Expat Tax!!!!!!!

Old Nov 9th 2004, 9:16 am
  #1  
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Default Expat Tax!!!!!!!

Sorry it's so long but thought you might be interested. JB




Goodbye Sunshine
>
>Speculation is mounting that the UK and possibly other countries in the
>Organisation of Economic Co-operation & Development (OECD) are about to
>introduce global taxation for expatriates. The impact could be profound for
>the Gulf.
>
>Following a visit to the UAE in July, the chairman of the British
>Conservative Party, Liam Fox, sent a letter to Gordon Brown, the Chancellor
>of the Exchequer, asking a singular question. Was the government preparing
>to introduce worldwide income taxation in its next budget? While in a
>statement the UK Treasury denied that any technical review was under way it
>did not rule out the introduction of global taxation in the future.
>
>For the 200,000 UK nationals resident in the GCC, there are few policy
>issues more likely to cause sleepless nights. Equally, for the economies of
>the gulf, the imposition of income tax on expatriate workers has serious and
>complex ramifications. The imposition of income tax on UK nationals could
>hoover $ 2,000 million a year out of the region.
>
>"Gordon Brown will not rule out changes to non-resident's tax arrangements
>and I fear no taxpayer is safe from the government's addiction to tax," UK
>shadow chancellor Oliver Letwin said in a statement on 23rd August 2004.
>"The rumours of further tax-grabs by the British government will not go
>away. There is no doubt that if Labour wins the next election they will have
>to raise taxes to fill the black hole in the public finances. What isn't
>clear is who will be subjected to these third term tax rises." With a
>general election likely to be held in the UK next year, the heated rhetoric
>is unsurprising, but the lack of a statement saying such a move would be
>reversed by any new Conservative government is significant.
>
>Senior businessmen in the region are taking the threat seriously. "It is by
>no means certain that legislative changes will be made, although options are
>definitely being considered," says David Hodgkinson, the chief executive and
>deputy chairman of HSBC Bank Middle East. "Such a step would have an adverse
>impact on one of Britain's key invisible exports-the provision of expertise
>to international markets. It may encourage a number of British residents in
>the UAE to consider a change of domicile, given the attractiveness of
>long-term residence there."
>
>If the chancellor does decide to tax worldwide income it will set a
>precedent which other finance ministers will find hard to resist. At
>present, almost all OECD countries grant tax exemptions for nationals
>working abroad for a minimum period. The stark exception is the US, which
>has taxed the worldwide earnings of its citizens since 1976. However, if
>Australia, Germany, France and Italy were to follow a move by the UK to
>impose expatriate income tax-as is likely-up to 400,000 workers in the
>region could be effected.
>
>Few tears will be shed at home if these governments do decide to tax high
>earners overseas in order to fund social programmes and essential services
>at home. Expatriates can reasonably expect to enjoy a 50% increase in living
>standards by moving to the gulf, where many receive sizeable housing and
>vehicle allowances. Any move to introduce universal EU worldwide income tax,
>especially for those working in the oil-rich gulf, is likely to prove
>popular with voters in Europe who are struggling to come to terms with high
>energy prices and rising costs of the welfare state.
>
>Disposable Income
>
>The EU's aim to align tax policy is moving slowly forward and a co-ordinated
>move by the member states is possibly within reach. The GCC and EU have been
>at loggerheads for almost two decades about a free trade area, with a major
>European objection being the discriminatory treatment of local firms in the
>region. The absence of personal income and corporate taxation throughout the
>GCC in designated free zones has also drawn critical attention. Developments
>such as the Dubai International Financial Centre, which will offer lucrative
>incentives for some of the highest earning professionals in the financial
>services industry, could suck wealth out of the City of London and
>Frankfurt.
>
>Any policy change could reverse the flow. The potential loss of disposable
>income would drive many expatriates away from the region and discourage
>others from seeking employment there. Based on average earnings of £30,000
>($53,700), a single person working in the gulf might have to pay £5,000
>($8,950) in worldwide income tax, if, for example, prevailing UK tax levels
>are applied. Those with an annual salary of £50,000 ($89,500) would see
>their annual salary fall by a hefty £12,207 ($21,851)
>
