Catholic Wedding
 

This question has been posed on a different board and I'd like some
more feedback...

If we don't get our K-1 in time for our Catholic wedding (I'd like to
set the date for September 4, 2004) can we just get married by a
priest but NOT file any paperwork with the state of Ohio? Is this
really illegal? (Provided, of course, that the priest would permit
this.) I didn't think a wedding was a legal marriage without some sort
of official court document. My NOA 1 is dated December 15 and I'm
worried that 8 1/2 months is not enough time to obtain the K-1 thru
the NSC and the US Embassy in Paris.

Your help would be great. Thanks.

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

You could get round it by not setting a date until you're sure you'll have the visa. Or do what I'm doing and have a civil ceremony and then a blessing later.

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

Is it a requirement of the French government that the marriage be registered in the U.S.?

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

"Kristina" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > This question has been posed on a different board and I'd like some
    > more feedback...
    > If we don't get our K-1 in time for our Catholic wedding (I'd like to
    > set the date for September 4, 2004) can we just get married by a
    > priest but NOT file any paperwork with the state of Ohio? Is this
    > really illegal? (Provided, of course, that the priest would permit
    > this.)

He won't do it.

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

we have some friends who did just what you are talking about, and they didnt
have any problems.


"Kristina" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > This question has been posed on a different board and I'd like some
    > more feedback...
    > If we don't get our K-1 in time for our Catholic wedding (I'd like to
    > set the date for September 4, 2004) can we just get married by a
    > priest but NOT file any paperwork with the state of Ohio? Is this
    > really illegal? (Provided, of course, that the priest would permit
    > this.) I didn't think a wedding was a legal marriage without some sort
    > of official court document. My NOA 1 is dated December 15 and I'm
    > worried that 8 1/2 months is not enough time to obtain the K-1 thru
    > the NSC and the US Embassy in Paris.
    > Your help would be great. Thanks.

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

Thats the danger of this newsgroup, some incredibly bad advice like that from metabolife.

First, you do not say where the marriage will occur. Since you are going for a K1 am I to assume you want to get married in the US? Well you won't be here if you don't have the K1, right?

If this wedding is in France, I do not think the priest will marry you without your Livre de Famile. To get this, you must be civilly married already (even the same day).

If you are planning to do this in any country its a BAD IDEA. The US could contrue this as a legal marriage and then your K1 goes bye bye and you get to start over.

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

Some priests will be happy to do a blessing - which is what this will be.
You can dress it up to like like a wedding as much as you like. Of course,
the usual thing to do would be to have this after the civil ceremony.

Andy.

--
I'm not really here, it's just your warped imagination
"Kristina" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > This question has been posed on a different board and I'd like some
    > more feedback...
    > If we don't get our K-1 in time for our Catholic wedding (I'd like to
    > set the date for September 4, 2004) can we just get married by a
    > priest but NOT file any paperwork with the state of Ohio? Is this
    > really illegal? (Provided, of course, that the priest would permit
    > this.) I didn't think a wedding was a legal marriage without some sort
    > of official court document. My NOA 1 is dated December 15 and I'm
    > worried that 8 1/2 months is not enough time to obtain the K-1 thru
    > the NSC and the US Embassy in Paris.
    > Your help would be great. Thanks.

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

We did it in reverse with my first marriage. We married civily but my dad would not believe we were married until we married in church. The priest, of course, did not have a marriage license to register because we were already married in the eyes of NYS. The major problem that we had and you will, as well, is if it is in the US (can't speak for the rest of the world on Catholic weddings) we had to still attend the pre-cana classes over a period of weeks before we could marry in church.

As DC Mark pointed out there might well be a few other problems.

1. Being allowed into the POE to attend the blessing ceremony. For all the agent knows the foreign finacee might well apply for a marriage license and make this wedding the official one and stay and remain. If they felt this, then they won't allow him into the US.

2. The USCIS might well assume this blessing ceremony to be legal ceremony even if it is not. I believe the poster's name is George Chapried and he and his then fiancee had a blessing's ceremony in one of the FSU countires and then she entered on a K-1 and they married here in the US. The USCIS (INS back then) placed their AOS on hold because the examiner felt that the legal ceremony was the one in the FSU and they, therefore, violated the K-1.

