greenapple

I have job offers for both Netherlands and UK as an IT Consultant. I do have plans to migrate to Australia and working on the application (Finalizing the requirements before submission) when these Europe offers came in. I am considering taking it as the waiting period is min. of 15months for the Australia migration.

My wife works in ICT industry as a System and network administrator, on his way getting certification for his skills. I would like to ask help on the pros and cons of moving to UK or Netherlands. If I were to move only, I would think that Netherlands would be the best due to the lower cost of living and tax (my employer says that they have the 30% tax benefit, and the remaining 70% would be taxed up to 30% only), compared to UK's 40% and high cost of living. I am primarily worried that as I plan to have my wife come with me, if she could easily get a job in Netherlands. UK may seem to be a better option for us given this scenario.

To give you reference, the base salary offered to me for Netherlands is 45K Euro/annum and 45K GBP/annum for UK.

Need info on:
1. Housing - Estimate cost
2. Tax - Estimate (Does it have lots of tax in UK? I read that they have license tax just to watch tv, and interest in your bank has it. Is it true that Netherlands tax is higher?)
3. Monthly Expense

Need to make the decision soon. Hope to hear favorable response from you guys. Thanks.

furkew

Hi there Greenapple,

first of all welcome to BE. There is a reasonable amount of advice on this forum to give you a reasonable idea about Holland. Look at my post on this forum (not my waffle on the Oz forum) and see if it sounds any good to you guys.


You made a few points asking about housing, tax & expenses.

Everything is dependant on where you are in the UK, and where you are in Holland. Are you buying, or renting, do you have an extravagant lifestyle or are you a fairly homely couple ?

I have lived here for 20 years, and all my family and friends (and clients) are in the UK, so I have a pretty good idea in my head what is better, but it all depends on situation. 45k UK is definitely better than 45K Holland, (pounds/euros) but does the Dutch salary include holiday pay, 13th month, Taxed as an expat or Dutch rules ? all makes a real big difference.

I dont know where you are from, but if you want to call me on skype sometime (search for furkew), or PM me feel free. I am away this weekend (off to England for the rugby) but next week I am about.

Drop me a line, or just post any questions here and myself and others will try to help.

Paul.

greenapple

Thanks for the quick response. I've gone thru most of the discussions before I wrote my post. Most of the forums came from nearby countries.

THe UK package is fairly straightforward - taxed at around 40% they said, 2 weeks paid leave, medical benefits for me (wife not included). For Netherlands, its the 30% tax benefit, 70% taxable (They said that it can be taxed to a max of 30% only? is that true? Found some links saying that tax is quite high in Netherlands...).

We're fairly a home couple. We live in asia now, renting because we have plans to eventually migrate to Australia. I'm working on the requirements for now when the offer came. I'm just thinking that UK may be a good alternative in the long run in case the Australia won't work, since English is the medium of communication. We don't have kids yet, maybe in the next 3-5 yrs. BUt from what research I'm doing, Netherlands is supposed to be much advanced in technology wise - like faster internet connection - which is critical for me because this is the cheapest mode of communication to relatives way across the globe.

I haven't gone thru housing as well. The sites I've gone thru says I need about 800GBP min for monthly house that's cramped as against NEtherlands fairly open spaces.

And major consideration is my wife's career. As she's in IT here in asia, I wouldn't want her to sacrifice everything.

Benefits wise, I think the UK can offer a lot in terms of long term future - we may probably decide to live there for good, or maybe not.

Here's what I have so far for UK (a friend's note from his friend who works in UK):
Tax – There are a lot of taxes to take note of when you live in UK.
Income Tax: Any of the rates mentioned above would take in about 40% income tax. 10% for 4,895-6895, 22% for up to 32,400, and 40% for above that.
VAT: Goods (with exemption of food) have 17.5% VAT.
Council Tax: This is paid for your housing. Not sure what is the agreement with your company of who’s to pay the housing. But there is a council tax you pay annually, and may vary from area to area.

