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-   -   Making A Will (https://britishexpats.com/forum/middle-east-60/making-will-748584/)

mentalist Feb 14th 2012 6:17 pm

Making A Will
 
Tried using the search facilty but gave up after 20 minutes. Having been quoted Dhs3,000 by Global Eye for making a "simple" UAE will, does anybody have any other suggestions for doing the deed without going through a solicitor? All the on-line companies I have found only seem to cater for wills valid in England and Wales, not much use for me as almost all of my assets are off-shore. Many thanks, guys and Meow.:)

UKCityGent Feb 14th 2012 6:27 pm

Re: Making A Will
 
I had made a will recently in Q8 - I was told that sharia law is applied to the assets all expats that are held in the Q8 (probably most countries in ME), no matter their religion. 99.9% of my assets are spread over different countries and jurisdications - I was told that you can make matters a little more in your favour by having a will translated into Arabic and attested by the courts.
If you have joint accounts then these may/will be frozen during the period - so perhaps its wise to have an emergency account in the wifes name as well.

The Dean Feb 14th 2012 6:35 pm

Re: Making A Will
 

Originally Posted by mentalist (Post 9903025)
Tried using the search facilty but gave up after 20 minutes. Having been quoted Dhs3,000 by Global Eye for making a "simple" UAE will, does anybody have any other suggestions for doing the deed without going through a solicitor? All the on-line companies I have found only seem to cater for wills valid in England and Wales, not much use for me as almost all of my assets are off-shore. Many thanks, guys and Meow.:)

:sick::scaredhair:

Meow Feb 14th 2012 6:54 pm

Re: Making A Will
 

Originally Posted by mentalist (Post 9903025)
Tried using the search facilty but gave up after 20 minutes. Having been quoted Dhs3,000 by Global Eye for making a "simple" UAE will, does anybody have any other suggestions for doing the deed without going through a solicitor? All the on-line companies I have found only seem to cater for wills valid in England and Wales, not much use for me as almost all of my assets are off-shore. Many thanks, guys and Meow.:)

Hello

Just send me a PM and I'lll give you the info you want. You should use a solicitor (not someone who has been on a will writring course) as it is very important to get this right. Lawyers probably make as much money sorting out faulty wills as they do writing them!

You do not require a 'UAE will'. If you are a British national then you require a will written in accordance with British law. Clearly the person who spoke to you hasn't a clue. You need one will only and that can take into account assets worldwide.

There is far too much incorrect nonsense spouted about wills for expats. It's simple really - they should be written in accordance with home country rules, there is no such thing as a 'Sharia compliant' will and the last will you make is the only valid one.

There is a piece about wills on my blog.

EDIT> Here's the link. http://financialuae.me/2011/05/11/where-theres-a-will/ It's an article I wrote with a local magazine last year but is still valid

Meow Feb 14th 2012 7:03 pm

Re: Making A Will
 

Originally Posted by UKCityGent (Post 9903033)
I had made a will recently in Q8 - I was told that sharia law is applied to the assets all expats that are held in the Q8 (probably most countries in ME), no matter their religion. 99.9% of my assets are spread over different countries and jurisdications - I was told that you can make matters a little more in your favour by having a will translated into Arabic and attested by the courts.
If you have joint accounts then these may/will be frozen during the period - so perhaps its wise to have an emergency account in the wifes name as well.

It is law in the UAE that a man's assets, even those held in joint names, are frozen on death. That includes bank accounts and cars.

A properly written will (translation & attestation can be done post-mortem) should be honoured by the UAE courts and to date, none haven't been for non-muslim expats. You just have to prepare properly.

Norm_uk Feb 14th 2012 9:07 pm

Re: Making A Will
 
Something often overlooked when considering a will is that expats will have to face things like local accounts being frozen and charges related to releasing bodies and sending them home.

All things no one needs to be worrying about at a very difficult time. It is equally as important to ensure you have some measure of decent life insurance in place that is properly underwritten by a good company (ie; not a cheap local one but an international one with a sterling track record). The last thing anyone needs is a widow or widower, perhaps with children unable to face daily expenses or take care of an estate due to lack of money.

