Refusing to give a DNA sample.
Dec 2nd 2008, 4:16 am
#47
WTF?
Joined: Aug 2003
Location: Homeostasis
Posts: 79,444
Re: Refusing to give a DNA sample.
Are you asking me this in a legal sense or in a moral sense?
If you leave a soda can out in public then, yes, "legally" they can test it for your DNA. Morally, I believe it is an invasion of privacy even though it is technically legal. The point that I'm trying to make is that if they have enough evidence to dig that deeply around in your personal business (and I think your DNA is pretty personal business) then why don't they have a warrant?
If you leave a soda can out in public then, yes, "legally" they can test it for your DNA. Morally, I believe it is an invasion of privacy even though it is technically legal. The point that I'm trying to make is that if they have enough evidence to dig that deeply around in your personal business (and I think your DNA is pretty personal business) then why don't they have a warrant?
Dec 2nd 2008, 4:26 am
#48
Professional Drama Queen
Joined: Dec 2007
Location: West Virginia
Posts: 1,061
Re: Refusing to give a DNA sample.
There was a time ... way , way back in my younger and more naive days.... when I used to subscribe to the view that if you had done nothing wrong then you had nothing to worry about if being questioned by the police. 
Since that time I like to think I'm a lot more wiser. I would NEVER, EVER agree to being questioned now without legal representation and anyone that does is quite simply a fool. The agenda for the police is quite clear - they are questioning you because they think you:
a ) are guilty
b ) have knowledge of the 'crime'
c ) are associated with the 'guilty' party / parties
Hardly the level playing field implied by the polite request for you to 'just answer a few questions' as anyone who has ever been subject to police questioning will tell you. My own sister found herself in such a position a good few years back. Her house was raided at 6am ( she was a single mum with 3 kids) on a 'tip off' about check card fraud. It was a totally untrue accusation by the way. Her house was 'searched' ( read wrecked) by police officers who scared the life out of her kids, as you can imagine. I was contacted to come and get the kids while she accompanied them for 'to help with their inquiries' - we were both pretty dumb about our 'rights', and faced with so much 'authority' she agreed to go. Needless to say she was held ( without charge) for hours upon hours. She didn't think she needed a solicitor because she was totally innocent and had nothing to hide. I was given the royal run around when I tried to find out which actual police station she was being held in - took me ages to find out where she was. They finally let her go later that day by which time she was a total wreck, with not so much as an apology. Never again would she make the mistake in thinking that being innocent of any crime would be protection enough. During the questioning she was asked questions about not just the supposed 'crime' but also about all aspects of her personal life, friends family, finances etc. They threw names at her of people she didn't even know. By the time she realised she was out of her depth she was too scared to ask for a solicitor because she thought this would make it look like she had something to hide, which she didn't. She told me it was probably the most scariest things she had ever experienced. She felt so totally helpless and all she wanted to do was to get the hell outta there but she didn't know if she could leave. She was terrified especially being a single parent (something that the police referred to numerous times) about what was happening with her kids
For most people, being caught up in such a situation (especially if you have had no dealings with the police) you do naively believe that if you have done nothing wrong you don't need representation. Those rights are there to protect the INNOCENT and believe me we need every single one of them!
Since that time I like to think I'm a lot more wiser. I would NEVER, EVER agree to being questioned now without legal representation and anyone that does is quite simply a fool. The agenda for the police is quite clear - they are questioning you because they think you:a ) are guilty
b ) have knowledge of the 'crime'
c ) are associated with the 'guilty' party / parties
Hardly the level playing field implied by the polite request for you to 'just answer a few questions' as anyone who has ever been subject to police questioning will tell you. My own sister found herself in such a position a good few years back. Her house was raided at 6am ( she was a single mum with 3 kids) on a 'tip off' about check card fraud. It was a totally untrue accusation by the way. Her house was 'searched' ( read wrecked) by police officers who scared the life out of her kids, as you can imagine. I was contacted to come and get the kids while she accompanied them for 'to help with their inquiries' - we were both pretty dumb about our 'rights', and faced with so much 'authority' she agreed to go. Needless to say she was held ( without charge) for hours upon hours. She didn't think she needed a solicitor because she was totally innocent and had nothing to hide. I was given the royal run around when I tried to find out which actual police station she was being held in - took me ages to find out where she was. They finally let her go later that day by which time she was a total wreck, with not so much as an apology. Never again would she make the mistake in thinking that being innocent of any crime would be protection enough. During the questioning she was asked questions about not just the supposed 'crime' but also about all aspects of her personal life, friends family, finances etc. They threw names at her of people she didn't even know. By the time she realised she was out of her depth she was too scared to ask for a solicitor because she thought this would make it look like she had something to hide, which she didn't. She told me it was probably the most scariest things she had ever experienced. She felt so totally helpless and all she wanted to do was to get the hell outta there but she didn't know if she could leave. She was terrified especially being a single parent (something that the police referred to numerous times) about what was happening with her kids
For most people, being caught up in such a situation (especially if you have had no dealings with the police) you do naively believe that if you have done nothing wrong you don't need representation. Those rights are there to protect the INNOCENT and believe me we need every single one of them!