You have eight months left to wait out the approval of the K-1. If the approval gods are willing, you will make it in time.

Rete

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

not bad advice, they did it and it worked out just fine. I have no idea what
your problem is.



"DCMark" <member6276@british_expats.com> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > Originally posted by Kristina
    > > This question has been posed on a different board and I'd like some
    > > more feedback...
    > >
    > > If we don't get our K-1 in time for our Catholic wedding (I'd like to
    > > set the date for September 4, 2004) can we just get married by a
    > > priest but NOT file any paperwork with the state of Ohio? Is this
    > > really illegal? (Provided, of course, that the priest would permit
    > > this.) I didn't think a wedding was a legal marriage without some sort
    > > of official court document. My NOA 1 is dated December 15 and I'm
    > > worried that 8 1/2 months is not enough time to obtain the K-1 thru
    > > the NSC and the US Embassy in Paris.
    > >
    > > Your help would be great. Thanks.
    > Thats the danger of this newsgroup, some incredibly bad advice like that
    > from metabolife.
    > First, you do not say where the marriage will occur. Since you are
    > going for a K1 am I to assume you want to get married in the US? Well
    > you won't be here if you don't have the K1, right?
    > If this wedding is in France, I do not think the priest will marry you
    > without your Livre de Famile. To get this, you must be civilly married
    > already (even the same day).
    > If you are planning to do this in any country its a BAD IDEA. The US
    > could contrue this as a legal marriage and then your K1 goes bye bye and
    > you get to start over.
    > --
    > Posted via http://britishexpats.com

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

My problem is that you gave advice without knowing anything about the law, and if this person follows it, it could be a disaster.

I know people who have shoplifted and gotten away with it. I still would not recommend that.

Its a dicey situation and the tie goes to BCIS, ie if they think you are married, YOU ARE MARRIED.

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

That's great news! It seems the only logical way in order to plan a
traditional wedding and reception....

"metabolife" <tabolife @yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > we have some friends who did just what you are talking about, and they didnt
    > have any problems.
    >
    >
    > "Kristina" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > This question has been posed on a different board and I'd like some
    > > more feedback...
    > >
    > > If we don't get our K-1 in time for our Catholic wedding (I'd like to
    > > set the date for September 4, 2004) can we just get married by a
    > > priest but NOT file any paperwork with the state of Ohio? Is this
    > > really illegal? (Provided, of course, that the priest would permit
    > > this.) I didn't think a wedding was a legal marriage without some sort
    > > of official court document. My NOA 1 is dated December 15 and I'm
    > > worried that 8 1/2 months is not enough time to obtain the K-1 thru
    > > the NSC and the US Embassy in Paris.
    > >
    > > Your help would be great. Thanks.

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

So you are going to ignore everyone else? I am glad you got the answer you are looking for which may not actually be the right answer.

If you are looking for logically thinking, the BCIS is not going to make you happy.

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

Postings take hours to display on this site, so I could not read the
other responses by the time I made my comments.

Please explain why a religious marriage is a legal marriage without
the government's documentation and approval. I am not trying to take
advantage of the law, I'm just trying to understand it.




DCMark <member6276@british_expats.com> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > So you are going to ignore everyone else? I am glad you got the answer
    > you are looking for which may not actually be the right answer.
    >
    >
    >
    > If you are looking for logically thinking, the BCIS is not going to make
    > you happy.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > Originally posted by Kristina
    >
    > > That's great news! It seems the only logical way in order to plan a
    >
    > > traditional wedding and reception....
    >
    > >
    >
    > > "metabolife" <tabolife @yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<yqWdnZ2649AcrZzdRVn-
    > > [email protected]>...
    >
    > > > we have some friends who did just what you are talking about,
    > > and they didnt
    >
    > > > have any problems.
    >
    > > >
    >
    > > >
    >
    > > > "Kristina" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >
    > > > news:[email protected]"]news-
    > > :[email protected][/url]...
    >
    > > > > This question has been posed on a different board and I'd like
    > > some
    >
    > > > > more feedback...
    >
    > > > >
    >
    > > > > If we don't get our K-1 in time for our Catholic wedding (I'd
    > > like to
    >
    > > > > set the date for September 4, 2004) can we just get married by
    > > a
    >
    > > > > priest but NOT file any paperwork with the state of Ohio? Is
    > > this
    >
    > > > > really illegal? (Provided, of course, that the priest would
    > > permit
    >
    > > > > this.) I didn't think a wedding was a legal marriage without
    > > some sort
    >
    > > > > of official court document. My NOA 1 is dated December 15 and
    > > I'm
    >
    > > > > worried that 8 1/2 months is not enough time to obtain the K-1
    > > thru
    >
    > > > > the NSC and the US Embassy in Paris.
    >
    > > > >
    >
    > > > Your help would be great. Thanks.

