JayDeee

Crazy question I know but where are you and how many alpacas are you talking about here?

Bloody great animals for keeping the foxes away from lambs and chickens

Kala

arkon

Hi Kala,

They are great animals all round. They even tell me when there are snakes, foxes, dingos and dogs about. We have 5 at the moment with 3 pregnant so early next year we should have 8. We had planned to get another 3 pregnant females but that was before we had doubts about staying in Australia. The farm can take atleast 200 I think but we had planned on growing the herd to about 50-60 before selling off the offspring.

Oh and I'm on the mid north coast of NSW.

MrsB

When you said a "shed load" of alpacas I was imagining about 50! So that isn't that many, then?

What are your plans then? Are you going to head home yet, or wait a while?

You've got your pick of places to live in England, what better position to be in?

arkon

Well we can't take the Alpacas with us because of the cost. I suppose a shed load is maybe too strong but they do all fit in a shed. Next year we will have at least 8 so its a fair few. As for going home thats a done deal we are definately going back. As for the timescales of the move were not so sure. Our house was on the market here in Australia for 3 years until us being a couple of pommie muppets bought it. The only definate is we don't want our son educated here so we have to be back within 4 years. Which sounds at the moment like an eternity.

So the plan is fix the farm and house up to sell it which might realisticly take a couple of years build the Alpaca business up and sell it as a going concern, by which time we will have citizenship thus giving our son the right to come to Australia in the future without having to jump through all the hoops or part with a 'shed load' of cash to get here. Also bu that time our eldest dog should have passed on to doggy heaven so we won't have to fly him back.

All in all we are trapped here for the short term (3-4 years) and if someone can think of a faster way of doing it without losing a fortune on the house and without shiping the dog back (heart won't take another flight says the vet and we ain't leaving him behind) then I'd like to hear it.

For anyone else contemplating coming here with dogs I'd say think again and very hard, its dog unfriendly to the point of paranoia. They make it very hard to organise your life during the initial first arrival stages and then can act as a leash to keep you here if you want to return. Also don't buy a house too soon infact I'd recomend waiting until after you have citizenship.

Anyway got to go an fix some fences in the blistering heat. Oh and the ultimate in irony is that when its too hot to work outside the mossies stay away making it safe to work outside! yesterday I had a wall to build and it was a nice lovely 22 degrees so very pleasant to work outside, the problem was as the temperature cools down the mossies come out in force and bit the ***** out of me as I was building it!

uk+kiwi

Hi there,

I've heard you mention a few times that you don't want your son educated in Aus. I am curious as to why that is, or is it the age he is at? Is he only 1 years old, or older and you are meaning possibly secondary education?

What are your education plans for him in the UK? I'm asking since I didn't think there was much of a difference in the education systems - ie state vs state, private vs private. I don't know about Australian schools, but I was educated in an international private school overseas myself as a child which provided a fantastic education, and I know NZ for example has to die for facilities in its private schools, along with some very impressive outdoor areas and outdoor lessons/trips (which I think are highly beneficial) in the state sector.

Or is it him gaining an accent/celebrating and learning about Australian history instead of Briitsh for example?

Just curious given my experience, interest in education for my own children and possible move to NZ myself with children at some point in the future. Carmen.

arkon

It's a few fold reasons and regardless of what I say I'll get shot down but what the heck:-

Firstly based on my dealings both on a professional level and private with most of the Australian educated people I’ve encountered then I’m not to enthusiastic about the educational system if these are what it turns out. I won’t go into all the details but suffice it to say I don’t want my son turning out like an Australian.
Secondly the education system is outcomes based rather than standards based like the UK. This means they aim to get what’s best for the kid even if this means a poor technical standard. The kids will love the system here but I can’t imagine it turns out that many potential whiz kids or entrepreneurs. It does however turn out very sociable kids but I want mine to have the best education he can get and as the missus is a teacher and my cousin is an Australian teacher, from what they have told me he won’t get it here.
We want to send him to a private school in the UK one which takes them from 4 onwards all the way through. We know the one we want and the wife can work there too.

Also there are no Australia wide standard like the national curriculum and no scoring system to rate schools. Teachers here are dead set against being measured. From my research on the subject the ideal education if he was to end up living in Australia would be to do the primary years in the UK where he would then get the chance to be academically years ahead of them here and then to do secondary education here in Australia.

Basically I just want to give him the best chances in life and I’m sure its not here both education and job wise. Sure he will love the lifestyle but who wouldn’t playing all day and not really being challenged. I feel if we educate him here we will be handicapping him unfairly based on what we want for our lives and not what’s best for him. I’m sure he will thank me for it in the future and armed with his citizenship he can come back here when he’s older.