Dec 2nd 2008, 4:33 am
#49
Not dead yet
Joined: Apr 2004
Location: In a world of my own where I know everyone
Posts: 15,042
Re: Refusing to give a DNA sample.
Dec 2nd 2008, 4:39 am
#51
Not dead yet
Joined: Apr 2004
Location: In a world of my own where I know everyone
Posts: 15,042
Re: Refusing to give a DNA sample.
There was a time ... way , way back in my younger and more naive days.... when I used to subscribe to the view that if you had done nothing wrong then you had nothing to worry about if being questioned by the police. Since that time I like to think I'm a lot more wiser. I would NEVER, EVER agree to being questioned now without legal representation and anyone that does is quite simply a fool. The agenda for the police is quite clear - they are questioning you because they think you:
a ) are guilty
b ) have knowledge of the 'crime'
c ) are associated with the 'guilty' party / parties
Hardly the level playing field implied by the polite request for you to 'just answer a few questions' as anyone who has ever been subject to police questioning will tell you. My own sister found herself in such a position a good few years back. Her house was raided at 6am ( she was a single mum with 3 kids) on a 'tip off' about check card fraud. It was a totally untrue accusation by the way. Her house was 'searched' ( read wrecked) by police officers who scared the life out of her kids, as you can imagine. I was contacted to come and get the kids while she accompanied them for 'to help with their inquiries' - we were both pretty dumb about our 'rights', and faced with so much 'authority' she agreed to go. Needless to say she was held ( without charge) for hours upon hours. She didn't think she needed a solicitor because she was totally innocent and had nothing to hide. I was given the royal run around when I tried to find out which actual police station she was being held in - took me ages to find out where she was. They finally let her go later that day by which time she was a total wreck, with not so much as an apology. Never again would she make the mistake in thinking that being innocent of any crime would be protection enough. During the questioning she was asked questions about not just the supposed 'crime' but also about all aspects of her personal life, friends family, finances etc. They threw names at her of people she didn't even know. By the time she realised she was out of her depth she was too scared to ask for a solicitor because she thought this would make it look like she had something to hide, which she didn't. She told me it was probably the most scariest things she had ever experienced. She felt so totally helpless and all she wanted to do was to get the hell outta there but she didn't know if she could leave. She was terrified especially being a single parent (something that the police referred to numerous times) about what was happening with her kids
For most people, being caught up in such a situation (especially if you have had no dealings with the police) you do naively believe that if you have done nothing wrong you don't need representation. Those rights are there to protect the INNOCENT and believe me we need every single one of them!
Since that time I like to think I'm a lot more wiser. I would NEVER, EVER agree to being questioned now without legal representation and anyone that does is quite simply a fool. The agenda for the police is quite clear - they are questioning you because they think you:a ) are guilty
b ) have knowledge of the 'crime'
c ) are associated with the 'guilty' party / parties
Hardly the level playing field implied by the polite request for you to 'just answer a few questions' as anyone who has ever been subject to police questioning will tell you. My own sister found herself in such a position a good few years back. Her house was raided at 6am ( she was a single mum with 3 kids) on a 'tip off' about check card fraud. It was a totally untrue accusation by the way. Her house was 'searched' ( read wrecked) by police officers who scared the life out of her kids, as you can imagine. I was contacted to come and get the kids while she accompanied them for 'to help with their inquiries' - we were both pretty dumb about our 'rights', and faced with so much 'authority' she agreed to go. Needless to say she was held ( without charge) for hours upon hours. She didn't think she needed a solicitor because she was totally innocent and had nothing to hide. I was given the royal run around when I tried to find out which actual police station she was being held in - took me ages to find out where she was. They finally let her go later that day by which time she was a total wreck, with not so much as an apology. Never again would she make the mistake in thinking that being innocent of any crime would be protection enough. During the questioning she was asked questions about not just the supposed 'crime' but also about all aspects of her personal life, friends family, finances etc. They threw names at her of people she didn't even know. By the time she realised she was out of her depth she was too scared to ask for a solicitor because she thought this would make it look like she had something to hide, which she didn't. She told me it was probably the most scariest things she had ever experienced. She felt so totally helpless and all she wanted to do was to get the hell outta there but she didn't know if she could leave. She was terrified especially being a single parent (something that the police referred to numerous times) about what was happening with her kids
For most people, being caught up in such a situation (especially if you have had no dealings with the police) you do naively believe that if you have done nothing wrong you don't need representation. Those rights are there to protect the INNOCENT and believe me we need every single one of them!