Cost of Living – UK, particularly London, is the most expensive city in Europe and is in the Top 5 of the highest cost of living in the world. An average weekly grocery bill for 2 people would be around 60-90GBP.

Other expenses you may want to consider when moving are:
Internet connection – Broadband connection is the best. Would you be bringing a laptop from the Philippines? It’s a cheaper way to communicate with family and relatives than calling.
Mobile/ Phone line – You may need to ask your office if they will provide, or would you need to apply on your own. Check the best package, and cheapest option that you could use well. If you’re not planning on staying long, best keep away from the subscriptions with long contract. It would be best to have one at least so that your employer would be able to contact you.
Television License – There’s a fee in order to watch TV aside from the 4 channels, I think. Different rates apply for colored and B&W TV. If you’re caught watching without it, there is a penalty to pay.
Driving License – are you planning on driving around UK? If you are, be sure to bring your driver’s license, or an international driver’s license if you have one (have you gotten one for the US trip you had?). Note that this is only allowed for a year, and you’ll need to apply, take the test after a year. A lot of taxes and other expenses are also related to having a car such as parking, etc.


If UK, where is the best palce to live? IF Netherlands, where?

furkew

For Netherlands, its the 30% tax benefit, 70% taxable (They said that it can be taxed to a max of 30% only? is that true? Found some links saying that tax is quite high in Netherlands...).

dont know the full details about expats and tax laws, but tax is high, but tax rebate at the end of the year is always pretty good, and other perks like 13th month & holiday pay (1 extra month pay in May) help balance things

BUt from what research I'm doing, Netherlands is supposed to be much advanced in technology wise - like faster internet connection - which is critical for me because this is the cheapest mode of communication to relatives way across the globe.

internet is faster and cheaper. At the moment a broadband 7mb or faster, broadband telephone line & digital tv through the broadband (30+channels) is about 50.00 euros p.m.Some providers are offering 20mb plus quite cheap. Almost every provider is no data limit.

I haven't gone thru housing as well. The sites I've gone thru says I need about 800GBP min for monthly house that's cramped as against NEtherlands fairly open spaces.

housing is not cheap, but definitely cheaper than London and the South in general. Very Nice house (unfurnished) about 1000/1200 euro p.m

And major consideration is my wife's career. As she's in IT here in asia, I wouldn't want her to sacrifice everything.

thats something you will have to research yourself. Try Shell, Octrioraad (patent office) Sarah Lee all big companies with quite a few expats in Holland.


Here's what I have so far for UK (a friend's note from his friend who works in UK):
Tax – There are a lot of taxes to take note of when you live in UK.
Income Tax: Any of the rates mentioned above would take in about 40% income tax. 10% for 4,895-6895, 22% for up to 32,400, and 40% for above that.
VAT: Goods (with exemption of food) have 17.5% VAT.
Council Tax: This is paid for your housing. Not sure what is the agreement with your company of who’s to pay the housing. But there is a council tax you pay annually, and may vary from area to area.

Cost of Living – UK, particularly London, is the most expensive city in Europe and is in the Top 5 of the highest cost of living in the world. An average weekly grocery bill for 2 people would be around 60-90GBP.

all the above could probably refer to Holland fairly well. Shopping Dutch is cheaper, buying British style food is dearer.Holland was voted nr 3 as the most desirable country to live in (Oz nr1) due to all the above factors and more.

Other expenses you may want to consider when moving are:
Internet connection – Broadband connection is the best. Would you be bringing a laptop from the Philippines? It’s a cheaper way to communicate with family and relatives than calling.
Mobile/ Phone line – You may need to ask your office if they will provide, or would you need to apply on your own. Check the best package, and cheapest option that you could use well. If you’re not planning on staying long, best keep away from the subscriptions with long contract. It would be best to have one at least so that your employer would be able to contact you.
Television License – There’s a fee in order to watch TV aside from the 4 channels, I think. Different rates apply for colored and B&W TV. If you’re caught watching without it, there is a penalty to pay.
Driving License – are you planning on driving around UK? If you are, be sure to bring your driver’s license, or an international driver’s license if you have one (have you gotten one for the US trip you had?). Note that this is only allowed for a year, and you’ll need to apply, take the test after a year. A lot of taxes and other expenses are also related to having a car such as parking, etc.

