lairdside

Yup - thanks Leslie, that was the reason I mentioned them. Not as a sponsor!

I've seen students here get disproportionately large loans based on their student status and hence future earning potential to cover the cost of fees, living expenses etc whilst they are studying. (A year's tuition alone can cost 25/35k).

The suggestion above to take full time employment to fulfil the requirements at the time of filing, with a more permanent solution (after the foreign spouse receives their EAD) seems like the best one though, if it is indeed viable.

Perhaps she could even take a "year out" if needs be?

Dekka's Angel

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jella
<snip>I can understand the Consulate's reluctance to get involved, but seriously, they're supposed to assist citizens in their time of need, in emergencies, as well as when dealing with immigration issues. The Finnish Consulate apparently do not share this ideology.<snip>

Please don't take this the wrong way but this isn't an emergency or "time of need" for a traveling Finnish citizen from the consulate's perspective. This is a decision to immigrate to a new country without being financially ready to do so, compounded by a dubious exercise of its discretion by the State Department in a manner that in no way binds BCIS (a different agency), the agency that has the ultimate say-so on whether you get to stay here.

Think of what you're asking. You're asking your country's consulate to get the US to to excuse a clear inability on the part of your wife to support you even though you knew (or should have known) she like everyone else had to demonstate this as a condition of getting leave to bring you here. Expecting the Finnish consulate to utilize its diplomatic relationship with the US to excuse away your 2/3 shortfall in income on an absolutely required affidavit of support, or make up for it somehow, is asking a hell of a lot from your government, I think. Maybe if it were a close call, you'd have more cause to call the consulate unhelpful. But it clearly is not.

I think you could make a strong argument (although not guaranteed a winning argument) that it is income if it's doled out over the year in regularly-spaced pieces like most non-emergency student loans for living expenses are. The I-864 does not ask you about your liabilities. On the other hand, she will need to prove up the source of the income, and the source might raise a question in the AOS' interviewer's mind about what is going on. But if your AOS interview is 6 months out, your income after getting your EAD will count as well.

What do you think hiring a fee-for-service attorney will do for you that Legal Aid couldn't? (There is a difference, btw, between "not even considering" giving help to someone and saying "we can't help you" because the law doesn't allow the type of help the client wants). I suspect Legal Aid wouldn't help because it made a determination that there was nothing the law could do for you. Just because an immigration lawyer from Legal Aid is free doesn't mean he or she is incompetent. And, unlike a fee for service lawyer (some of who play it straight with their clients, others who just take the fees knowing full well they are likely wasted), Legal Aid is immune from the temptation to do work that has a zero or de minimis likelihood of success. Indeed, a lawyer from Legal Aid is the most likely to play it straight with you, so that you can evaluate your non-legal options as quickly as possible.

I say that as a private fee-for service (well, sort of) attorney myself, BTW. One who used to run a legal-aid office.

Here is some free, only somewhat immigration-related advice: "Don't cut off your nose to spite your face".

I realize that your pride is (rightfully) deeply wounded over your familial situation, but the fact that her parents are still trying to be in your lives -- driving an hour and half is a big deal -- suggests that they are not as hard and fast against you and your marriage as you claim. More importantly for this purpose, them getting to know you and see you as a person might lead ultimately to them agreeing to help you out. It's something for you to think about, next time you refuse your in-laws lunch offers regardless of how hurt you are.

It seems to me you and your wife are going to have to make some hard decisions. Starting with facing the reality that the status quo can't remain so. (And, in your case, maybe taking that chip off your shoulder that always concludes that nobody --- the consulate, Legal Aid, your in-laws -- cares just because they don't or can't give you the "help" you somehow think should be forthcoming to fix a problem you guys created yourselves.)

The least complicated option is for your wife to find a job that pays enough for her to sponsor you on the I-864. She probably will have to stop out of school for a semester or two and get a full-time job. But if she does that, as soon as she has that job you guys can submit your AOS paperwork including a qualifying I-864. And as soon as you get your EAD (which you can't apply for until you submit your AOS paperwork) you can take over and she can go right back to school and part-time work if your job pays enough. You guys are going to have to decide which priority is more important right now -- you remaining here without having to go back to Finland at all, or her remaining uninterrupted in school.