>The immediate effect this would have on gulf economies would be profound.
>Consumer spending in the UAE, which is home to the gulf's largest OECD
>workforce of which the biggest segment, about 150,000, are UK expatriates,
>would be hardest hit by the loss of disposable incomes. Based on the
>assumption that there are at least 100,000 economically active UK nationals
>in the federation earning on average £35,000 ($62,650) a year the imposition
>of worldwide income tax could drain £650 million ($1,164 million) from the
>local economy, which is roughly equivalent to 1% of the UAE's forecast GDP
>in 2004.
>
>Dubai, more than any other emirate, has aggressively advertised the benefits
>of working, residing and investing within its tax-free borders. Marketing
>campaigns for premium real estate developments such as Palm Island, The
>World and Emirates Hills play on the fact that people living in the UAE pay
>no income tax. The residential rental market would be as hard hit as the
>nascent buyer market. Any cooling of the domestic economy, prompted by a
>fall in consumer spending, could threaten the viability of many of the grand
>shopping projects under construction such as Mall of the Emirates and Dubai
>Mall.
>
>The entire region would be affected. MEED estimates that the direct impact
>on the region's financial flows would be massive; some $4,000 million a year
>could be sucked out of the GCC economies by foreign tax regimes. This is the
>equivalent of 1% of regional gross domestic product(GDP), but the knock-on
>impact on propensities to consume, marginal savings rates and the multiplier
>effect, the real impact could be considerably greater.
>
>Regional corporate strategy would also be hit. Key personnel-or at least
>those who regard them selves as key-would likely push to pass their new
>obligations back to their employers. Effective wage bills would rise and the
>attractions of non-OECD nationals would be enhanced. The benefits of
>multiple nationalities would take on a new dimension.
>
>Collection
>
>If OECD governments are to introduce worldwide income tax, collection will
>pose a stiff yet not insurmountable challenge. Many expatriates working in
>the gulf are already employed by major international companies and receive
>their salaries directly in their home countries-their salaries and packages
>could be accessed at will by the taxmen.
>
>However unsettling the impact of worldwide income taxation would be on the
>gulf, it could also create a window of opportunity. Local governments could
>find themselves able to impose income tax on expatriates without any
>negative economic impact. The structure of double taxation treaties would
>allow levies to be imposed on salaries or packages without any net
>difference to the individual. The tax burden would be the same but
>proportions of it would be redirected to host countries rather than the
>country of origin. The scramble for primary tax rights between governments
>could be frenetic. However, at present, GCC countries have a patchy treaty
>coverage. For example, only Kuwait and Oman have double taxation agreements
>in place with the UK; and Saudi Arabia's only such treaty is with France.
>Any movement to tax expatriates by home governments could trigger a flurry
>of activity on this front as regional authorities seek the flexibility of
>expanded options.
>
>Income taxation has already been examined closely in the Gulf. Riyadh drew
>up plans for the introduction of a 5% base income taxation rate for all
>expatriates, but the Majlis al-Shura rejected the move last year, arguing it
>would be suffocating to business as the costs would be passed back to the
>employers. Such a position could be rapidly altered if the policy amounted
>to little more than redirecting the flow from foreign to domestic
>governments.
>
>The idea already has supporters. The IMF has strongly recommended the
>imposition of a personal income tax system and value added tax among other
>measures including expanding the base of corporate income tax and
>introducing property tax as a means of broadening the revenue base of GCC
>economies that remain heavily dependent on oil exports.
>
>With the UK likely to play the role of catalyst in any regime change, the
>public utterances of Gordon Brown and the strength of the UK's fiscal
>position will be watched closely. That the treasury could expect an
>additional income in the order of £8,000 million ($12,000 million) a year
>from British expatriates around the world, and the political costs to the
>Labour government would appear to be manageable, could yet prove decisive.
>For the GCC, a policy shift in London could trigger an avalanche of OECD
>action that would have a dramatic impact on labour markets. For the
>expatriates and their employers, the threat of income tax-no matter how
>distant-has to be taken seriously.
>
>The table on the next page shows the effects across different income levels.
>


