble
Last edited by Expat Kiwi; Jan 26th 2011 at 4:51 am.
#4
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 22
Re: Can’t believe this has happened!
Thank you for your replies
Hi Bevs
Yes it’s Temporary work permits...i’m not sure if we can just apply for PR I thought we had to have had 2 work permits first, (i’ll have to check that). Thank you for the link.
We thought we had to tell them because on the student application in section D it say’s ‘all applicants must complete this section –Have you been convicted, charged or under investigation’ (but you don’t have to supply police certificates for under 17’s).
Hi Expat Kiwi,
She has already attended two court hearings (status hearing) to see if there was enough evidence to have a main hearing. At the main hearing the witnesses that say she didn’t do it will be able to give their evidence & hopefully it will be ok from there. But as she has already had the status hearings won’t that show up?
The kid that took the car thought he could return it before his parents got home & when he realised he couldn’t he tried to make it look like someone else had stolen it. If I had known they came in a car she wouldn’t have gone but they didn’t come up the driveway so I didn’t see it. She hardly knew the driver & as for the ‘friend’ she did know, looking at him you would not believe he would ever have been in trouble. I’m usually a good judge of Character & I never clocked it. Although my daughter is 16 she doesn’t like to go out in the evenings etc & has only seen this ‘friend’ at school (where he is no trouble) & when he has been to our house after school so she hadn’t seen the other side of him.
Thank you for your help
Hi Bevs
Yes it’s Temporary work permits...i’m not sure if we can just apply for PR I thought we had to have had 2 work permits first, (i’ll have to check that). Thank you for the link.
We thought we had to tell them because on the student application in section D it say’s ‘all applicants must complete this section –Have you been convicted, charged or under investigation’ (but you don’t have to supply police certificates for under 17’s).
Hi Expat Kiwi,
She has already attended two court hearings (status hearing) to see if there was enough evidence to have a main hearing. At the main hearing the witnesses that say she didn’t do it will be able to give their evidence & hopefully it will be ok from there. But as she has already had the status hearings won’t that show up?
The kid that took the car thought he could return it before his parents got home & when he realised he couldn’t he tried to make it look like someone else had stolen it. If I had known they came in a car she wouldn’t have gone but they didn’t come up the driveway so I didn’t see it. She hardly knew the driver & as for the ‘friend’ she did know, looking at him you would not believe he would ever have been in trouble. I’m usually a good judge of Character & I never clocked it. Although my daughter is 16 she doesn’t like to go out in the evenings etc & has only seen this ‘friend’ at school (where he is no trouble) & when he has been to our house after school so she hadn’t seen the other side of him.
Thank you for your help
#5
Re: Can’t believe this has happened!
D1 Have you been:
convicted • Yes No
charged • Yes No
under investigation • Yes No
for any offence(s) against the law in any country?
So that requires an answer even for 16yr olds.
Form is here
I´d consult an immigration lawyer in NZ asap.
Go by forms and facts, your reading was right, "don´t worry about it" I´m afraid isn´t an option.
Last edited by simonsi; Jan 26th 2011 at 8:14 am.
#6
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 22
Re: Can’t believe this has happened!
Hi Simonsi,
Thank you for your reply, I was afraid that would be the case...I just wish we could afford an immigration Lawyer
Thank you for your reply, I was afraid that would be the case...I just wish we could afford an immigration Lawyer
Last edited by Treyarna; Jan 26th 2011 at 8:55 am. Reason: added a bit
#7
Re: Can’t believe this has happened!
Many will do an initial discussion for free to assess the case, may be worth asking as you have nothing to lose. Your daughter may also qualify for legal support for the case?? As always, you'll need to be open and straight with NZIS....
#8
Re: Can’t believe this has happened!
Hi
I'm sorry I can't offer any help just wanted to say I really hope you can get this mess sorted out and it does not spoil your chances of staying in NZ for you & your family
Angela x
I'm sorry I can't offer any help just wanted to say I really hope you can get this mess sorted out and it does not spoil your chances of staying in NZ for you & your family
Angela x
#9
Re: Can’t believe this has happened!
In general terms I see your visa being granted without problems and as a minor she should follow yours - but openess with NZIS is the key, I'll bet they've seen this type of situation before, however horrific it is to you.
#10
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 22
Re: Can’t believe this has happened!
