Bo-Jangles

In context with the question from the same OP:

http://britishexpats.com/forum/new-z...ckland-836649/

vetnurse1

Just a few holiday snaps I took last month on my UK trip I thought might be relevant.
These are a few of my favourite things.... Gu puds currently $7.99 in New World, Craft beers around $8-10 per bottle here.

Bo-Jangles

It's expected that you negotiate and you really should not accept their first offer - they always have some flex so you should try asking for 10 to 15% more - even if they went up by another $5k that affords you some play money, a holiday or a flight to the UK each year.

barnsleymat

I find it bizarre how some expats deny that groceries, drinks etc aren't a complete rip off here in NZ, I had a look the other night at the Countdown online prices and the Asda prices. It's plain to see how much extra we pay in NZ, tins of soup for 25p, Pasta Sauce for 60p, 1.50 for quorn, jar of Pesto for a quid, a loaf for 49p etc etc etc. We're forced to pay an absolute premium for basic foods here and there's no where cheaper than the supermarkets in NZ, in the UK you can go to markets, discount supermarkets, discount shops, poundlands and pay even less. Why on earth people here deny this makes no sense. Even after being here 3 years the awful feeling of being ripped off never gets any better.

I recently downloaded a UK TV program about the pound shops chains, me and my missus couldn't believe what you could buy for a quid, we were shocked, most of the items would be $6+ here. We recently wallpapered and had to buy some paste, it cost $26 from Bunnings and is only a small bag, you can buy the same thing in the UK for a quid. This is just one of a huge list of things that make my blood boil due to the pricing.

And all this when we're paid pretty low wages.

GoingIn2011

I am a die hard NZ fan but even I (after years of denying it) acknowledge that NZ (particularly Auckland) is very expensive. 95k with a family will be extremely tight.

It does come down to what your mortgage liability is as this is the major chunk.
Our combined income is 175k and we still struggle with a family of three kids - honestly, we do, we have the world's shittest 20 year old car for a start - but then we pay $600 pw in rent, and will soon be paying $900 pw on a mortgage to live in Gulf Harbour (which is about 40kms from the cbd).

We live here because we love the vibe and the country. We dont live here because we think we are better off financially... although we wouldn't be loaded in the uk either...

jmh

I just got back from New World and spent around $100 on my weekly shop. I don't scrimp and save, I just throw it in without checking the price. I used to spend GBP60 on my weekly shop in 2011, so I guess it depends on what you usually buy as to how it compares.

If I was getting diy stuff I would probably go to the dollar shop first before I went to a chain. It's amazing how cheap stuff is there.

The Weezer

I think people who leave just decided they don't want to live in New Zealand anymore, for so many reasons. Nothing to do with being less "positive." I think when you realize you're stuck in NZ, then it really does help to try as hard as possible to look on the bright side, as people must when they find themselves in straitened circumstances.

Anyway, are you saying British Expats is not a good source of reliable information for emigrants? If people people can't depend on comments on forums for advice, why are we all bothering spending time on here trying to help? By your own estimation, I should advise all good people reading this right now to disregard anything jmh says, as it might be completely unreliable.

TommyLuck

But the Gu puds you've posted a photo of are on offer. If they weren't they'd be £4 - so about the same price.

As per the beer, $8-$10 is not the range of a craft beer here. You can get craft beer in NZ for less than $8.

Whilst I agree that beer is more expensive;

a.) The UK has more beer drinkers than NZ has people. Therefore more people buy and more competition.

b.) Many of these so-called 'craft' beers in the UK are actually brewed by companies owned by Diageo, et al, who have been very smart to jump on to the craft beer bandwagon. They can keep the price down because they produce in such vast quantities, profit margins allow for the sale of their beer at a lower price.

c.) The NZ craft beers by comparison are largely brewed by independents. You'll find that those beers brewed by genuine independents (of which there is much lower proportion in the market) in the UK also tend to be available at a premium price.

TommyLuck

I would never deny that the NZ doesn't often offer these bargain prices - I do question question the quality and nutritional value of these 'bargain' products however.

If you're buying quality food in the UK or NZ in my experience you pay about the same price.

With little to no scrimping (cooking is increasing becoming a hobby of mine) our weekly shopping bill in London was about £100 to £120 a week. Here it's $200 to $250 a week.

As a general rule, unless it's a condiment, a herb or a spice, I didn't buy food packaged in tins*, card board boxes** or sealed plastics** in the UK, nor do I in NZ - by and large it's bought fresh, although might be frozen if necessary, particularly meat. Rarely do I buy a pre-frozen product.