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

Kristina,


If you were to do a google search on DCMark you would find dozens of
profane postings and rude postings and postings where this person just
likes to sling mud and start fights.

Don't waste your time arguing with this known trouble maker.


If a marriage does not take place with a govt issued license, it is
not a legal marriage, and the govt does not recognize it. Commons
sense tells you that.

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

"Kristina" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > Postings take hours to display on this site, so I could not read the
    > other responses by the time I made my comments.
    > Please explain why a religious marriage is a legal marriage without
    > the government's documentation and approval. I am not trying to take
    > advantage of the law, I'm just trying to understand it.

It isn't. However, when you are playing the K-1 "game" you don't want to
give immigration officials any time to stop and think because that usually
results in an RFE. If there is any question that you already got married
you'll be in for some big delays. That happened to another poster.

In my mind the answer is quite simple. If you do have any sort of blessing
prior to the actual marriage, keep very quiet about it!!! That, of course,
is harder if your fiance makes an entry to the US for said blessing.

Andy.

--
I'm not really here, it's just your warped imagination

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

I suggest www.britishexpats.com then its much better for reading these messages.

You never answered my questions about whether the wedding is in France or the US.

As Andy says, when dealing with the BCIS you do not want to give them a reason to deny you. Whether its logical or not, they could consider a blessing as a wedding. It has happened I think. So be careful.

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

[email protected] (Kristina) wrote in message news:<[email protected] om>...
    > This question has been posed on a different board and I'd like some
    > more feedback...
    >
    > If we don't get our K-1 in time for our Catholic wedding (I'd like to
    > set the date for September 4, 2004) can we just get married by a
    > priest but NOT file any paperwork with the state of Ohio? Is this
    > really illegal? (Provided, of course, that the priest would permit
    > this.) I didn't think a wedding was a legal marriage without some sort
    > of official court document. My NOA 1 is dated December 15 and I'm
    > worried that 8 1/2 months is not enough time to obtain the K-1 thru
    > the NSC and the US Embassy in Paris.
    >
    > Your help would be great. Thanks.

------

Hi Kristina,
I got married in the RC church and we had to take engaged
encounter/pre cana that is a church requirement in most parishes. My
fiance came to my country(CDN) and did the engaged encounter weekend
on one of his visits. Getting married civilly is not seen as
sacramental in the Church's eyes. We did the K3, married in my
country, because my US (now) husband did not want to plan a wedding. I
also think the K3 is going faster from what I am reading. You should
talk to the priest in your fiance's parish and find out how to proceed
if you haven't already. I think in France Church and Government are
different?

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

I'm in a similar situation - it can be very tricky and I've had to postpone my wedding 3 times due to BCIS screwups. My priest in Scotland is happy to perform a full nuptial mass for us after we are legally married in the US. The only difference is that we won't have a marriage license in the UK or sign the register. In the continent this is quite normal, so the Catholic Church doesn't have an issue with it, but legally you have to be married first.

My advice would be not to set a date though, it's too awful when you are calling people for the third time telling them the date is postponed and there is nothing you can do about it!

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

Kristina,

Sounds like you're in a similar situation we were in.

Our main problem was that we couldn't find a catholic priest willing to work with us once we got our K1. We didn't plan on ANY date until I got my visa, which was VERY WISE... because it turned out that what we THOUGHT was going to be maximum wait (180 days wait + 30 days to get the visa, etc.) turned out to be far longer thanks to NSC's problems... so our planned "safe date" we were hoping for (Sept. 2003) never could have happened. I got my visa November 5, 2003.