There is of course you going home without her, working there to build up a sufficient nest egg (around $50,000 US for the two of you if she's still making $400/month) or, alternatively, until she finishes school, gets a full time job and sponsors you based on her income. This is a yucky option, but it is an option.

The last one is for both of you to pack your bags and move to Finland until you both have it together financially. She can attend school there, can't she? At least you guys would be together, and that's the most important thing, right?

Jella

I did not ask them to help excuse me from anything. I asked them to help me with the legalese that is difficult for me to understand, especially when one call to the BCIS tells me they don't even NEED an affidavit of support when FILING for AOS, and the second call saying they do.

They did not determine whether they could help. They determined that they didn't want to try. They said very clearly, that since I was not a US Citizen, and this was an immigration issue, they would not be able to help me in any way. They recommended I turn to private law practices. So much for their determination.

I didn't tell them to bugger off. My wife told them she wasn't feeling well, and they left. I wasn't hungry, so I had no interest in going out anyway. I've never told them what I really think of them, nor do I intend to. It isn't worth the time.

I've to take issue with that. First of all, English is not my native language. I can read it just fine, I can write it well enough to get by, but speaking to the yanks at BCIS over the phone, I can't understand a word they're saying. When we applied for K1, the Consul told me I did not need an affidavit of support, after I told him about my work experience and plans in the States. He was confident in our ability to make it, and he said so, explicitly. Not at any point did I know that I would have to provide them with it AGAIN, after we were already married, and then AGAIN for the AOS interview. Most people that I've spoken to still think that all you need to do is marry a Citizen and you are set. I do not use that as my defense as I did not think so, but I do not feel that we went out of our way to create this situation for ourselves. No one plotted against us, I know that, but it was not mere stupidity either that was at play here. You may be all-knowing when it comes to the BCIS legalese, but for me it was hard enough to try and understand it all, while getting rid of my apartment, selling my stuff, and moving here with nothing but one handbag and two suitcases.

She would do that, if she could find a job that did not require any previous work experience, any degrees, in a town of 40,000 people, which pays at least 8 dollars an hour and you get 40 hrs a week. That's not Taco Bell, so any suggestions are welcome.

Right on the latter, wrong on the former. She wouldn't be able to continue her studies in Finland. Not only does Finland NOT provide any veterinary education (which is what she is studying) in English, she does not speak Finnish. That said, she would not be able to find a job either, for the forementioned reason, as well as the fact that of the 5 million people living in Finland, 1,5 million are of working age and health, and of those 250,000 are unemployed. Doesn't matter how you roll the numbers, that'd be the death of her education.

I am thankful that you spend the time that you did replying to my posts. However, suggesting that I am somehow intellectually lacking does not help my cause. It only makes the already difficult situation increasingly difficult to stand.

Dekka's Angel

Umm. At no point did I mention, or discuss, your intellect or whether it was lacking. I made my comments about your situation and what to me looks like both the wrong attitude about, and too narrow a strategy for, solving the problem.

I recommend sending your wife back to Legal Aid to do the talking, since it is her problem as much as yours, and she *is* a USC. While you say their interest in your case turned on being an immigrant, I have a very hard time believing that a legal aid office in Texas would take such a position given the unbelievable number of both legal and illegal immigrants living in the region (unless the office doesn't do immigration work at all, in which case it doesn't matter that you're not a USC). But if you say it happened, it happened. There are other legal non-profits in the San Antonio area, who also work with immigrants for free. I assume you're checking those out.

On the work situation, if she's going to one of the 23 veterinary colleges in the US, she already has a college degree and therefre has no reason she has to work at Taco Bell. If on the other hand, she's in a pre-vet program at an undergraduate school, that is different and makes more sense to me. But either way, if you spend time reviewing old posts on the NG you will see people working *2* jobs to qualify under the affidavit. Your wife having a single job to accomplish that may be ideal, but if she can't find one job to do the job then 2 would work, at least until your paperwork is on file.

It all depends on how motivated you guys are to solving the problem on your own, if there truly is no one out there that can provide assistance.

P.S. Why isn't your wife helping you with all this legwork, if not taking the primary responsibility for it? She is the USC, and especially since you say you have real difficulties with English sometimes, it makes sense to have her be the point person instead of you. Again, just my opinion.

