dunroving

For those of you who are looking forward to returning to the UK, look away (also those of you who have happily moved back).

I am having one of those "What was I THINKING????" days and I just have to get it off my chest.

For long periods of time I manage to just deal with things, but just lately I am finding it difficult to find much that is positive about being back in the UK (and it's more to do with me and my situation than with the UK).

If you've read any of my earlier posts you'll know my financial sitation is screwed, 15 years from retirement and a mortgage I'll never pay off by retirement, never any money left at the end of the month, thanks to the sinking dollar and stupid UK house prices. (In contrast, my finances in the US were just rosy)

Unlike many/most on here, I didn't return to a host of family and friends nearby (been away so long I've lost touch and anyway old college friends are scattered to the winds, am very close to my twin brother but he's overseas). I've tried things like the Ramblers Club (no dogs allowed) and cycling club (way too high a level, I got dropped) and am just struggling to meet people. (Again, in contrast, in the US I formed a good circle of friends pretty quickly).

Now just lately, my job situation is going pear-shaped. Higher education seems to have changed a lot just in the past few years - large classes, disinterested students who (a) don't even attend, (b) don't do any studying between classes, long lessons (3 hours for undergraduates is madness), mountains of bureacracy, blah, blah. Added to that, our Faculty and Department is going through some drastic changes and there is so much uncertainty it's very unsettling. Consequently, I'm spending half my life doing trivial "busy work" and the other half trying to entertain a room full of kids who'd rather be surfing Youtube. I have never been so disenchanted with teaching university students, though I'm really trying. (In contrast, although also very busy, my job in the States was extremely rewarding, I loved the students and we had a great time in class (heck, even the students who failed my class would be happy to see me second - or third - time around), my research program was stimulating (whereas there seem to be so many hurdles to doing research here in the UK). It dawned on me today that this job is more like teaching secondary shool than university. It's really been the last straw.

I'm just really, really discouraged right now and even when I'm walking the dog on the hills (which I certainly realize I'm lucky to have), I find myself ruminating on things like "What did I do?" and trying to find the positives, with little success.

OK, rant over.

busterboy

Thinking of you, chum!

rabsody

Feel for you dunroving. I can totally understand you finding it difficult to remain positive under financial stress and lack of job satisfaction. Been there and worn the tshirt, it can be extremely hard to see the light at the end of the tunnel. All I can say is feel free to rant away on here, hope things get better for you ... at the risk of sounding flippant, they always do (even when you really don't think they will).

I'm studying at uni (mature age) and can relate to your sentiments about the young 'uns! The talking in class, constant checking of mobiles (that's when they bother showing up!) Don't let the bastards get you down

Do you have options? e.g if you find you cannot tolerate your current circumstances are you in a position to return to the US?

Stitch

The way you describe the students in UK sounds exactly like Oz!

Cheers

Ginny

lollyno1

I can totally relate to how you feel at the moment, but mine is more to do with why did i ever leave the UK.

In the years preceding my very short lived emmigration I put my career on hold, when I should have been looking towards a career move to middle management i didnt. I was so wrapped up in the emmigration dream I let things pass me by.

Now Im back home and thankfully (at the moment) I am back on the property ladder. However the job situation for someone in my position is dire. Im top of the payscale gone through threshold twice, so I am far too expensive for a classroom teachers job. I had an interview the other day, which i failed miserably at. and having had feedback felt that I had wasted the shcools time in applying for a job that I was obviously not experienced at doing.

I feel deflated, especially as I have another interview this Thursday.

At the moment I wish id never started the process of emmigration.

I hope your situation improves and you find solace where ever that may be.

lolly

TaraC

Hi Dunroving,

I'm sorry this is all going so pear-shaped for you. As a postgraduate student I'm wondering whether it would be possible for you to teach postgrads rather than undergrads. Although we have a slight problem with talking (some cultures really don't seem to think side conversations are a problem, and it isn't the English students!), most of us are really motivated and work very hard. Our professors seem to be really enjoying themselves and are very energized by the class.

Your situation does seem to be really difficult for all number of reasons. Are you beginning to seriously contemplate going back?

Tara

Scout

Dunroving.........I think it's time you sat down and had a long chat with yourself about what is important to you. We can be a sounding board for you here......but when it comes down to it.......you are going to eventually make a decision.

