islandergirl

As does Australia, over 25% off A&E admissions here are alcohol related but like many Brits who haven't lived anywhere else you are assuming that Britain is worse than all the other western countries- it ain't necessarily so.

jackuk

Point taken

cricket1again

I let my children drink at home when they reached 15. OK, I know that sounds irresponsible but it was only wine with dinner and there was method in my madness. It took the edge off them rushing out to rebel by binge drinking and by introducing them to a limited glass at home, they weren't too interested when they reached 18 because the lure of it had already gone. Plus we spent a lot of time in France and other parts of Europe where drinking, wine especially, is part of the culture. It's more civilised and the aim isn't to get drunk, it's more a sociable event.
My kids saw this and have never gone out just to get drunk. They've returned home tipsy at New Year but that's about it.

If you look at all britains favourite soaps, they are all based around pub life. Coronation Street, Emmerdale, Eastenders. Then if you look at Australian soaps, Home and away and Neighbours, it is a different story.
Can't help wondering if kids grow up thinking pub life is normal because that's how it's portrayed on TV.

jackuk

My parents introduced, my siblings and I to alcohol at an early age too, in a similar way to how you describe with the same intentions....their thinking was like yours.....four out of the six now have alcohol problems.....however although i don't think this helped, it was not the only cause...as in your case this did not occur ....my belief is that its a cultural and genetic problem


With my children I just neither encourage or discourage....thats all I can do

backagen

I would say if you're going to emigrate (or de-emigrate) with kids, then try to do it while they're as young as possible.

I was 15 when I moved here with my parents and I've never felt settled since (I'm now 34) despite moving back to UK when I was 19 and then back here again at the age of 21.

I realise it doesn't affect everyone to that extent but I have heard an awful lot of people say 15 or thereabouts is the worst possible age to emigrate.

islandergirl

Funny that Aussie soap operas are strictly middle class fresh vegetable eating, beach running, clean living paragons, but British are set in dreary inner suburbs with unattractive people living in poverty - there is a thesis in there for someone.

cricket1again

I think children quickly believe that they belong and try to fit in with the dominent influences around them. This is great if you live in an environment of positive influences but very difficult if it's the opposite. I've experienced both with varying results.
My children largely were brought up in Postman Pat Land (the Lake District). In our village, life was lived pretty much the same by everyone. We were all on the same income, same wavelength, same car, same house, same expectation. It was all very innocent and so all the children were on the same comfort level of experience and expectation. It really was idyllic.
Then we moved to the big smoke of Northampton, a much more populated, industrialised town verging on a city. We lived on the outskirts in a small village and within this village were three families who were an absolute nightmare.
You don't really want to hear this but the school introduced my daughter to three of the girls who belonged to these families. When I could see her going backwards, I asked the school why on earth had they done this. They told me that as the girls were from underpriviliged families they had hoped my daughter would be a good influence on them!! It worked in reverse because these girls were the dominant influence in the whole school. How naive of the school.
My daughter and I began having massive fights as i began the struggle to keep her on the straight and narrow while these girls had no boundaries. At least two of the girls mothers were on drugs and prostitutes. Talk about a culture shock.
My relationship with my daughter deteriorated for 4 years as I fought to keep my standards and her safety paramount. All three girls had babies at or before 15. Their mothers saw nothing wrong with allowing them to bring boyfriends home and sleep with them at 14. This was in quite an upmarket Northamptonshire village.
My son didn't get caught up in the same kind of groups and he made friends with boys from a similar background to ours but my daughter seemed to be a magnet for the wrong kind.
At the same time, she had been greatly traumatised by the death of a friend so I believe that half of it was her being on a self destruct mission. She didn't cope well with her friend dying at all despite counselling.
Anyway, the upshot is that my daughter came through it all unscathed (not sure i did). At 26 she has a very good job, never got pregnant or got into any kind of trouble despite the negative influences. I still have bad memories about the whole thing but I think kids work it out for themselves in the end and with good grounding they set themselves their own boundaries even if they sail a bit close to the wind sometimes.