Dec 2nd 2008, 4:40 am
#52
Not dead yet
Joined: Apr 2004
Location: In a world of my own where I know everyone
Posts: 15,042
Dec 2nd 2008, 4:43 am
#54
Not dead yet
Joined: Apr 2004
Location: In a world of my own where I know everyone
Posts: 15,042
Dec 2nd 2008, 4:45 am
#55
Nuts and Bolts
Joined: Sep 2006
Location: Palm Tree in the Snow
Posts: 2,116
Re: Refusing to give a DNA sample.
In the US if you refuse to give DNA then that should just be the end of it. It doesn't really work that way though. They will (1) get a warrant for your DNA or (2) find some other tricky sneaky clever way to get it.
This is my most recent favorite tricky sneaky clever way:
"After identifying him as a potential suspect, police conducted surveillance on Biela, who worked as a pipe fitter. Police interviewed him and asked whether he would submit a DNA sample, but he refused, they said.
Detectives then spoke with Biela's girlfriend, who allowed police to take a DNA sample from their 4-year-old son, Poehlman said.
Police said that sample matched the boy's father to DNA evidence found both at the scene where Denison's body was found and on a rear door of the student apartment from which she was abducted."
http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/11/26/...est/index.html
If the police ask for your DNA should you cooperate? Hell no - specially if you're guilty.
But, if they really really want to, they will very likely be able to get a hold of it eventually.
This is my most recent favorite tricky sneaky clever way:
"After identifying him as a potential suspect, police conducted surveillance on Biela, who worked as a pipe fitter. Police interviewed him and asked whether he would submit a DNA sample, but he refused, they said.
Detectives then spoke with Biela's girlfriend, who allowed police to take a DNA sample from their 4-year-old son, Poehlman said.
Police said that sample matched the boy's father to DNA evidence found both at the scene where Denison's body was found and on a rear door of the student apartment from which she was abducted."
http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/11/26/...est/index.html
If the police ask for your DNA should you cooperate? Hell no - specially if you're guilty.
But, if they really really want to, they will very likely be able to get a hold of it eventually.
Dec 2nd 2008, 4:51 am
#56
Peace onion
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2006
Location: Denver
Posts: 5,686
Re: Refusing to give a DNA sample.
Yeah, that's to be expected. But I would fight like hell before hand. Then, following the event, I would let things calm down, and then, when they least expect, I would execute all those involved with a sharp stick. Or an icicle.
Men, women, children, goats. No-one would be spared.
And I jest not.
Men, women, children, goats. No-one would be spared.
And I jest not.
Dec 2nd 2008, 4:55 am
#57
Sursum corda
Joined: Sep 2002
Location: Richmond Hill, GA USA
Posts: 38,860
Re: Refusing to give a DNA sample.
Yeah, that's to be expected. But I would fight like hell before hand. Then, following the event, I would let things calm down, and then, when they least expect, I would execute all those involved with a sharp stick. Or an icicle.
Men, women, children, goats. No-one would be spared.
And I jest not.
Men, women, children, goats. No-one would be spared.
And I jest not.
Dec 2nd 2008, 4:56 am
#58
Septicity
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 23,762
Re: Refusing to give a DNA sample.
I personally would have been delighted to have that bastard tied down whilst I cut off his balls to hand over his DNA to the cops. My daughter attends that Uni, and Briana's body was dumped in the field right next to my daughter's apartment. Her friend lived 3 houses down from where Briana was abducted. This past year has been a scary time for us all, not to mention the hell the girls have been going through that lived in that house. I was on the phone with my daughter every evening she had night classes. Just making sure these girls were in groups on campus until they drive away was challenging but needed to be done. Not even safe to walk in a car park! I really don't care how they get this evidence, just remove scum like this off the planet.
Dec 2nd 2008, 4:57 am
#59
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 68,280
Re: Refusing to give a DNA sample.
Yeah, that's to be expected. But I would fight like hell before hand. Then, following the event, I would let things calm down, and then, when they least expect, I would execute all those involved with a sharp stick. Or an icicle.
Men, women, children, goats. No-one would be spared.
And I jest not.
Men, women, children, goats. No-one would be spared.
And I jest not.
Dec 2nd 2008, 5:01 am
#60
Professional Drama Queen
Joined: Dec 2007
Location: West Virginia
Posts: 1,061
Re: Refusing to give a DNA sample.
True enough. Thing is most people who are innocent / never had a brush with the law don't know their rights so will meet with police 'requests' . The career criminal on the other hand KNOWS their rights (having been round the block a few times) and you can bet your life if they are picked up they will quote them chapter and verse. Nothing wrong with that EVERYONE should be afforded the same protection re: civil rights just that invariably it's the innocent that get the shitty end of the stick . I'm all in favour of including civil rights on the school curriculum so that everyone is educated on them. Would certainly go a long way in making the populace a lot less compliant and vulnerable to the abuses that occur. Can't see that happening though.