Thank you Angela
Simonsi, Thank you so much for taking the time to help me I really appreciate it. I will see if I can find an immigration Lawyer to do a free initial discussion-We did have an emergency fund but I had to go back to the UK for my dad's funeral & to sort out his estate so that wipped it out. The police have said that even if she were to be found guilty, it would be a smack on the wrist as they put it as she is a minor & has never been in any kind of trouble before, we were just worrying about the effect on the permits....so hopefully it will be ok & your answer has given me some reassurance. Thank you for your help
Simonsi, Thank you so much for taking the time to help me I really appreciate it. I will see if I can find an immigration Lawyer to do a free initial discussion-We did have an emergency fund but I had to go back to the UK for my dad's funeral & to sort out his estate so that wipped it out. The police have said that even if she were to be found guilty, it would be a smack on the wrist as they put it as she is a minor & has never been in any kind of trouble before, we were just worrying about the effect on the permits....so hopefully it will be ok & your answer has given me some reassurance. Thank you for your help
Last edited by Treyarna; Jan 26th 2011 at 8:53 pm. Reason: added some
#11
Re: Can’t believe this has happened!
Never mind what she may actually get, worst case is she gets the max penalty for that offence if she is found guilty, check out what that is, if NZIS understand that say the max penalty is less than 2yrs then they may have little interest once informed....
#12
Re: Can’t believe this has happened!
Just wanted to wish you luck with everything.....must be such a worry for you, it sounds as though it's been a really tough lesson for your daughter, fingerscrossed hope it all works out OK for you all
#13
Re: Can’t believe this has happened!
Remember that to get a criminal conviction they need to prove the case beyond reasonable doubt.
Immigration lawyer only comes into the picture if she is found guilty. She should not make any kind of guilty plea without consulting with an immigration lawyer. Also consider that a criminal conviction may stop her entering countries other than New Zealand in future.
You need to find the resources, sorry - if you are genuinely destitute then perhaps there are sources of pro-bono legal advice.
#14
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 22
Re: Can’t believe this has happened!
Thank you to you all who are sending good wishes & helping me with this...
JAJ, Because of her age (16) my daughter has been appointed a (free of charge) solicitor by the court for the case. The police have never officially taken a statement from her but are proceeding anyway as the boy who took the car said she was involved - even though all the others including her say she wasn’t, so she is denying the charges.
As we have to send in our permit renewals before the court case is due...I wonder what immigration are likely to do? I wonder if they are likely to hold off making the permit decision until she has been to court as if we were sent back before then she wouldn’t be here for the case?
JAJ, Because of her age (16) my daughter has been appointed a (free of charge) solicitor by the court for the case. The police have never officially taken a statement from her but are proceeding anyway as the boy who took the car said she was involved - even though all the others including her say she wasn’t, so she is denying the charges.
As we have to send in our permit renewals before the court case is due...I wonder what immigration are likely to do? I wonder if they are likely to hold off making the permit decision until she has been to court as if we were sent back before then she wouldn’t be here for the case?
#15
Re: Can’t believe this has happened!
Given the competing timescales I wouldn't just send the permit applications in but take them in personally and request an interview to explain the circumstances, staying beyond permission is a BIG no-no and will jeopordise any permit in NZ in the future for anyone overstaying so you must get the position clear with NZIS before your current permits run out.
Try and push her FOC counsel to give or get a view (again FOC if they do it), of the immigration impact, potentially getting them to write a covering letter you could present to NZIS...
If they haven't taken a statement then that is "interesting" as they don't know what her statement in response to their case will be....I'm surprised.
In the meantime get a list together of character references willing to give statements, in court if needed, in support of her good character - has her counsel requested that?? Has she been formally charged? If so what with?
Happy to discuss by pm if you would rather....
Try and push her FOC counsel to give or get a view (again FOC if they do it), of the immigration impact, potentially getting them to write a covering letter you could present to NZIS...
If they haven't taken a statement then that is "interesting" as they don't know what her statement in response to their case will be....I'm surprised.
In the meantime get a list together of character references willing to give statements, in court if needed, in support of her good character - has her counsel requested that?? Has she been formally charged? If so what with?
Happy to discuss by pm if you would rather....
Last edited by simonsi; Jan 28th 2011 at 1:11 am.