Don't rely on company life cover - they often use the cheapest companies without proper underwriting and name themselves as beneficiaries first (in case you own them anything...or they think you owe them something).

I won't start on inheritance tax if you are a UK national, it's too early in the day :sneaky:

N.

Bob Feb 15th 2012 1:01 am

Re: Making A Will
 

Originally Posted by Meow (Post 9903057)
There is far too much incorrect nonsense spouted about wills for expats. It's simple really - they should be written in accordance with home country rules, there is no such thing as a 'Sharia compliant' will and the last will you make is the only valid one.

Depends on the country you live in. It's not a one answer fits all.

For some, it might be sensible to have a will in each country covering assets in that country.

For some, it might be better to have a will in the country they are residing in.

Meow Feb 15th 2012 4:42 pm

Re: Making A Will
 

Originally Posted by Bob (Post 9903485)
Depends on the country you live in. It's not a one answer fits all.

For some, it might be sensible to have a will in each country covering assets in that country.

For some, it might be better to have a will in the country they are residing in.

In the vast majority of cases the last will you make is valid - hence the term 'last will and testament'. The making of another will invalidates any previous ones written and that is certainly the case for British nationals. You should therefore have just the one will that takes into account assets in different countries.

Sorry Bob, suggesting otherwise could put people in a very difficult and unwanted legal position.

Bear in mind also that British nationals, no matter where they are living and no matter where they hold assets, are subject to UK Inheritance laws.

Bob Feb 16th 2012 8:22 am

Re: Making A Will
 

Originally Posted by Meow (Post 9904766)
In the vast majority of cases the last will you make is valid - hence the term 'last will and testament'. The making of another will invalidates any previous ones written and that is certainly the case for British nationals. You should therefore have just the one will that takes into account assets in different countries.

Sorry Bob, suggesting otherwise could put people in a very difficult and unwanted legal position.

Bear in mind also that British nationals, no matter where they are living and no matter where they hold assets, are subject to UK Inheritance laws.

They are also subject to the laws of the country they are resident in.

Sometimes it just is easier having a will per country, dealing with assets, especially property based in the country they are held.

I'm not saying it is the case for every one, certainly in the UAE, but I wouldn't also say in a blanket statement that one will, in the UK alone for everyone is a good idea either.

james1966 Feb 16th 2012 10:23 pm

Re: Making A Will
 
Probably a good idea to have the minimum amount of assets held in ME.

The Dean Feb 17th 2012 2:35 am

Re: Making A Will
 

Originally Posted by Bob (Post 9905955)
They are also subject to the laws of the country they are resident in.

Sometimes it just is easier having a will per country, dealing with assets, especially property based in the country they are held.

I'm not saying it is the case for every one, certainly in the UAE, but I wouldn't also say in a blanket statement that one will, in the UK alone for everyone is a good idea either.

My solicitor back in the UK says that, wherever you travel to work, emigrate, settle, whatever - only ever have ONE WILL.

james1966 Feb 17th 2012 2:49 am

Re: Making A Will
 

Originally Posted by The Dean (Post 9907146)
My solicitor back in the UK says that, wherever you travel to work, emigrate, settle, whatever - only ever have ONE WILL.

I would think that you could have as many wills as you like, but the only valid one will be the last one.

I'm not a solicitor by the way, I just believe that's the way it is.

MacScot Feb 17th 2012 4:10 am

Re: Making A Will
 

Originally Posted by Bob (Post 9905955)
They are also subject to the laws of the country they are resident in.

Sometimes it just is easier having a will per country, dealing with assets, especially property based in the country they are held.

I'm not saying it is the case for every one, certainly in the UAE, but I wouldn't also say in a blanket statement that one will, in the UK alone for everyone is a good idea either.

That would be right for my case and perhaps for other Brits with dual nationality.

Bob Feb 17th 2012 9:26 am

Re: Making A Will
 

Originally Posted by The Dean (Post 9907146)
My solicitor back in the UK says that, wherever you travel to work, emigrate, settle, whatever - only ever have ONE WILL.

Like I said, that probably is the case for many, most here in the ME section, but it isn't for everyone, which is why I mention it shouldn't be just a blanket statement for everyone.

