lullabelle

Hi all

I've been posting under the "bonkers" thread about coming to Abu Dhabi and the gloves are off regarding financial negotiations.

So far they are offering me (19 years TV experience, BBC trained, current staff job bla bla etc etc) the following to be in charge of a major daytime show.

49.5k dirhams p/m - this is salary, schooling and housing all inclusive
one trip a year
28 days holiday
transport allowance - no figure yet
family medical
relocation covering 40ft trailer and flights

I've worked this out in pounds and while the initial salary seems high, after taking off housing and schooling it comes out at way below what I earn here. The headhunter keeps on about it being tax free but in my opinion the housing costs are like a massive big bleeding tax! I've pointed out to the headhunter that my mortgage costs here are only 40k dirhams per year and the schooling is not only excelent but free (2nd best school in county).

Am I right in thinking this is a pretty cheeky offer? The same job here would command at least that salary, if not more with company car, medical and a much lower cost of living... Plus I wouldn't have to pay for schools, unless the local ones were rubbish, which they're not. They've basically quoted back at me the figure I quoted to them without housing/school/transport.

Grrrr...

Bijilo123

But are you any good at what you do - that is the basis of salary negotiation - not asking strangers like us who don't really care.

lullabelle

If you don't really care why bother answering?

And I wouldn't have bothered asking - but most of the people who CARED enough to respond to my previous thread wanted to know what the package was.

Of course I'm good at what I do. Jeez. You're surely not suggesting that some people who work in the middle east are sloopy seconds?

Bijilo123

Yes I am. I've been there.

Ethos83

I am guessing that he's asking if you are good at what you do, then you have a stronger basis for holding firm and asking for more.

What's the make and break for you regarding the package? Would you accept the package if it was 49.5K AED plus school fees?

I'd tell the company that. Say firmly that you will come out 49.5K AED PLUS school fees. Kindly point out it's not as if you'd be pocketing the school fees as income, and that it would specifically be going to pay for the children's education and don't forget to throw in that the kiddies attend the second best state school in the UK and while you would love the professional opportunity of the job and working in the UAE, you do have little darlings to consider and you need to have comparable schooling for them.

If you are working in Raha, you are well placed for a Marina - Abu Dhabi commute if that's feasible for you. Can be done in just under a hour. Nowadays I'm seeing three bed + maid's flat in JBR going for as low as 125 K a year, and three bed villas in the Springs for 135K aed. There are more schools in Dubai so you will find a place somewhere.

Will your husband be able to work out here? He may be a civil servant (correct?) but he can probably, with some persistence, find some type of white collar position if he's persistent and flexible and is willing to spend as long as six months or so hunting.

Last but not least: is this job a professional advancement above your current position? Will you be able to take several years of this position and parlay it into something better (and at higher compensation) back in the UK? That may be something worth considering.

Millhouse

If only they were that good.

you need to get to a package that works for you. Sadly the streets are now paved with dust and not gold.

Roadking

Hey Lulabelle, guess the answer to your question is your last line; Grrrr. If you are not happy with the offer; don't come. It's gotta work for you, emotionally and financially.

There are a lot of yah-sayers and nay-sayers but at the end of the day it's what works for you. If you don't make money...you spend it. Simply; come if you earn more and can support the lifestyle you have. Don't if you can't. And negotiate HARD!

lullabelle

That last comment summed it up.

For me, the bugger is the housing: what's offered is a good salary if you had your usual Brit mortgage to cover. But factor in the ridiculous rents (a ******* mansion near me would cost 125000aed p/a, WITH a swimming pool and giant, fabulous garden) and school fees... It's not so hot. I don't live in a massive house but I don't see why I should uproot my family and live in something smaller/less well placed etc.

After all, I'm already going to have to give up wine on tap (virtually)...

I'll calculate how it could work out with added school fees... That's a good idea.

Robbies

How does the offer compare to your NET UK salary (take off tax, NI, pension etc - basically, the amount that goes into your bank each month)?

Ok, schools are an addition to what you have in UK, however you need to pay housing in UK so removing that from the UAE offer to compare salaries is not apples v apples. Yes, housing can be more here.

