The Real NHS
#121
Banned
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 37
Re: The Real NHS
[QUOTE=nun;10291111]The strength of the NHS is that it delivers care free at the point of service without regard for your ability to pay. That is what makes it better than the US system.
Nun-sure it is "free" but you still pay taxes to support it and it is essentially dysfunctional. It is not better than the US system. I have worked in both and in terms of all clinical outcomes, the US system is far superior and at the end of the day healthcare is about clinical outcomes.
Nun-sure it is "free" but you still pay taxes to support it and it is essentially dysfunctional. It is not better than the US system. I have worked in both and in terms of all clinical outcomes, the US system is far superior and at the end of the day healthcare is about clinical outcomes.
#122
Re: Third World NHS
having friends who now live in USA, I realise the NHS is fantastic.
Inevitably it cannot continue as it is, since people expect far too much from it and it cannot cope with the never ending demands.
But it is something to be proud of- you can receive excellent medical treatment despite earning a low wage/having a costly illness/having a life long condition.
One very sad thing I read recently brought it home for me: a (US) mother found she had a genetic issue which would make her go blind. Her daughter was tested and had the same thing. The mother nominated the daughter to receive treatment on her health insurance plan, while the mother had no option but to go blind.
I would like to think you would never have to make a decision like that in UK.
OK there are long waiting lists and it is far from perfect (and they should refuse/charge people involved in drunken injuries) but it better than the other extreme.
Inevitably it cannot continue as it is, since people expect far too much from it and it cannot cope with the never ending demands.
But it is something to be proud of- you can receive excellent medical treatment despite earning a low wage/having a costly illness/having a life long condition.
One very sad thing I read recently brought it home for me: a (US) mother found she had a genetic issue which would make her go blind. Her daughter was tested and had the same thing. The mother nominated the daughter to receive treatment on her health insurance plan, while the mother had no option but to go blind.
I would like to think you would never have to make a decision like that in UK.
OK there are long waiting lists and it is far from perfect (and they should refuse/charge people involved in drunken injuries) but it better than the other extreme.
#123
Banned
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 37
Re: Third World NHS
having friends who now live in USA, I realise the NHS is fantastic.
Inevitably it cannot continue as it is, since people expect far too much from it and it cannot cope with the never ending demands.
But it is something to be proud of- you can receive excellent medical treatment despite earning a low wage/having a costly illness/having a life long condition.
One very sad thing I read recently brought it home for me: a (US) mother found she had a genetic issue which would make her go blind. Her daughter was tested and had the same thing. The mother nominated the daughter to receive treatment on her health insurance plan, while the mother had no option but to go blind.
I would like to think you would never have to make a decision like that in UK.
OK there are long waiting lists and it is far from perfect (and they should refuse/charge people involved in drunken injuries) but it better than the other extreme.
Inevitably it cannot continue as it is, since people expect far too much from it and it cannot cope with the never ending demands.
But it is something to be proud of- you can receive excellent medical treatment despite earning a low wage/having a costly illness/having a life long condition.
One very sad thing I read recently brought it home for me: a (US) mother found she had a genetic issue which would make her go blind. Her daughter was tested and had the same thing. The mother nominated the daughter to receive treatment on her health insurance plan, while the mother had no option but to go blind.
I would like to think you would never have to make a decision like that in UK.
OK there are long waiting lists and it is far from perfect (and they should refuse/charge people involved in drunken injuries) but it better than the other extreme.
#124
Home and Happy
Joined: Dec 2002
Location: Keep true friends and puppets close, trust no-one else...
Posts: 93,810
Re: The Real NHS
Threads merged. One on the subject is enough, especially when the second one appears to have been started just to stir.
#125
Re: Third World NHS
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Speaking from personal experience, the NHS is appalling. Worst cancer outcomes in Europe, GPs who have a diagnosis ability of zero, squalid and dirty conditions, nurses who cannot even communicate and hail from real nations of healthcare quality-Nigeria, Russia and Zambia.
The big problem in the UK is that the private sector is not comprehensive, so you have to use the NHS
Speaking from personal experience, the NHS is appalling. Worst cancer outcomes in Europe, GPs who have a diagnosis ability of zero, squalid and dirty conditions, nurses who cannot even communicate and hail from real nations of healthcare quality-Nigeria, Russia and Zambia.