I have this table if anybody wants it. JB
>
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Old Nov 9th 2004, 9:22 am
  #2  
semarang
 
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Default Re: Expat Tax!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by Jellybean
Sorry it's so long but thought you might be interested. JB




Goodbye Sunshine
>
>Speculation is mounting that the UK and possibly other countries in the
>Organisation of Economic Co-operation & Development (OECD) are about to
>introduce global taxation for expatriates. The impact could be profound for
>the Gulf.
>
>Following a visit to the UAE in July, the chairman of the British
>Conservative Party, Liam Fox, sent a letter to Gordon Brown, the Chancellor
>of the Exchequer, asking a singular question. Was the government preparing
>to introduce worldwide income taxation in its next budget? While in a
>statement the UK Treasury denied that any technical review was under way it
>did not rule out the introduction of global taxation in the future.
>
>For the 200,000 UK nationals resident in the GCC, there are few policy
>issues more likely to cause sleepless nights. Equally, for the economies of
>the gulf, the imposition of income tax on expatriate workers has serious and
>complex ramifications. The imposition of income tax on UK nationals could
>hoover $ 2,000 million a year out of the region.
>
>"Gordon Brown will not rule out changes to non-resident's tax arrangements
>and I fear no taxpayer is safe from the government's addiction to tax," UK
>shadow chancellor Oliver Letwin said in a statement on 23rd August 2004.
>"The rumours of further tax-grabs by the British government will not go
>away. There is no doubt that if Labour wins the next election they will have
>to raise taxes to fill the black hole in the public finances. What isn't
>clear is who will be subjected to these third term tax rises." With a
>general election likely to be held in the UK next year, the heated rhetoric
>is unsurprising, but the lack of a statement saying such a move would be
>reversed by any new Conservative government is significant.
>
>Senior businessmen in the region are taking the threat seriously. "It is by
>no means certain that legislative changes will be made, although options are
>definitely being considered," says David Hodgkinson, the chief executive and
>deputy chairman of HSBC Bank Middle East. "Such a step would have an adverse
>impact on one of Britain's key invisible exports-the provision of expertise
>to international markets. It may encourage a number of British residents in
>the UAE to consider a change of domicile, given the attractiveness of
>long-term residence there."
>
>If the chancellor does decide to tax worldwide income it will set a
>precedent which other finance ministers will find hard to resist. At
>present, almost all OECD countries grant tax exemptions for nationals
>working abroad for a minimum period. The stark exception is the US, which
>has taxed the worldwide earnings of its citizens since 1976. However, if
>Australia, Germany, France and Italy were to follow a move by the UK to
>impose expatriate income tax-as is likely-up to 400,000 workers in the
>region could be effected.
>
>Few tears will be shed at home if these governments do decide to tax high
>earners overseas in order to fund social programmes and essential services
>at home. Expatriates can reasonably expect to enjoy a 50% increase in living
>standards by moving to the gulf, where many receive sizeable housing and
>vehicle allowances. Any move to introduce universal EU worldwide income tax,
>especially for those working in the oil-rich gulf, is likely to prove
>popular with voters in Europe who are struggling to come to terms with high
>energy prices and rising costs of the welfare state.
>
>Disposable Income
>
>The EU's aim to align tax policy is moving slowly forward and a co-ordinated
>move by the member states is possibly within reach. The GCC and EU have been
>at loggerheads for almost two decades about a free trade area, with a major
>European objection being the discriminatory treatment of local firms in the
>region. The absence of personal income and corporate taxation throughout the
>GCC in designated free zones has also drawn critical attention. Developments
>such as the Dubai International Financial Centre, which will offer lucrative
>incentives for some of the highest earning professionals in the financial
>services industry, could suck wealth out of the City of London and
>Frankfurt.
>
>Any policy change could reverse the flow. The potential loss of disposable
>income would drive many expatriates away from the region and discourage
>others from seeking employment there. Based on average earnings of £30,000
>($53,700), a single person working in the gulf might have to pay £5,000
>($8,950) in worldwide income tax, if, for example, prevailing UK tax levels
>are applied. Those with an annual salary of £50,000 ($89,500) would see