I know your career is important to you.......but.......see when I hit 40........I realized that my career was not as important to me as it had once been. I purposely pulled myself off the business fast track before I had a stroke. I settled down in my job (not my career)......did it well, enjoyed it and occasionally advanced..........but I quit killing myself for the sake of the Corporate Gods. I quit taking home work in the evenings and on weekends, I quit sacrificing my friendships and family relationships for my job and I was much happier. It surprised the hell out of me at the time. I found time for what was important to me..........walking my dog.........I met several new friends that way. I gardened and met more new friends...I travelled a bit and saw new things and had some lovely holidays.... I reconnected with old friends that I had let slide away when I was so busy with my career. Hell I even met my husband and I had sworn I would never get married. ....

If you would have asked me at age 39 whether I would ever purposely scale back my career track I would have told you 'hell no'.........because I thought I loved what I was doing.......well I did love what I was doing, but I was also sacrificing a good bit of the rest of my life because of my career.

I know you like hiking and cycling and you love your dog. The ramblers don't want your dog along?.....then try and hook up with other dog lovers that have dogs and will ramble...post something on a bulletin board at the Uni and see if anyone responds.

Find a local pub....go in with a book........and sit and have a read on a Saturday afternoon........I guarantee if you find the right pub.......you won't be reading the book for long............in a good local the people will start chatting with you and before you know it you're a regular and you've met a few new friends. Give it a little time........you weren't in Wales long enough to connect with people before you moved to Scotland and truth be told, you haven't been there long yet either.

Go back for a visit to the States. Explore whether it's financially feasible for you to pick up and move there again. Is a job even available? Where is your brother overseas? Maybe a visit with him will lift your spirits a bit. Would you want to live where he is possibly?

I know your financial situation seems dismal right now...........iI remember the first house I bought..........it took me a good 2 to 3 years to get my feet back under me again and get used to the mortgage payments......I filled in the financial gaps with a couple of roommates.........one that was great and a couple of real losers that I booted quickly.

I know that I have sometimes asked myself 'what have I done' when I get a bit down and realized I have moved a half a world away from where I grew up........but then the next day I snap out of it...........seeing the hills and valleys and how beautiful they are....or I meet up with a new friend for a chat or a pint and my blues sort of drift away.

And one more thing.........and this is real personal.........find someone. Going through life alone is not always a good thing despite what we often tell ourselves...........and I can speak like that because I avoided serious relationships for years for fear of being hurt.........but in my doddering middle age I took a chance and it was the best thing I ever did.

OK.............I'm off my blithering soapbox now. If I have offended you or stepped on your toes I apologize.........I just hate to see you so miserable.

on a mission

maybe like me you have admitted you have made a terrible mistake....of coming back.

dunroving

Thanks all for the support, especially as some of you are dealing with stuff yourselves, and have helped me out (a LOT) in the past. A G/F once told me that if you divide your life into the different "bits" - finances, work, home, relationships - you're all right if at least half of them are going well. I think right now I'm just not seeing the light because NONE of them are going well, in fact they are all causing me headaches. I'm just trying to figure out which one is doing my head in the most so I can try to address it - is probably my job and the "new face in a new town" feeling.

Scout (I always want to call you Tigger), you certainly didn't offend me and I appreciate the thought you put into your post, and believe me my brother (who met his second wife on the internet!) never stops telling me I need to find someone!

Tara: Yes, postgrads are definitely fun to work with and there may be a possibility I could "migrate" to teaching research methods and statistics faculty-wide (you see, I'm not even sure undergrads need to be taking so much statistics and research methods, which is part of the problem, I think). The lack of interaction with postgrads is a big part of US teaching that I miss (although I loved teaching undergrads there too, and was course director for an undergraduate degree).

Lolly - good luck with that interview. One thing I've learned is that even with a detailed job spec, sometimes the reality of a position is very different from what it seems - and you don't find out until you get to the interview. I've been on both ends (served on a stack of interview panels) and it never failed to amaze me that people were invited to interview who clearly the job didn't match. I mean, what a waste of their time (and blow to the confidence).

Re: possibilities of moving back, I can say with absolute certainty that if I could flip a switch and still be in NC (or even more so, back where I was in TN), I'd do it in a heartbeat. When I'm in good spirits, I tell myself "Heck, no reason why not - you just apply, interview, get the job, get the visa, get the GC, wait for USC and you're sorted", but on days like today the whole process seems like an impossibility. I'm pretty much resigned to not doing anything drastic this academic year (academic positions are usually for the fall) and if I feel the same this time next year I'll start to put out feelers.

Thanks again all for your support. BE folks are great.

chance to be

Scout, loads of great advice as ever

DR - Ive followed your story with interest as we moved back around the same time and sang from the same hymnsheet before we left. I think it was you that reminded me when Ive had wobbly days of the "expat curse" - that is - once exposed to a host of opportunity, its harder to settle anywhere cos you know theres a whole world out there with good stuff going on.
I think there a lot of that in you....and because of that I wonder if thats what you need to sort out first before you do anthing.