How about take net UK monthly income, remove mortgage/rent costs then compare to the UAE salary (minus the schooling and housing elements). May give you a better idea.

admon

I don't think it is a case of working out what you can afford to accept.

I assume that you have a good settled position in the UK, that is relatively safe.

You are about to uproot for the sake of a 2 year contract. Therefore, it has to be extremely beneficial to entice you into doing so. Merely 'matching your current status' isn't the issue, as if the wind changes direction in 3 months time, you could well find yourself out on your ear (as many have came to the UAE and found out to their expense).

If you are THE person they want, then you need to be leading the negotiation and telling them what you want to come. If they can't offer that, then c'est la vie.

My personal recommendation is that you accept a minimum of 50% more that your current nett salary, then add the housing, schooling, transport and everything else. Then add another 10-20% to the total before you reach your final salary.

Times may have changed here, but there are still plenty of people I know on well over 80k a month. If you are needed, then they will pay.

Don't short change yourself, only to come to work in Abu Dhabi and find out that people working under you are earning more than you, purely because they wouldn't accept a derisory first offer.

Final word - whatever you negotiate, get your employer to pay all the accommodation and schooling allowance in full up front for the year, with no payback to them should they let you go. Good luck.

PS You can buy wine here by the case or the truckload, so don't worry on that one.

The Dean

Lullabelle,

Firstly, tell the pimp... er, sorry, head hunter that he's a prat - if "but it's tax free" is the best he can do, he clearly just wants the commission and to hell with your own welfare. Has he even tried to negotiate your package upwards with the employer?

A question: you may be very good at what you do, but how many others of equal ability/experience are being interviewed? Or even are willing to relocate in the current environment? I suspect you are number one on a list of one - push as hard as you can.

Never change jobs for less than a fifty percent increase in basic remuneration (unless circumstances dictate that you must, of course, which isn't the case here). The tax free element should be a bonus, not a means of substitution.

And I'm suspicious of the "49,500" figure - why not 50,000? I they have to penny-pinch that much, it doesn't augur well for future raises, etc.

Finally, a line that has worked well for me in the past. Tell the employer (not the pimp) that, if that is the correct and appropriate salary for the job, then you don't want it - because it reflects little authority to act without supervision, and without seeking approvals, etc. You feel you'd have to ask a boss's permission to do things that your experience tells you that you should be able to go ahead and do anyway.

Good luck, but as things stand - say no.

Meow

That 'tax-free' argument is a total crock, as it isn't necessarily the case for everyone for all the time they are out of the UK...

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busybee2

the salary is quite good, but then this place is very expensive, at least you seem to have figured that out, yes the tax free income goes on the basic things such as housing. if you are in very good school, then i would stay put, you will not get into the best schools here as you have missed the boat, applications went in beg of year, and they have been allocated and are full with big waiting lists, for a brit curriculum you would need to look at bisad, which is new, but sounds good in the lower years, but school fees are not cheap. wine you can get here no probs.

soukie

Here we go again - same old story from the recruiters who are on commision. Don't be fooled by the old "tax free" tale. Good job that you are doing your research and won't be taken in by the salary as many others do. I would negotiate for a better deal and go for a basic salary plus accomodation and school fees. Let the employer take the risk for the housing as you never know what happens here - you can be here one minute and gone the next with 30 days notice and it really is like this. There are a lot of underqualified or unqualified people out here who have the gift of the gab and are on much better deals than they would be at home - don't sell yourself short as there are other Countries to go to. Do some research on BISAD as I have heard that there have been lots of staff changes and know that some parents are not happy.

klaus3974

I second everyone here. Do not be fooled by the tax free salary. Life is very expensive here, specially if you already had a good standard of living back home. Rents and schools are a killer so do negotiate very hard and have everything in written (and wish they do not change their minds half way during the contract). Do not count on anything called bonus cause often it does not materialize. My medical insurance that was supposed to be first rate does not cover any of the vaccination of my baby and many other procedures that they were supposed to cover according to their policy. And many other stories like that. This is (at most) a developing countries and the rule of law is not applied the same way than back home.
If I knew all this, I still would have come. We like our life here and traveling to many places around. The only thing is that I would have negotiated my salary in a different way.
Good luck!