>their annual salary fall by a hefty £12,207 ($21,851)
>
>The immediate effect this would have on gulf economies would be profound.
>Consumer spending in the UAE, which is home to the gulf's largest OECD
>workforce of which the biggest segment, about 150,000, are UK expatriates,
>would be hardest hit by the loss of disposable incomes. Based on the
>assumption that there are at least 100,000 economically active UK nationals
>in the federation earning on average £35,000 ($62,650) a year the imposition
>of worldwide income tax could drain £650 million ($1,164 million) from the
>local economy, which is roughly equivalent to 1% of the UAE's forecast GDP
>in 2004.
>
>Dubai, more than any other emirate, has aggressively advertised the benefits
>of working, residing and investing within its tax-free borders. Marketing
>campaigns for premium real estate developments such as Palm Island, The
>World and Emirates Hills play on the fact that people living in the UAE pay
>no income tax. The residential rental market would be as hard hit as the
>nascent buyer market. Any cooling of the domestic economy, prompted by a
>fall in consumer spending, could threaten the viability of many of the grand
>shopping projects under construction such as Mall of the Emirates and Dubai
>Mall.
>
>The entire region would be affected. MEED estimates that the direct impact
>on the region's financial flows would be massive; some $4,000 million a year
>could be sucked out of the GCC economies by foreign tax regimes. This is the
>equivalent of 1% of regional gross domestic product(GDP), but the knock-on
>impact on propensities to consume, marginal savings rates and the multiplier
>effect, the real impact could be considerably greater.
>
>Regional corporate strategy would also be hit. Key personnel-or at least
>those who regard them selves as key-would likely push to pass their new
>obligations back to their employers. Effective wage bills would rise and the
>attractions of non-OECD nationals would be enhanced. The benefits of
>multiple nationalities would take on a new dimension.
>
>Collection
>
>If OECD governments are to introduce worldwide income tax, collection will
>pose a stiff yet not insurmountable challenge. Many expatriates working in
>the gulf are already employed by major international companies and receive
>their salaries directly in their home countries-their salaries and packages
>could be accessed at will by the taxmen.
>
>However unsettling the impact of worldwide income taxation would be on the
>gulf, it could also create a window of opportunity. Local governments could
>find themselves able to impose income tax on expatriates without any
>negative economic impact. The structure of double taxation treaties would
>allow levies to be imposed on salaries or packages without any net
>difference to the individual. The tax burden would be the same but
>proportions of it would be redirected to host countries rather than the
>country of origin. The scramble for primary tax rights between governments
>could be frenetic. However, at present, GCC countries have a patchy treaty
>coverage. For example, only Kuwait and Oman have double taxation agreements
>in place with the UK; and Saudi Arabia's only such treaty is with France.
>Any movement to tax expatriates by home governments could trigger a flurry
>of activity on this front as regional authorities seek the flexibility of
>expanded options.
>
>Income taxation has already been examined closely in the Gulf. Riyadh drew
>up plans for the introduction of a 5% base income taxation rate for all
>expatriates, but the Majlis al-Shura rejected the move last year, arguing it
>would be suffocating to business as the costs would be passed back to the
>employers. Such a position could be rapidly altered if the policy amounted
>to little more than redirecting the flow from foreign to domestic
>governments.
>
>The idea already has supporters. The IMF has strongly recommended the
>imposition of a personal income tax system and value added tax among other
>measures including expanding the base of corporate income tax and
>introducing property tax as a means of broadening the revenue base of GCC
>economies that remain heavily dependent on oil exports.
>
>With the UK likely to play the role of catalyst in any regime change, the
>public utterances of Gordon Brown and the strength of the UK's fiscal
>position will be watched closely. That the treasury could expect an
>additional income in the order of £8,000 million ($12,000 million) a year
>from British expatriates around the world, and the political costs to the
>Labour government would appear to be manageable, could yet prove decisive.
>For the GCC, a policy shift in London could trigger an avalanche of OECD
>action that would have a dramatic impact on labour markets. For the
>expatriates and their employers, the threat of income tax-no matter how
>distant-has to be taken seriously.
>
>The table on the next page shows the effects across different income levels.
>