Ok so everyone can now flame away. Hard hat on and ready.

Geordie George

Hey, Arkon!

Prepare for incoming!

Just curious about what you mean exactly when you say that the Australian system turns out very sociable kids, but you want your child to have the best education. What's to say that a sociable child is going to achieve less in life than an entrepreneurial (or any other type of) child? (And why is one better than another?!) Just curious (it's my sociable nature! )

GG

arkon

Don't get me wrong I like the sociable nature of the kids out here, they seem beter equiped to deal with adults here. You can actually have a good conversation with a teenager here. I'm going to try and facilitate him being sociable myself but I want the school to actually teach him something or at the very least teach him the ability to learn. Sociable kids can turn out to be whiz kids and entrepreneurial but I've not met many here and if its all the same I want to stick with what I know and feel comfortable with afterall its his life not mine. I deal with the products of the system here all the time and like I said I'm not impressed whereas I have first hand experience of a couple of good schools in the UK that seem to turn out winners and buisness types by the bucket loads.

uk+kiwi

Interesting viewpoint. I'm glad you answered my post, don't worry about the hard hats. Will offer you my own viewpoints also since I sense you are pretty interested in the subject. I have experienced first hand a lot of types of schools - international private school, state primary & secondary in the UK, private secondary girls only, normal university life.

As a mother of two bright children (not exceptional, but amongst the top few kids in a strongly academic environment), I wish for more of a balance, away from such a focus on SATS scores/exam results as the 'be all and end all' of life. I say this since we have chosen academic schools, hence the obsession with such things. Plus we all know straight 'A' students who fall flat on their faces in the real world.

So I can see that standards based education helps parents choose schools (though in the state sector you really don't choose) and is good for society overall given our national literacy/numeracy crisis, but like you, at the end of the day I want the best for my two children.

So I just wanted to say that I understand what you mean about making choices for our children that are influenced by what we know and that we all want the best for our children, but be careful in what you wish for because whilst I count my blessings that my children are not struggling with school, it is also frustrating to see how much individual focus and attention goes to those who are struggling academically or less interested in getting on with the work. This seems to be the same in every school.

Also, I have realised since my kids started school that life is about balance and schools/academics are just a small aspect of a person in adult life and their career choices/success, plus academics are best taught at home (from a time point of view mainly), but that the schools offer vital social skills that cannot be learnt at home (unless you have a ridiculous number of children).

My husband was educated mainly in NZ, but also in the US, and I suspect like the Aus system, he thinks it's great how the NZ schools offer a broader education than the UK and do tend to do better with the social skills also. ie your point about sociable kids, which I interpret to mean 'confident' kids, which let's face it, has got to be the most important characteristic you can hope for your child. So this is where I think the UK falls down, in building confidence to help turn out those entrepreneurs and capturing children at the right age into a love of learning, despite how technically correct it may be!

I also read your point about the ideal education with interest, since we may indeed go for completing UK primary and then NZ secondary.

Out of interest, what schools do you rate in the UK? Please PM me if you would rather not mention them on here. I follow league tables & education supplements and the state vs private vs co-ed/single sex debates with avid interest. Sad but true. Never gave it a blind bit of notice until I had my own children.

oldgit

Try Knaresbrough,N yorkshire, for Harrogate Grammer ( good rounded state education) or Ashville College( public school but bursary assisted places.Otley for Bradford Grammer ( public school but open to all by trust funding etc).
i am looking at your son when he is obviously older.And as others have said Border North and west Yorkshire its "reet" good. Wetherby too and all so close to Leeds thriving at the moment with jobs galore across the spectrum.Not for you but the lad later on incidentally Universities of York and several in leeds and in Bradford and more.Loads of rented properties spoilt for choice.
"We are currently stuck in a quagmire and have no idea what to do"....O mate tell me about it....but look I'm not havin you calling yourself a muppet.
In my eyes you and me are bl**dy brave b*ggers.My migration is doomed already and i haven't even started it properly....yes shedload of money...your'e telling me....going out with the dog we love.. a nightmare.... getting her back 7 months later not happenedyet it will be horrendous.At present here in the UK due to fly out again in two weeks to see whether we can be allowed to make a go of it ..red taped to the eyeballs...baulked at every turn by officialdom either here in the UK or in Aus....going Tits up in Tassie but love Tassie...do we go do we stay cut our losses now or do an "arkon" and hope for the best.Not whingeing son just want you to know you're not alone...tell me is it better to loose a shedload of dollars or a shedload of sterling..lucky me I have a choice.. or both.... :scared:
I also like the look of The scottish borders region renting unsure but prices reasonable to buy .Well depending on carefully looking
Better go to bed loads to do tomorrow I'm emigrating to Aus don't think i have any choice too late to pull out spent too much cash try to make a go of it like you are doing.Your Pacas look great... good luck "Mate"
Oldgit.... sadder but wiser...NO... JUST BLOODY FURIOUS....

