BristolUK

MAY be. Not is.


I can see it now.

Appeals Tribunal Chairman: "So, what's your justification for deciding the applicant deprived himself of the capital?"

Presenting Officer (on behalf of the Decision Maker): "Well it was on all the fourms Mr Chairman."

formula

That's what I said in the post above yours.

However, encouraging people to pay off debts when "there was no legal obligation to do so" means that the claimant is taking a gamble with any income based benefits they were hoping to receive; unless they have proof that DWP staff told them to do that.

Jay Bird

The "staff at the desks" have never had the authority to make decisions regarding a person's eligibilty for benefits. They are there to undertake the initial interview, gather information and pass it along to another member of staff (usually hidden away from public view, and not allowed to interact with the public), who should have been trained to understand the numerous rules and regulations.....and believe me, they are numerous. So don't sneer at something you obviously don't uderstand.

My inside knowledge of the machinations of the benefits system is what has jaded my view on those who seek to, and succeed in, abusing what should be a safety net for those genuinely in need.

formula

I think you will find that they use their manual as their guide.

formula

Unfortunately, some of these "staff at the desks" do give out wrong information. That's hardly a laughing (or sneering) matter, for the claimant who believes them. Hence why it is always best to get their information in writing.

BristolUK

No, you're getting it wrong again.

It's not for the applicant to prove. The Onus of Proof is for the decision maker.

I bolded that part.

BristolUK

Formula, I think you need to remember what prompted this discussion where you expressed surprise that benefits were in payment.

Namely the family that lived half way across the world where the children stayed and the poster ensured they had a roof over their heads while the parents divorced and one parent returned to the UK, with all the factors that entailed.

Some months down the road, having resettled but not managing to find work a benefit claim was made.

And you think that in all this the predominant or even significant intention was to get benefit.

Good luck proving that because the onus of proof would be on you as the decision maker.

formula

I've already said that it is for the decision maker to decide.

To help with that decision; if the claimant has proof in writing that the DWP encouraged them to pay off all their debts, then that would help the decision maker with W1.740 (on the link I gave above). ie the DWP/HB staff encouraged them in writing to pay off their credit card and then W1.740 helps the decision maker as the claimant did not know this would affect their entitlement to income based benefits.

charleygirl

I am happy to be able to say I have paid 30 years tax and contributions in the UK. So i do not feel badly a getting free health care if and when i need it.

And as for checking a box for having owned a home, I never owned a home.. my husband owned a home he paid every penny/cent of the mortgage.

formula

Not quite right: I asked if they had answered "yes" or "no" to the question on the benefits form that asked if they have ever owned a house in the UK or in a foreign country.

formula

That would have been a "no" on the form then. Thanks for being good enough to tell me.

BristolUK

But at least twice you said it was for the applicant to prove. It's not.

You seem to be confusing proof and making a decision.

BristolUK

Yes, exactly right.

Do you rewrite other history in your spare time as well?

Your first post on the subject was: Perhaps you forgot what you said.

charleygirl

Well not exactly because I dont recall that being a question "Did I ever own a home" but if it were then I would have said No, I did not fill in the form the woman behind the counter did.

Beedubya

And what would you have them do, these people that were born here? Stay in a country where they are miserable and can't afford health care, lose everything they have and end up living in a tent?

There are lots coming to this country wanting benefits and free NHS who weren't born here, some posters don't see a difference between the two categories, some of us do......