The Dean Feb 17th 2012 4:39 pm

Re: Making A Will
 

Originally Posted by Bob (Post 9907939)
Like I said, that probably is the case for many, most here in the ME section, but it isn't for everyone, which is why I mention it shouldn't be just a blanket statement for everyone.

Come on then: under what circumstances would you need/want more than one? I'm no lawyer but I can see the arguments (or worse) developing already....

"I'm in Will 1, but not in Will 2?? I'm going to sue!"
"Will 2 is dated later than Will 1, so Will 1 must be invalid!"
"It says here that this will replaces all previous wills - that must include the one written in another country!"
"Dad owned property in the UAE?? I never knew that - he never told me! Can I challenge his UAE will?"
"Sharia Law?? What the ****'s that?? I'm going to ask my solicitor in Bognor Regis for his views!"

Good grief...............

Bob Feb 18th 2012 7:28 am

Re: Making A Will
 

Originally Posted by The Dean (Post 9908397)
Come on then: under what circumstances would you need/want more than one? I'm no lawyer but I can see the arguments (or worse) developing already....

"I'm in Will 1, but not in Will 2?? I'm going to sue!"
"Will 2 is dated later than Will 1, so Will 1 must be invalid!"
"It says here that this will replaces all previous wills - that must include the one written in another country!"
"Dad owned property in the UAE?? I never knew that - he never told me! Can I challenge his UAE will?"
"Sharia Law?? What the ****'s that?? I'm going to ask my solicitor in Bognor Regis for his views!"

Good grief...............

I said to have a will in a country covering assets in that country, so what you're saying won't happen.

If you have assets in one country that you don't want another country to know about, maybe for tax reasons or whatever, you don't lump everything together.

Another instance, those who aren't US citizens get a much lower threshold before stuff gets taxed on the estate so if you've got assets in the US it makes sense to limit what might be seen there by the estate.

The Dean Feb 18th 2012 12:42 pm

Re: Making A Will
 

Originally Posted by Bob (Post 9909112)
I said to have a will in a country covering assets in that country, so what you're saying won't happen.

If you have assets in one country that you don't want another country to know about, maybe for tax reasons or whatever, you don't lump everything together.

Another instance, those who aren't US citizens get a much lower threshold before stuff gets taxed on the estate so if you've got assets in the US it makes sense to limit what might be seen there by the estate.

You seem very trusting............ if I found out that my father, say, had substantial assets in another country, and that I wasn't a beneficiary I might get a little shirty........ or are you suggesting that the beneficiaries would only be chosen from the same country in which the assets are located?

I have one will, and am doing my best to ensure that it is applicable and recognised in every country that matters - where I live, where I might retire to, where the assets are, and where the beneficiaries are located.

Bob Feb 18th 2012 1:01 pm

Re: Making A Will
 

Originally Posted by The Dean (Post 9909445)
You seem very trusting............ if I found out that my father, say, had substantial assets in another country, and that I wasn't a beneficiary I might get a little shirty........ or are you suggesting that the beneficiaries would only be chosen from the same country in which the assets are located?

I have one will, and am doing my best to ensure that it is applicable and recognised in every country that matters - where I live, where I might retire to, where the assets are, and where the beneficiaries are located.

Beneficiaries can be anywhere.

Beneficiaries can get shirty where ever and whatever the assets, so it wouldn't make a difference if they contested the will so the only way to prevent that is to equally distribute stuff.

So nothing changes.

All this does is separate assets and tax liabilities if you didn't want them mixed up, which for some people, in some countries can be to your advantage.

Meow Feb 18th 2012 4:56 pm

Re: Making A Will
 
Just once more - as a British national ONLY your LAST will is valid. If you have more than one others will be invalidated. Fact.

Do not make multiple wills for different countries as that is not how the system works. Just because you have assets outside of the UK, it doesn't mean that aren't subject to UK law. If you are UK domiciled - and most people will be - you are subject to UK Inheritance laws, and taxes, on death no matter where you have been residing or where your assets are.

I am not a solicitor, but I do know how the system works. Make sure you speak to a professional who really understands the legal implications as lawyers make more money from sorting out incorrectly written wills (especially home drafted ones) than they do from writing them in the first place.


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