Anyway.

All this being said, our problem was that no priest would marry us without 6 months advance notice/pre-canna courses. We only have 90 days, not 6 months...

So, we chose to do a very intimate legal ceremony (which is happening in a few weeks!), and later this summer do a blessing with the catholic church.

The problem with the catholic church is that for your marriage to be VALID in their eyes, the marriage HAS TO BE REGISTERED IN THE CHURCH'S DOCUMENTS - with the parish AND with the bishop's office. EVEN IF IT IS JUST A BLESSING.

To the eyes of the church, your legal marriage (before or after) isn't the important one. It's the Catholic church date/papers that matter.

THIS is why it's difficult to assume that even if it's unlicensed and not registered with the state that it's not a "legal marriage". When you bring religion, and especially religious organisations with such complex hierarchy and administrative power, into the mix, you're playing with fire.

In the end, what is going to matter is the opinion of the USCIS officers who examine your case. AND how the church is going to look at your union.

If I were you - and I'm not :D - I'd play it safe. WAIT. Don't plan on dates. Things can happen, things can go wrong... you never know... and it's usually not your fault. So. Wait it out, do a civil ceremony in the US once you have your K1, THEN plan a "real wedding" blessing, take your time, invite family, and do the whole shebang...

Good luck!

Elly

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

"Elenfair" <member9538@british_expats.com> wrote:

    > All this being said, our problem was that no priest would marry us
    > without 6 months advance notice/pre-canna courses. We only have 90
    > days, not 6 months...

This really does differ from priest to priest (probably dioscesan rules have
something to do with it too). Friends of ours (no immigration issues here)
who got married in a Catholic church in Arlington, VA got to choose between
the series of meetings and a weekend retreat - they chose the retreat.

Andy.

--
I'm not really here, it's just your warped imagination

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

I do think that it all depends on the priest. Some of them are
sticklers and others frankly don't care. As far as pre-caana classes
go, I'm pretty lucky: our priest agreed to let us pass our
pre-marital counseling in France last summer, so at least we're done
with that!!!

And it's probably a good idea to wait to plan the wedding, maybe until
NOA 2 ??

*****Anyone have any idea how long the US Embassy in France takes to
approve
K-1s once they receive all necessary documentation?*****




EllieGlasgow <member19647@british_expats.com> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > I'm in a similar situation - it can be very tricky and I've had to
    > postpone my wedding 3 times due to BCIS screwups. My priest in Scotland
    > is happy to perform a full nuptial mass for us after we are legally
    > married in the US. The only difference is that we won't have a marriage
    > license in the UK or sign the register. In the continent this is quite
    > normal, so the Catholic Church doesn't have an issue with it, but
    > legally you have to be married first.
    >
    >
    >
    > My advice would be not to set a date though, it's too awful when you are
    > calling people for the third time telling them the date is postponed and
    > there is nothing you can do about it!
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > Originally posted by Kristina
    >
    > > This question has been posed on a different board and I'd like some
    >
    > > more feedback...
    >
    > >
    >
    > > If we don't get our K-1 in time for our Catholic wedding (I'd like to
    >
    > > set the date for September 4, 2004) can we just get married by a
    >
    > > priest but NOT file any paperwork with the state of Ohio? Is this
    >
    > > really illegal? (Provided, of course, that the priest would permit
    >
    > > this.) I didn't think a wedding was a legal marriage without some sort
    >
    > > of official court document. My NOA 1 is dated December 15 and I'm
    >
    > > worried that 8 1/2 months is not enough time to obtain the K-1 thru
    >
    > > the NSC and the US Embassy in Paris.
    >
    > >
    >
    > Your help would be great. Thanks.