FWIW - this is what I do. I think, "I cant keep going from place to place" This time Im going to not actively think about moving until Im settled and at "home" which is kinda the reverse of whats expected. Normaly, people think things are going bad, therefore I'll look to moving.........but if you do that, how have you grown? How can you hold your hand up and say I got something positive from this? As you say, you wouldnt be going back for the most common reason (family ties) so the "person pull" isnt there in that sense.

I reckon you should take a lot of Scouts advice - actively act as though this is where you are for now and try to do something about creating a social circle for yourself. Go to the local to watch the rugby (you have 1 1/2 hrs and counting!!), start some coversation, get a short term lodger. I always get vet students as they always do 3mnth placements (bit of extra cash but i know i can get rid of them). Whatever - but do something.
Then, and only then....when you think one day...."things havent been so bad lately. Look at where I ve come from this thread," then think about where you want to live. Because if you do it then, you cant ever think it was another knee-jerk reaction to bad times but an informed, objective decision and you can do whatever you do with your head held high because you have made good of now.
I hope that made sense!

Im not trying to sound harsh - believe me I go through a lot of these feelings too - but reread your threads before you came back to the UK. Try to appreciate the things you missed when in US and try to get a glass half full attitude (hard, I know - but you can do it). You have moved several times and you are more than capable of moving again. But, for your own peace of mind, try to wait until you are happy/content/or feel you've achieved something here before you go again.

Im not going to go on any more - or I will miss the rugby - but take care and Im thinking of you, and remember you are an intelligent bloke, so none of this is rocket science to you! wE ALL HAVE EVRY FAITH IN YOU ON THIS SITE!

Now - GO OUT!

Chrissy

dingbat

You scare me. I am moving back with kids, knowing that I am going to be financially tight, as the jobs don't pay what I thought they did. If you are finding it hard to manage with just you and the woofer...how am I going to manage with five dependent children?

dingbat

Why? It would be nice to hear why you have made a mistake.

Marmalade

Dunroving,
You've gotten some excellent advice on this thread. I especially think it is important that you do go back and read your thoughts about moving back to the UK. See what you were looking forward to when you moved back the last time. I would also recommend that you read your threads on being unhappy in Scotland. Try to pinpoint what it is and as others have suggested try and go out and do something about it. Give yourself a time limit and then reflect on everything at that point. I sometimes am very impulsive when things are going wrong, and do make mistakes because of my impulsiveness. But, when I sit back and say I am mad right now with my situation, but I won't do anything for now. It gives me time to get perspective, and I have learned to let things go that annoy me and I move on with a better attitude and even fix the situation if I can. When I was younger I loved traveling all over, but now in my 40s I feel the strong pull of 'my' country every time I am there and even when I am not there. I just want to live out the rest of my life in 'my' country. Nothing against the US, but Scotland will always be where I want to be. You may need to think of the long-term; where do you want to live permanently. Where is home?

Anyway, enough of my ramblings. I wish you the best of luck in whatever you do.

Sally

Feel for you dunroving, it does appear Higher Education and research are not what they were in the UK

However bear in mind that you have not been back that long and are most likely still in the 'lost' stage. Some financial experts counsel never paying off your mortgage anyway! Maybe, as others have suggested, try to take a shorter-term view of things - just that you will try to do some things differently this month and see how it goes, try to use Youtube in your lessons maybe! Pester the dog-lovers and put up a notice for some sociable cyclists to join you! For example.

All the best.

acer rose

I really feel for you. We have just made a move away from the UK and although we currently have no regrets and no intention of returning, it is pretty scary moving to a more expensive place with the exchange rate going against us. It is certain that we will not be retiring any time soon. I know many others in the 40-60 age range that are having similar realisations, both in Europe and in Canada. And then there are all those Americans that just have to keep working to make sure they have health care. There are always going to be problems.

From what I have heard from friends, you are not alone in despair over teaching undergraduate students. Many undergraduate students from England/Wales/NI are unprepared for a traditional British undergraduate degree due to the broader nature of secondary studies these days (eg one friend reported marking an answer paper in which the "d"s in a differential equation had been cancelled). These same friends also complain that some students have a no idea that grades relate to knowledge gained rather than just time spent. I am surprised to hear that the situation is the same in Scotland as the secondary qualification system seems, at least to an outsider, to have been stable for several years.

Whatever you do, don't change institution thinking it will be better somewhere else in the UK. It probably won't be, unless you can get a job somewhere like the OU, Birkbeck or Oxbridge.

Good luck with your demons. I hope it all looks better today.