Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

Hi guys
I have been planning to come back to the UK for some time and was happy with the idea of coming back and being close to my family.

However since the CV19 situation I have been felling uneasy about coming back.

From the media coverage I have seen it seems the fundamental freedoms I remember are under attack, the economy and opportunities are taking a battering, I also worry I might not be able to find work in the UK although I have savings so I can manage for a while.

Am I right to question the future and potential for a fresh start in the UK, am I the only one with reservations about the future in the UK?

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

Lets be honest, with continuing lockdowns and Aus businesses going bust because of it, is Australia any better a proposition than the UK?

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

That is a very good point, The company I work for (part time, casual) just made 40% of the support staff redundant and I work in a very volatile industry in WA.

I miss my family, my dad died after a short illness last year in the UK, my mum has poor health and I do not want to lose her and regret not seeing her again.

I guess in some ways my head says stay in Aus, my heart says UK.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

Go with your head. Your heart will catch up.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

:goodpost: Being an expat is never easy, nor being thousands of miles from family, but throwing away what you have in times of economic chaos, when the chances are that moving will make things worse, isn't a particularly wise decision.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

What does this mean? Sounds like paranoid American views because, in the current situation, one has been asked to social distance, wear a mask and be considerate to your fellow man.
What fundamental freedoms are under attack?
Think you are reading the Daily Mail too much.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

Actually, that's not necessarily the case at all.

It will all depend on the person and the circs, and each person must work that out for themselves.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

I think that's what she was saying "work it out" i.e. using your head, not making life-altering decisions purely based on emotions and tabloid headlines. :unsure:

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

Yes. you are sensible to review your plans
No. You are not the only one with reservations.

I am now applying a watch & wait approach. I had hoped for a perm UK return this time next year. That is off the cards for now. Instead I am looking to how our NZ life can be somehow improved or perhaps I mean enriched. I wish to be closer to the people we love in the UK but we also need to consider the stable base we have here in NZ. I know a couple just returned to the UK from NZ and with the Covid thing they are really stuck right now.

I realise your Mum is in poor health but see if you can bring your mind to wait a while . See how things settle.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

I guess my fear is how long the CV19 restrictions will be in place, things here are not ideal either with no real end in sight to the lockdown and the massive job losses.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

Restrictions are in place world wide, including in Australia. How long for, nobody knows. In the U.K., they are starting to ease. In England, all shops can open in a couple of weeks, pubs and restaurants probably end of the month. Jobs, well, Australia had a slightly higher unemployment rate than the U.K. prior to the virus and it is looking like that will be the car post virus, with U.K. estimated it will be about 9.5 and Australia about 10

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

I assume you mean percent not millions.

all things being equal it is about where I wanna be, everything else is comparable.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

What ones are you particularly concerned about?

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

Just general freedoms such as the freedom to associate, freedom to travel, being able to work and operate a business without the government breathing down your neck, with added rules and red tape.

From what I am seeing coming out of the UK it is concerning how civil liberties are being undermined by this pandemic and we are being told this is the "new normal" and things wont return to any kind of normality until a vaccine.

The Track and Trace seem Orwellian too with sweeping government powers to detain / lock-down people suspected of having come into contact with CV19 with no probable cause or right to appeal.

It seems there is an apathy among the general population around what this means to human rights going forward.

Hard fought freedoms lost in the name of a public health crisis I suspect we have lost forever without another fight to get the back once the crisis has passed.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

I'm always puzzled why some people think temporary restrictions designed to protect constitute a loss of 'hard fought freedoms'. What do you suggest was a better response to this disease? What, if any, steps do you think the UK government should have taken?

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

:unsure:

You want a good safe country for your old Mum, you accept the hard yards now. No moaning. It isn't that tough .

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

Many experts are coming out and saying the same thing, protect the vulnerable only, this virus was never a serious threat to healthy people. So the cure now is worse than the disease.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

Your thread title says you are in agony over your decision on whether to move back. It doesn’t sound like you want to come back at all, it sounds like you will be better off staying in WA enjoying all your hard won freedoms.

”Throw out your vulnerable” is not a mantra that is followed here so you wouldn’t be happy living in such a society.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

The New World Order is upon us. Next we will learn that David Icke's stories about our ruler being giant lizards are based on reality.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

I think it is true to say that hundreds of years of struggle by our forefathers led to us having a liberal democracy with relative freedoms, my grandfather being one of those who fought tyranny in the shape of the Nazis. It would be a shame to lose all that effort and lives lost over this crisis and politicians (everywhere) exploiting the crisis for political power.

I was pretty clear that we should protect the vulnerable and take sensible precautions and ultimately not destroy jobs, businesses and our society will take years to recover.

All of this applies equally to Australia and pretty much every other country so I am not having a dig at the UK.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

Needless to say I totally disagree with your statements on loss of freedoms based on what you have been reading in the media. We live here and have not experienced or felt any loss of freedoms. Test and trace is entirely voluntary, people will only be advised to self isolate, the minister made that quite clear. A week or 2 back he was asked if vaccinations would be mandatory once a vaccine is available. His response was that vaccinations have never been mandated and won’t be in future since enough folks do it voluntarily to get the herd immunity needed.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

Really? I'll tell the two widows of friends that have passed away from it, and their young children, that then. Both men in their early 40's with no underlying health conditions whatsoever.

I'll take restrictions of my freedom (which are very limited anyway IMO) over the risk of losing my loved ones any day personally.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

Well frankly, I do have my concerns about the current contents of No.10.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

If that's what you really think, then you've answered your own question. Stay where you are.

Personally, if it were in my power, and if I really thought that the country I want to live in were under threat in the way you describe then I would be on the first plane back to try and help do something about it. But it isn't - yet - in my power to return. And there is no plot to take our "freedom" just some temporary measures to control a virus for which we have no vaccine and not much in the way of treatment. Are you in any way aware of the measures that the UK took during WWII when people were busy fighting those Nazis you mention? If not, you should look them up. I certainly wouldn't let any of this stuff stop me from being somewhere I really wanted to be.

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

(1) we protect the vulnerable be acting to minimize the incidence of the disease in the public at large. Isolating so far as possible all the vulnerable isn't likely to work very well if we allow the infection rate of the public at large to be 30%+ especially as there appear to be asymptomatic carriers who can infect people. And (2) it is easy to be wise after the event - back in March when everything got shut down, we had very little reliable data and some early figures seemed to suggest 10%+ mortality, and if that had been true then I think most of us would be very glad that the stable door was shut relatively early, and that governments hadn't waited until more reliable date became available several weeks later! :rolleyes:

Re: Agony over decision to come back to UK
 

This is a tortuous question to answer which most of us on here have gone through at some point. I would keep it simple, ignoring media for now, although there are very real changes in the UK in the last 20 years which you might like or not.

- Weigh up what you would be leaving in Oz and what you would be gaining in the UK, particularly dependent on the locations you are leaving and arriving to locally.
- What also would be left for you in the UK when, sadly, your Mom passes away? What would you do then?
- I've certainly experienced that the UK is not easy for socialising compared to Asia where I was before, although I can't comment on Oz.
- Could it be simpler if you take a long break and spend three or more months with your Mom in the UK? Bearing in mind UK residency ties which might screw up your tax situation.
- Could you move back to Oz without visa worries if you wanted to? Again, there's some tax implications to consider.
- If you're single and free, then open the champoo as you only have yourself to really worry about which makes things much easier and totally under your decision.

Just some ideas for you, and anyone else worrying of the same. I'm certainly not expecting you to reply, but I think the "think with your head and your heart will catch up" comment is very apt.

All the best. MP