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

[email protected] (Kristina) wrote in message news:<[email protected]. com>...
    > I do think that it all depends on the priest. Some of them are
    > sticklers and others frankly don't care. As far as pre-caana classes
    > go, I'm pretty lucky: our priest agreed to let us pass our
    > pre-marital counseling in France last summer, so at least we're done
    > with that!!!
    >
    > And it's probably a good idea to wait to plan the wedding, maybe until
    > NOA 2 ??
    >
    > *****Anyone have any idea how long the US Embassy in France takes to
    > approve
    > K-1s once they receive all necessary documentation?*****
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > EllieGlasgow <member19647@british_expats.com> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > > I'm in a similar situation - it can be very tricky and I've had to
    > > postpone my wedding 3 times due to BCIS screwups. My priest in Scotland
    > > is happy to perform a full nuptial mass for us after we are legally
    > > married in the US. The only difference is that we won't have a marriage
    > > license in the UK or sign the register. In the continent this is quite
    > > normal, so the Catholic Church doesn't have an issue with it, but
    > > legally you have to be married first.
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > > My advice would be not to set a date though, it's too awful when you are
    > > calling people for the third time telling them the date is postponed and
    > > there is nothing you can do about it!
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > > Originally posted by Kristina
    > >
    > > > This question has been posed on a different board and I'd like some
    >
    > > > more feedback...
    >
    > > >
    >
    > > > If we don't get our K-1 in time for our Catholic wedding (I'd like to
    >
    > > > set the date for September 4, 2004) can we just get married by a
    >
    > > > priest but NOT file any paperwork with the state of Ohio? Is this
    >
    > > > really illegal? (Provided, of course, that the priest would permit
    >
    > > > this.) I didn't think a wedding was a legal marriage without some sort
    >
    > > > of official court document. My NOA 1 is dated December 15 and I'm
    >
    > > > worried that 8 1/2 months is not enough time to obtain the K-1 thru
    >
    > > > the NSC and the US Embassy in Paris.
    >
    > > >
    > >
    > > Your help would be great. Thanks.

thats interesting to read about other faiths

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

I have never been to a catholic wedding
"reargunner666" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > [email protected] (Kristina) wrote in message
news:<[email protected]. com>...
    > > I do think that it all depends on the priest. Some of them are
    > > sticklers and others frankly don't care. As far as pre-caana classes
    > > go, I'm pretty lucky: our priest agreed to let us pass our
    > > pre-marital counseling in France last summer, so at least we're done
    > > with that!!!
    > >
    > > And it's probably a good idea to wait to plan the wedding, maybe until
    > > NOA 2 ??
    > >
    > > *****Anyone have any idea how long the US Embassy in France takes to
    > > approve
    > > K-1s once they receive all necessary documentation?*****
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > > EllieGlasgow <member19647@british_expats.com> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
    > > > I'm in a similar situation - it can be very tricky and I've had to
    > > > postpone my wedding 3 times due to BCIS screwups. My priest in
Scotland
    > > > is happy to perform a full nuptial mass for us after we are legally
    > > > married in the US. The only difference is that we won't have a
marriage
    > > > license in the UK or sign the register. In the continent this is
quite
    > > > normal, so the Catholic Church doesn't have an issue with it, but
    > > > legally you have to be married first.
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > > My advice would be not to set a date though, it's too awful when you
are
    > > > calling people for the third time telling them the date is postponed
and
    > > > there is nothing you can do about it!
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > > Originally posted by Kristina
    > > >
    > > > > This question has been posed on a different board and I'd like some
    > >
    > > > > more feedback...
    > >
    > > > >
    > >
    > > > > If we don't get our K-1 in time for our Catholic wedding (I'd like
to
    > >
    > > > > set the date for September 4, 2004) can we just get married by a
    > >
    > > > > priest but NOT file any paperwork with the state of Ohio? Is this
    > >
    > > > > really illegal? (Provided, of course, that the priest would permit
    > >
    > > > > this.) I didn't think a wedding was a legal marriage without some
sort
    > >
    > > > > of official court document. My NOA 1 is dated December 15 and I'm
    > >
    > > > > worried that 8 1/2 months is not enough time to obtain the K-1 thru
    > >
    > > > > the NSC and the US Embassy in Paris.
    > >
    > > > >
    > > >
    > > > Your help would be great. Thanks.
    > thats interesting to read about other faiths

Re: Catholic Wedding
 

In the San Antonio diocese, you can take the Pre-Cana course in one all day session on a Saturday. That was the least of my "problems" to being married in the Catholic Church.