Originally Posted by denver

Yes, up late, cant sleep. Been living in London since August 2005. Grew up in Duncraig in Perth and am returning home in Feb this year. I was doing the two year working visa thing. I base my theories on what I observe around me, the fact that I teach in schools in this country and the fact that I read a couple of British newspapers each day. The newspapers vary, but I usually read The Times or The Observer, sometimes the Guardian or the Daily Mail. Just to prove I am not completely biased I think UK newspapers are awesome and I will miss sitting in a cafe and reading them after school. Since I have moved here, I have developed an intense dislike for the Blair government ( I thought he was doing a good job when I was in Oz, but TBH did not reseach the situation) I was last here in 1998 and had a great time - I was backpacking through Europe. I really dislike the schools here, even in outer London, the kids are rude and undisciplined, basically I just get through the day (though obviously make an effort with the kids as there are always nice ones too) The kids are harder and more grown up here. I found Aussie kids to be happier and healthier in general, and there are only a few tough ones in each year, rather than several in each class. The kids in Oz just seem to have more respect for their elders and each other. I really enjoyed teaching in WA and I was not at 'cushy schools'. I do not like the Human Rights Act (how convenient for Cherie Blair, a human rights lawyer!) I believe in teaching people their responsibilties first. The kids are full of their rights now, and no I did not see any evidence of this in OZ, but have been told this several times over here. Many english teachers just accept the poor behaviour as normal, or seem unwilling to help me out.

The level of anti-social behaviour seems higher in london ( I accept this may not be the case elsewhere in the UK, I have done a bit of travelling through the countryside.) One school I was at had the police turn up at the end of the day to supervise the kids going home. Never heard of this happening in Australia. It was a nightmare getting on the bus to go home from that school.

In the UK, yobbish behaviour has gotten so bad that a new political party has been formed called MUM's Army, which aims to stamp out this behaviour.

The UK just seems so crowded, and why is there such poor border control here.? Madness.

I could go on, but it is time for bed now.

Originally Posted by denver

Just pointing out the fact that people really only began to pollute their environments in a serious fashion after the industrial revolution. How is this not correct? I realise that all industrialised nations are to blame, however.

Originally Posted by denver

No, I don't think Australia is perfect, at all, far from it. Crime occurs. Corruption occurs. Some Australians are rude/ignorant/idiots. There are boy racers. There are bushfires. There are some great things about the UK ie history, countryside. But I think Australia is being managed well, the people are confident and happy (on thw whole) and I think The UK is going down a slippery slope (mainly due to poor social policies) and some UK people on this forum are in denial about it.

Originally Posted by northernbird

My Uncle was until recently the deputy head of one of the foremost girls schools in London and I can assure you none of the behaviour you describe happens there or the rural suffolk school he now teaches at. When he taught in Tower Hamlets it was the case but I am comparing schools which are poles apart.

The UK has got crowded and there is a lot of anti social behaviour, certainly more than when I was growing up but you cannot go around making the kind of sweeping statements that you make, certainly not based on 17 months of living there.

Originally Posted by arkon

Thanks for telling me what I meant to say but in this case, SQUID was what I meant.

Originally Posted by denver

I base my theories on what I observe around me, the fact that I teach in schools in this country and the fact that I read a couple of British newspapers each day.

I really dislike the schools here, even in outer London, the kids are rude and undisciplined, basically I just get through the day (though obviously make an effort with the kids as there are always nice ones too) The kids are harder and more grown up here. I found Aussie kids to be happier and healthier in general, and there are only a few tough ones in each year, rather than several in each class. The kids in Oz just seem to have more respect for their elders and each other. I really enjoyed teaching in WA and I was not at 'cushy schools'.

Originally Posted by ladyofthelake

My kids here in Florida go to what is percieved as a great school. It is well maintained, the kids are great, the parental involvement is high. BUT, what is actually taught in the classroom? Well, in my case, not a lot. My kids have plodded along over the years. They are not being challenged. They are not being taught according to their abilities, but to the lowest ability kids. So in my opinion, behaviour problems aside, an education in the UK would be better than an education in the US or OZ.

Originally Posted by ladyofthelake

The Expats on this board however, are comparing the ACADEMICS of the 2 systems. The general view on here is that kids in the UK are taught at a higher and more challenging level than OZ and the US. My kids have plodded along over the years. They are not being challenged. They are not being taught according to their abilities, but to the lowest ability kids. So in my opinion, behaviour problems aside, an education in the UK would be better than an education in the US or OZ.

Originally Posted by ladyofthelake

So in my opinion, behaviour problems aside, an education in the UK would be better than an education in the US or OZ

Originally Posted by milliewoos

Genuine question - are your children being educated in a Montessori school?

Originally Posted by esperanza

I find this interesting. It has always been my impression that kids in many UK schools are limited by the poor literacy & behaviour (often linked) of the weakest kids. I found that to be the case when I was at school myself, ten-fifteen years ago, and for the last few years as a teacher. One of the impressions I have (perhaps wrongly!) about the Aussie school system is that it seems to focus more on the behaviour/happiness of the kids than the UK system which seems obsessed with constant testing & assessment.



You cannot separate behaviour from everything else that happens in the classroom - the curriculum can be as challenging as you like but if the teacher is out in the corridor dealing with some little twerp who can't manage to stay in the room then what difference does it make?

Originally Posted by ladyofthelake

I am aware of that, which is why I said "behaviour problems aside". Most of us moving back would choose carefully which schools we send our kids to and try our hardest to avoid the worst ones. Inner city schools in London would not be on my list of possible places to send my kids, and I don't think anyone would willingly choose a school with a bad reputation. So assuming you avoid the classrooms with the worst behaviour, what is actually taught becomes the priority. .

Originally Posted by esperanza

I might be jumping to conclusions here, but I would imagine that if you can afford to buy in the catchment area of a good school (or pay the fees for an indie, which might be cheaper!) then you will be able to get a good education for your child whichever country you are in.

(I don't mean you personally, I mean 'one')

Originally Posted by ladyofthelake

No, normal Elementary school.