I have this table if anybody wants it. JB
>
JB... I want it. Can u e-mail the table to [email protected]?
Thanks
novita77 is offline  
Old Nov 9th 2004, 9:29 am
  #3  
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Default Re: Expat Tax!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by novita77
JB... I want it. Can u e-mail the table to [email protected]?
Thanks

Done
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Old Nov 9th 2004, 9:33 am
  #4  
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Default Re: Expat Tax!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by Jellybean
Done
Thank you
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Old Nov 9th 2004, 9:56 am
  #5  
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Default Re: Expat Tax!!!!!!!

Can I please have it too
[email protected]

Thanks!!!
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Old Nov 9th 2004, 9:57 am
  #6  
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Default Re: Expat Tax!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by DubaiExpat
Can I please have it too
[email protected]

Thanks!!!

Done
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Old Nov 9th 2004, 10:18 am
  #7  
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Default Re: Expat Tax!!!!!!!

Thank goodness we have our own business. We still own our own businesses in the UK and oh boy do the earnings get sucked up by taxes. Tax officers lurcking around corners and counting customers going in and out to make sure they don't loose out on pennies.

We didn't want to feed some hungry mouths any more who are not willing to contribute to society and prefer to put some effort into a society where it is appreciated and not penalized.

Lets hope the tax issues will not affect people who like to work hard and also deserve some piece of mind.
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Old Nov 9th 2004, 10:20 am
  #8  
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Default Re: Expat Tax!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by Palm Tree
Thank goodness we have our own business. We still own our own businesses in the UK and oh boy do the earnings get sucked up by taxes. Tax officers lurcking around corners and counting customers going in and out to make sure they don't loose out on pennies.

We didn't want to feed some hungry mouths any more who are not willing to contribute to society and prefer to put some effort into a society where it is appreciated and not penalized.

Lets hope the tax issues will not affect people who like to work hard and also deserve some piece of mind.
I know u r in the restaurant business back in the UK? How the tax ppl keep an eye how many costumer in and out ur restaurant? Don't tell me they stay in the front door like a guard dog 24/7???
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Old Nov 9th 2004, 10:36 am
  #9  
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Default Re: Expat Tax!!!!!!!

gordon brown can bugger off ,hes going to have to personaly come and get my tax......... i aint paying it until i get a vote and then hes pooped.....

i was paying 40% income tax why?, 11% national insurance for services i never use?
20% corporation tax,(although thats offset against my 40 %) ,17.5% vat, council tax, tv license fee, car tax,
they can all sod off.
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Old Nov 9th 2004, 10:42 am
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Default Re: Expat Tax!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by shiva
gordon brown can bugger off ,hes going to have to personaly come and get my tax......... i aint paying it until i get a vote and then hes pooped.....

i was paying 40% income tax why?, 11% national insurance for services i never use?
20% corporation tax,(although thats offset against my 40 %) ,17.5% vat, council tax, tv license fee, car tax,
they can all sod off.
Nicely put Shiva - I haven't paid tax since 85 and don't intend startig now!!!
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Old Nov 9th 2004, 10:46 am
  #11  
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Default Re: Expat Tax!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by novita77
I know u r in the restaurant business back in the UK? How the tax ppl keep an eye how many costumer in and out ur restaurant? Don't tell me they stay in the front door like a guard dog 24/7???

Almost, they sit in a car with pen and paper and make ticks but don't bother to remember faces, so as not to count staff, delivery people or friends. Anybody who stays over 20 mintues, is assumed consuming a meal, anyone staying less than that, is having a take-away, even if they walk out empty handed. Bureaucracy! Not real life.
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Old Nov 9th 2004, 10:48 am
  #12  
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Default Re: Expat Tax!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by Palm Tree
Almost, they sit in a car with pen and paper and make ticks but don't bother to remember faces, so as not to count staff, delivery people or friends. Anybody who stays over 20 mintues, is assumed consuming a meal, anyone staying less than that, is having a take-away, even if they walk out empty handed. Bureaucracy! Not real life.


To top it all we are paying their stupid wages!!!
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Old Nov 9th 2004, 10:51 am
  #13  
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Default Re: Expat Tax!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by Truth Speak
Nicely put Shiva - I haven't paid tax since 85 and don't intend startig now!!!
thx ,exactly what and who do this lot think they are....
this is why im leaving and if i ever comeback then it will be to burried.....

christ if any co. used and abused its finances like this goverment then they would not only go belly up but would also be prosecuted for irresbonsible business practise.. thank heaven im leaving...
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Old Nov 9th 2004, 10:52 am
  #14  
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Default Re: Expat Tax!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by shiva
thx ,exactly what and who do this lot think they are....
this is why im leaving and if i ever comeback then it will be to burried.....

christ if any co. used and abused its finances like this goverment then they would not only go belly up but would also be prosecuted for irresbonsible business practise.. thank heaven im leaving...
You leaving, plenty of asylum seekers want to stay there though...
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Old Nov 9th 2004, 10:54 am
  #15  
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Default Re: Expat Tax!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by shiva
thx ,exactly what and who do this lot think they are....
this is why im leaving and if i ever comeback then it will be to burried.....

christ if any co. used and abused its finances like this goverment then they would not only go belly up but would also be prosecuted for irresbonsible business practise.. thank heaven im leaving...
Going back to the thread a few weeks ago - exactly the reason I am now an expat.

Expat's in cyprus pay 25% tax - however the employers give them 2 contracts - a real one and one for the tax man - they usually end up paying 10% or less.

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