arkon

Thanks for that oldgit, Good luck and you've already spent the money and even given the ba*tards some blood so you have to go though with it now. I know this is not what people coming here want to hear but I can't wait for the dollar to reach 1 to 1! This way I won't have lost any money when I send it all back again!!

For us it was all a chain reaction that was impossible to get out of and when something like:-

* Applied and parted with a pile of money to agents and Oz Gov. Cant back out now!
*Waited 2 years for something to happen and got the house and business ready to sell. Can't back out now!
*Handed notice in to work and sold business. Can't back out now.
*Booked tickets and dogs agents, parted with loads of dosh. Can't back out now.
*Sold house and Car, Can't back out now!
*Given blood! 1st ever needle for a needle phobic!!! Can't back out now!
*Arrived in Oz with 2 dogs, Can't find anywhere to rent!! dogs in Quarantine. Can't return yet!
*Have to buy caravan to house dogs in dog unfriendly country. Getting harder to return home.
*Find out wife is pregnant and sick 24/7 can't stay in caravan, can't rent, must find house quick! Can't send dogs back after all they have been through. Can't return now!
*Buy Big house and farm in daft area, Not thinking straight anymore! Can't return now!!
*Encounter all kinds of bureaucracy and incompetent medical people over pregnancy. Still can’t go back!
*Now have big monetary liability which is almost impossible to sell. STUCK!

If we didn’t have the dogs we wouldn’t have HAD to buy somewhere and would have rented which was the original plan and so would have returned as soon as we found out the missus was pregnant. So its all the dogs fault!! (no its not, it’s the incredibly dog unfriendly society here!) *End of Rant*

MrsB

Have you forgotten your "fire retardant suit" and "helmet" sentence? You seem to be wearing those an awful lot!

Could you not ship the dogs back? And there must be some zoos or children's farms that would have the alpacas? I know there are 3 such children's farms where I am, it's a bit far from you though.

Going off the topic a bit - I read with interest the thread about the fuses and plugs (the one where you were wearing the fire retardant suit and helmet!!), and I have a story which hopefully will make you chuckle: We had a massive electricity surge here recently, an almighty bang, and all the appliances blew (none of which belonged to us) the cooker, the dishwasher and the two a/c units. There is a RCD (which is a safety switch?) in the fuse box in the garage - lucky the car wasn't in there at the time. The RCD blew out and flew right the way across the garage leaving a trail of black soot all over the plastic lid of the fuse box and the garage floor. We had no lecky for 35 hours and all the neighbours were in the street comparing stories of how their microwave/ TV etc had all blown up.

All our TV/DVD stuff and all our computer equipment was safe and we think it was because we left the UK plugs on, put them all into one of the UK 4-way board things, and just changed the plug on that to go in the socket. I could be wrong....but there you go, I think our fuses saved the day!

arkon

I know what you mean about the power supply here, my computer equiptment has now been saved more than once from the regular power surges and or power outages we get here regularly. I recon I have to reset the clocks about twice a week because of power outs at night. My anti surge 8 way UK plug adaptor has saved my PC stuff and the UPS has save my work a few times. I brought a stack of spare 13,5 and 3 amp fuses with me just incase and where they would have lasted me a lifetime back home, here I'll be lucky if my stash lasts to the end of next year!

As for sending the dogs back thats a no go, the younger one will be OK but the older one has a dicky ticker and the vet recomended he not fly again. So we will wait and bide out time.

ShozInOz

On the education thing... I'm a university lecturer (and a fool for it) and was very, very surprised (and not in a good way) and the standard of Uni entrants here. I'm in a top 8, probably top 5, Australian University. My main gripe is that students are clueless about English grammar. Instead of teaching them what I should teach them, I spend too much time on sentence and paragraph structure, basic punctuation, etc. These are >90% UAI HSE students, if that means anything to you. From my UK experience, 17/18 year olds entering university are equivalent to bright 14 year olds in the UK. I kid you not.

MJC

ROFLMAO