ScottHenshaw

Just my two cents worth, nothing more. I am not a lawyer nor attorney, but I am a hard worker. I work very hard to have the things in life that I do and when I see situations like this, I have to ask myself, "Why in the Hell arn't these people working"?

I understand that the USC is a student, and more power to you... But for there can be no doubt that you need set your priorities. $400 is not enough to live on, yet alone start a family with.

With the non-USC, get a job! Even if you have to do something under the table or mowing lawns, step up to bat - 90 days - no excuse!

I believe that you get out of life what you put in. If you choose to remain jobless, then you can expect nothing. If I were an immigration officer, (I am not), I would ask myself, "Hmmm... 90 Days and they have not done anything to help themselves, why should I"?

I really have no idea what will happen. I do know that you have both made a choice, a choice not to work. If you fail to meet the requirements for OAS then it's on your own hands.... But then, I am sure that I will hear the boooo hhhooooo, "it's not our fault. No jobs available, it's the worlds fault, we are just victims"..... Typical


Scott

Jella

Thanks for your helpful advice. Really, that is what I came here for.

I spoke to a US Citizen who has a friend in prison now because he took a job before he received his work permit. And when he gets out, he'll be deported. It may surprise you, but I did not want this to become my fate as well.

I, for one, am surprised that you would actually use this forum to suggest to an alien without a work permit to work illegally, in other words commit a crime.

I'm glad you have a job, and you work hard. That is great. Keep up the good work. Is that what makes you God? Some of us have to get a permit first. Imagine that.

ScottHenshaw

Never said that I was a God and was just trying to point at the fact that from what you say that you are just lazy. You were probably lazy before, (Hence no savings) and you are now just making excuses for making your poor wife pull the load. I am not a God, no doubt about it.... I however, can claim to be a man and need not make exuses... You asked for advice and I gave it. Here it is again: get a job doing something to put food on the table and show immigration that after you get an AOS that you are not going to be a public charge... For God sakes, you live in Texas you should know this.... I suppose you can think about all this on your way back home....

Scott

Jella

Again, dimwit -- you want to break the law and get a job illegally, so that I can go to the immigration official and say, hey, I never got a work permit, but I found a job anyway, see! I'm pulling my load!

You're a load of something yourself, I might add. Don't waste time trying to profile me since you don't have anywhere near all the facts. I HAVE no savings because I was in and out of hospital for last five hours, on constant medication, and spent most of my time cutting myself with a razor. The fact that I've managed to pull my life together this much as it is, is something I am proud of. Your bullshit and wise cracks I can do without. Go help someone else.

Jella

Not hours. Years.

Mrtravel

Jella wrote:
    > Thanks for your helpful advice. Really, that is what I came here for.
    >
    > I spoke to a US Citizen who has a friend in prison now because he took
    > a job before he received his work permit. And when he gets out, he'll
    > be deported. It may surprise you, but I did not want this to become my
    > fate as well.

I seriously doubt that is the only reason he is in prison


    >
    > I, for one, am surprised that you would actually use this forum to
    > suggest to an alien without a work permit to work illegally, in other
    > words commit a crime.

Many people do it. Illegal work is generally forgiven, but there might
be problems if you faked the legal ability to work.

ScottHenshaw

In using the word, "Dimwit", you might want to take a look at who is in what situation. Something else to think about on the trip home...

Scott

Mrs. B

I am not a lawyer, these are my personal observations only:

I don't see why you cannot simply file for your AOS with the income she currently has, then bring an updated affidavit when you are called to the interview. Given the long wait times for interviews, you should have plenty of time after filing to get your EAD, SSN, and a good job in order to fulfil the affidavit.
To meet the minimum requirement for your family of 2, you would only need to secure a full time job at 8 bucks an hour so even the crappiest job would do, and by doing it that way you are working legally.
Even as the alien you CAN use your own income to fulfil the requirements as long as you and your spouse have lived together at least 6 months at interview time.

When my husband and I filed, (I am the alien) he had just been laid off, and we went ahead and filed the affidavit with only his unemployment insurance income as support, for a family of 4. It was obviously not enough to qualify. We got an unusually fast interview date (within 3 months) but during that time, I got my EAD and SSN and secured a job that pays enough to cover the 125% requirement of the affidavit. The INS officer accepted my income without question and we walked out of the interview with my passport stamped with approval.