The big problem in the UK is that the private sector is not comprehensive, so you have to use the NHS
The doctor speaking to the BMA obviously has an ax to grind which comes down to "give us more money." It would be nice, but impossible.
In the US, the health care is only great for those with great medical insurance. Some Americans live in enormous houses and own a dozen gas-guzzling cars. That doesn't prove that Americans have a better standard of living. The US spends more on health care for worse overall results, because that money goes to the few rather than being shared among all.
As for private medicine in the UK, I don't know overall, but there's a private hospital across the road from the NHS hospital in Exeter and a number of people told me that it was much inferior. Just anecdotal.
Bev
Last edited by Bevm; Sep 26th 2012 at 11:59 am.
#126
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Oct 2010
Location: The sunshine state
Posts: 1,358
Re: The Real NHS
Nun-sure it is "free" but you still pay taxes to support it and it is essentially dysfunctional. It is not better than the US system. I have worked in both and in terms of all clinical outcomes, the US system is far superior and at the end of the day healthcare is about clinical outcomes.
#127
is finally happy
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: London! (yes!)
Posts: 195
Re: The Real NHS
Nun-sure it is "free" but you still pay taxes to support it and it is essentially dysfunctional. It is not better than the US system. I have worked in both and in terms of all clinical outcomes, the US system is far superior and at the end of the day healthcare is about clinical outcomes.
Clinical outcomes for those who can pay. Don't forget, plenty of people with serious conditions don't even make it to the hospital room in the US, so if you're only looking at clinical treatment, you have to remember that in terms of the US, the sample size of those actually treated for conditions is much smaller than that of the UK.
#128
Heading for Poppyland
Joined: Jul 2007
Location: North Norfolk and northern New York State
Posts: 14,540
Re: The Real NHS
Nun-sure it is "free" but you still pay taxes to support it and it is essentially dysfunctional. It is not better than the US system. I have worked in both and in terms of all clinical outcomes, the US system is far superior and at the end of the day healthcare is about clinical outcomes.
USA - 78.37
UK - 80.05
#129
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 12,865
Re: The Real NHS
That said, I don't particularly favour the NHS approach to the delivery of healthcare. Countries like France, The Netherlands and Switzerland have near-universal coverage, but have much more private provision of services and seem to have better outcomes, particularly in terms of cancer, where the NHS clearly lags.
#131
Heading for Poppyland
Joined: Jul 2007
Location: North Norfolk and northern New York State
Posts: 14,540
#133
Re: The Real NHS
Nun-sure it is "free" but you still pay taxes to support it and it is essentially dysfunctional. It is not better than the US system. I have worked in both and in terms of all clinical outcomes, the US system is far superior and at the end of the day healthcare is about clinical outcomes.
I also work in the in the medical industry for a major US teaching hospital and the standard of treatment is excellent. I do not accept the statement that the US has better clinical outcomes then the UK without references and studies.....I think you'll find some places where the UK is better and visa versa. I would be happy to be treated in either system. However, the US system is far inferior to the UK system in the way it is funded, delivered, it's ridiculous cost, and the percentage of the population that it covers.
I am one of the lucky US residents that has inexpensive and very good health care because I am a state employee. I only pay $50 a month of my $400 premium, I have no deductible, but I do have a co-pay and pay for certain tests. I still have to deal with a stupid amount of paperwork when I see the doctor and I've generally had excellent treatment, but my previous GP was an idiot so I changed. Given reasonable funding and the support of the Government the NHS will continue to be an excellent service, but I fear that we will increasingly see it follow the dysfunctional US model because of vested interests and ideological bias that is blind to the overall good health of the UK populace.
Last edited by nun; Sep 26th 2012 at 2:15 pm.
#134
Re: The Real NHS
I believe that the US's lower life expectancy than the UK is caused by lack of access to health care. The US has excellent hospitals and doctors, but many US residents can't easily get that treatment. People without insurance will allow chronic conditions to go untreated until they are forced to the emergency departments of a hospital when the illness becomes acute. They will receive good treatment, but it will be expensive and might also be too late for there to be a good outcome.