I honestly believe Australia is in some ways a better place to bring up children mainly because the outdoor life provides a lot of much more healthier distractions. Whereas the UK climate coops them up indoors where they form much tighterknit groups which in turn leads to them to bond with a different kind of person. Where do UK kids go to have fun? Nightclubs and the town and city culture. Australian children tend to live life under the big sky and out in the open away from the influences of drink. One of the things that struck me most when I moved here was the family lifestyle where mum, dad and kids were all together on a beach.
Because Australia is so big, it is easier to spread out and have more space possibly to avoid being forced into a vacuum of a huge mix of people.

Thank God, I'm no longer bringing children up today but if I was I would say Australia is probably better for children upto a certain age but after this, the UK is better for young adults and mature adults purely because of learning and opportunity.

backagen

Well there's the thesis someone asked for right there!

That really is a fascinating story though Cricket and good to hear it worked out ok for your daughter in the end.

I would add two points to that though.
1.That while I agree that it's best to bring up children in a nice environment (obviously) I also know that Australia has it's fair share of bad environments and I have had dealings with people from lower socio-economic areas in Adelaide and generally their kids tend to get caught up in the same sort of negative influences Cricket mentioned (drugs, drink, crime, underage sex and early pregnancy). By the same token, there's many thousands of fantastic kids and teenagers in Britain and of course there's lots of very nice places in Britain to bring kids up in a healthy, drug free environment.

2. I had quite a privileged childhood and was fortunate enough to live in a very nice house in a very nice suburb in Britain and attend an excellent school until I was 14, then when we moved to Australia we once again lived in a nice area and I attended a school which I hated, but was actually quite a good school in its own way (that's a whole different thread!), Anyway the point is I lived in a nice environment both in UK and Australia and had a good education and basically everything a child could want. I have 2 sisters and they both had much the same upbringing as me (they are younger than me so obviously were younger when they emigrated though, but that's the only real difference). I have managed to do reasonably well for myself, as has one of my sisters, but the other one made friends with the wrong sort of kids, got into drugs and alcohol at the age of about 12 and despite my parents best efforts she continued to perform very poorly at school, left school early and has since become a mother who abandoned her child at 2 years of age (the father was a bank robber and car thief). She also became a heroin addict and prostitute and I'm not even sure if she is still alive now.

The point I'm making is really that whilst bringing kids up in the nicest, most positive environment you can is obviously very important and is indeed a parents essential duty, it does not guarantee your child will turn out to be successful or happy or healthy or nice. Ultimately you can only do your best for your kids but they will be who they want to be!

backagen

I don't think that's irresponsible at all. As long as you introduce them to alcohol as a way to enjoy a sociable event in a civilised way, and in small quantities (which you did) then that is a good thing. Something I think all parents should do. I can only assume not all parents do which is a shame because we probably wouldn't have anywhere near so many young people constantly binge drinking if they did.

Bevm

An American ones are all about the rich, and bizarre extreme situations. I believe they brought ebola virus into one plot thread.

I think you've hit on something important here!

BTW, on a different tack, I read somewhere that the under 30s in the States are showing a marked move away from suburbs to urban living and they're putting it down to the influence of Sesame Street. The program was designed to appeal to the children of the urban poor -- and hardly anyone urban wasn't poor back then -- but it's given the middle class kids who watched it a yearning to live on Sesame Street.

What was the dominant program for kids in the UK in the '70s and '80s?

Bev

backagen

Well I would be interested to know what evidence they have to support those claims! I watched sesame street as a kid every day but it most certainly did not make me want to live in anywhere that resembles the places on sesame street! It's like saying watching The Bill would make you want to live in the Cockroft estate where you can't walk on the street without being mugged, bombed or shot!!!

I reckon it would be a bit hard to name the dominant UK kids show in the 70s and 80s, there was so many of them and lots of them were very good.

My personal favourite was "Chocky" and that family lived in a very nice house, but I wasn't envious because so did my family!

cricket1again

Blue Peter, Crackerjack and Magpie. Don't you remember?

Fleaflyfloflum

I used to love banana splits

cricket1again

Oh and the Goodies, Beverley Hillbillies and Thunderbirds.

Fleaflyfloflum

Yes... i sometimes feel i am living amongst the beverly hillbillies down here