* I do buy chick peas, cannelini beans, kidney beans, black beans and tinned tomotoes.
** I buy Cous-Cous, Porridge and a Hubbard's Cereal in a Cardboard box.
*** I buy pasta (fresh or dried) and rice in plastic packaging.

Grayling

That is rubbish....There are now hundreds of independent 'micro' and independent breweries in the UK which compete with the major breweries on price......and also sell to supermarkets and are sold at the same price as the majors.

Are you also claiming that none of the NZ 'craft' breweries are also owned by major companies?

TommyLuck

If you did a modicum of reading about this subject you'd soon find out that they do this because they have to and most of all they don't like doing it. Profit margins suffer, the quality of their future output and their plans to grow subsequently suffer - people lose jobs, or work more hours for the same or less money ... the cycle goes on.

Not unlike the local shop keeper trying to compete with Tesco.

Many are simply backed financially by the big boys trying to hide their influence from organisations like CAMRA - although CAMRA people usually find it in small print somewhere.


I don't see anywhere I claimed anything of the sort;

"The NZ craft beers by comparison are largely brewed by independents."

I'm sure this will change as Lion Red get their house in order over time. But at no time did I claim anything as specific as you suggest or indeed use the word 'none'.



PS Ron Jeremy? Brilliant!

Grayling

this is a subject that I do know a lot about having been involved with brewing and microbreweries in the UK, US and Australia for many years

It seems that you are the one who needs to do a bit more reading

There are hundreds of independent breweries in the UK. Virtually any city or town of any size will have at least two or three....probably far more per head of population than There are in NZ.

BTW the concept of 'craft' beers in the UK does not really exist because 'real' ales have been around for centuries unlike here or NZ where it has only recently made a revival after many years of lack of competition and poor quality

TommyLuck

Nah, I'm good. I'm pretty sure I know what I'm on about. It's not just about brewing beer, or distilling whiskey, it's about business and economics. And if a particular brewery does a bit to well for the big drinks companies liking - they'll buy it out with an offer they can't refuse.

Anyway, I could claim that I grew up in pubs, my parents were publicans, as were my grandparent and uncles and aunts. Many of my best friends had parents in the pub trade - families whose wealth has been built (and then destroyed) by the value of beer and breweries that provide it - bit unfair to lay blame solely at the breweries door on that. Poor business decisions also account for the failures.

I've heard it all.

But I wont.

I'm well aware of the micro-breweries that are popping up all over the world in fact, without having the stats at hand, not many of these breweries are selling on a national scale.

They're akin to the plumber or electrician who works within say a 30 mile radius of his home. Most of the beers you find in a Supermarket are not from micro-breweries, you might have the odd local one and in certain brewing strong holds a few more. But the supermarkets will still have their deals making sure a certain proportion of the shelves are stacked with a far higher proportion of their beers.

And when they start doing well Diageo (or whoever) usually come knocking. I'm amazed that the St Austell brewery with the success of Tribute hasn't been bought out yet. Sticking to their Cornish roots! Good on them.

Down the road however Sharp's, on a (UK) national scale built on the success of Doom Bar were bought out by Molson Coors in 2011.

Thanks for a brief education on the history of beer in the UK. Are you trying to be patronising ... ?


We're getting away from the point of my original objection and the OP original post more importantly - as this still comes down the the fact that a supermarket in the UK can buy on such a scale that beer which is a luxury product is always going to be more expensive in a country like to NZ.

The market of beer drinkers in the UK outnumbers every man, woman and child in New Zealand, probably more than twice over. Or more. So the argument should really come down to pure economics.


That said, the best place to have this discussion is probably over a beer anyway

Where in earth are you based - Queensland? You seem to be posting a lot on their forum.

If you're ever in Auckland I'd very much like to take this discussion further as the future of the brewing industry is a interesting topic.

barnsleymat

Yep, Pak n Save is world renowned for it's quality foods. Aisle after aisle of quality nutritious foods. It's always reminds me of a Tuscan farmers market.

TommyLuck

Bahahaha.

My nearest Pak n Save is 20 mins drive away - I have at least one New World and 2 Countdown's within a 5 minute drive of home.

So I'm comparing a combination of New World and Countdown in Ponsonby, Grey Lynn and Freemans Bay, the Westmere Butcher and Fruit World, Grey Lynn in NZ with Morrisons in Brentford, Tesco in Osterly, Sainsbury in Chiswick and the Swiss Cottage Farmers Market in the UK.