Tv license - none
mobile phone bills - cheap if you use it normally / most companies issue mobiles
Broadband - your company will probably provide internet connection if you work in IT
Company car - not cheap, but if you have one always cheaper than buying
driving license - dont know the full ins and outs, but if you have a UK you just swap it.
home parking - inner cities normally permits, mostly free, outer city, towns same or just free. Shopping parking varies, mostly pay and display, not cheap, not dear (except amsterdam)

where to live ?

where will you work ? the million dollar question. IMO if you can live in Limburg, Brabant, Drenthe, Zeeland etc then you will be set up. maybe a bit quiet for some, but plenty of room, and cheaper living

hope this helps.

Paul

greenapple

Thanks Furkew. How about in UK? Do you think the 45K GBP/annum is livable in UK? We're softening towards the UK idea because I don't want my family to suffer much in moving. Having an English background is the most comfty (although comparing Netherlands offer, it would be the only con againsts the many lists of pros).

furkew

I'm sure you should be fine in the UK on that sort of salary. It will give you a slightly better lifestyle than in Holland on 45k Euro's. (1.52euro = 1.00 pound)

I would recommend asking on the "moving back to the UK" forum for more advice about the UK general living costs. I can understand what you say about preferring the UK being the easier option for the whole family.

If I can help in any way, just let me know,

snowbunny

"family"? do you have children? what are their ages?

furkew

Hi there snowbunny,

How are you and Toon ?

snowbunny

working on getting him a job in IT.... truck driving definitely doesn't pay here unless you are willing to go days on the road without seeing your family.

He has the equivalent of a US bachelor's degree, but in nautical engineering so that's of no use. He has no professional work to show.... because the one thing is, you can work as a 'blue collar' worker in the Netherlands (and even in the UK) and get by, but you can't do it in the US.

Basically -- no one who lives in Europe can afford to leave unless they have a job that requires a university degree, unless they are an intra-company transferee. For him to work as a truck driver means saving no money because of me having to pick up his health insurance costs in full, etc. No money for retirement or debt.

So I'm biting all my fingernails off because I can't fully support the both of us.

Thanks for asking though!

With the pound so strong right now and the poster seeming to focus on money (which is wise, I think).... I'd go for the 45K GBP but so much is dependent on where one lives in the UK and if there are kids, the schools available.

furkew

I'm sorry that I asked now


I hope it all works out for you guys. It wont be for not trying. Toon has got his head screwed on properly, so dont worry.

Tell I said hi, and fingers crossed that he finds something soon.

Paul

snowbunny

I'll pass along the 'howdy'. Toon's bright enough; it's just cracking the American job market that's tough for anyone. Sure isn't a 13th month payment here!

Amy.

furkew

I'm definitely gonna miss that & the holiday pay down under.

greenapple

no kids yet. but 2-3 yrs timeframe i guess, and hopefully, stable already. Yep, hopefully he'd be able to get in an IT work.

Thanks for the info Furkew, Snowbunny. I don't have idea where to live. any ideas? The office is in Slough, Berkshire. But they say that we would be at clients often times, and we won't know until we get there. Id be posting in the UK forum then.

Thanks.

furkew

My parents & brother live in Maidenhead (10 minutes from Slough) My Sister in Windsor (10 minutes) and to buy in the area is about 300K for something OK.

Slough not the nicest of towns in the area. I lived most of my UK life in Maidenhead, and its a nice area. Half hour to Heathrow, less than one hour to the centre of London, Hour and a half to the south coast.

Go a bit further afield to Marlow, Henley, cookham, Ascot, etc more countrified, but add another 50K+ to a house price.

Paul

furkew

here are a few local towns on google earth.