Joe

Get a job for crying out loud! If you don't your ass would be out of
here anyways due to your inability to meet the 125% of poverty
criteria. Just don't forge any documents or use fake work documents.
BCIS forgives unauthorized employment when your spouse is a USC
PROVIDED you didn't use forged documents, and entered the country
legally.

Lok at me, I been working unauthorized for over 3 years and do you see
me losing sleep????




mrtravel wrote in message news:...
    > Jella wrote:
    > > Thanks for your helpful advice. Really, that is what I came here for.
    > >
    > > I spoke to a US Citizen who has a friend in prison now because he took
    > > a job before he received his work permit. And when he gets out, he'll
    > > be deported. It may surprise you, but I did not want this to become my
    > > fate as well.
    >
    > I seriously doubt that is the only reason he is in prison
    >
    >
    > >
    > > I, for one, am surprised that you would actually use this forum to
    > > suggest to an alien without a work permit to work illegally, in other
    > > words commit a crime.
    >
    > Many people do it. Illegal work is generally forgiven, but there might
    > be problems if you faked the legal ability to work.

melanieberns

I may repeat what other people have said to you in the past because I only know your current thread however...

Jella,
I'm certain that I do not understand the many particulars of your situation but I may be able to help you.
First, I want to say that I agree with the "San Bernardino filer" on almost all points. Second, I think I have somewhat of a similar problem. I am the US citizen applying for a fiance visa and I am a jobless, graduating student (late summer 2003). Luckily, I have enough assests to file the Affidavit of Support however it is very, very tight. And, my assests may dip bellow the cut off when filing for the removal of my fiance's conditional status after we marry.
I had a free consultation with a lawyer (there are many excellent immigration lawyers in my area (los angeles), offering a free consultation-even phone consultations--if you are interested but hesitant because you have to admit your financial situation to a lawyer when you ask your questions, maybe you can contrive a lie of some sort. For example, you could say that her parents won't sponser you (maybe b/c they fear that if you are sued for any reason, they will be responsible, and they are unwilling to do it) but that they have offered to pay for an immigration lawyer, if they provide a decent consultation, for the second phase of the process (AOS filing). Or, in my area, there are free, walk in clinics. They offer immigration advice a few days a week. I've found them through the internet and maybe a big city near you offers them as well. Have you looked already?)
Anyway, back to my main point, the lawyer recommended that I send the paperwork in as soon as possible after we marry or definately before the 90 days expires, even if I can't claim to have adequate funds. She claimed that the BCIS will still give me an interview anyway. She also said that when the interview comes around (6 months up to 2 years sometimes in LA) that we should have enough time to both find jobs that add up to 125% of the poverty limit (normally, approx. $15,150 a year, or $1,262.50 a month, or $315 a week--but for me less b/c of my assets). She claims, that I would be able to bring a new Affidavit to the interview with both our incomes combined (supposedly, after you marry you can use both your salaries to file). She said, when I send in the paperwork, to include a letter explaining the situation, that we are both well-educated, that I am a current student, and that we are unlikely to become a financial burden for the government.
I don't know if she's right, but I thought the advice could help you.
How much longer is she in vet schoool? Can she and is she willing to take a semester or year off of school to jointly work with you to provide sufficient income? It's seemingly crazy but can you possibly move to an area with better employment opportunities?
If it's not possible, I have heared of people overstaying the time limit and then applying---but not without a good lawyers help.
In the end, if going back to Finland is what you think would be best until she finishes school and gets a job, I can only imagine that you would need to write a letter saying you are withdrawing your application with explanation, ask them directly what to do, and then reapply later for an I-130. That's just my opinion though.
this process is so confusing and fragile, i wish you the best of luck finding a solution.
random job idea to research: in california, becoming a substitute teacher is easy and pays well. Here, if you have a degree, all you have to do is take a standardized test (which you could study and register for now) and apply to school districts in your area. i wonder what it's like in texas (your in texas, right?) i don't think there should be an international hindrance...but you never know...just a thought.
again, I'm so sorry you are going through this.

Mrs. B

this is what I posted earlier, and is how my hubby and I qualified income-wise.

just send your paperwork in now, get your EAD then a job, and give them a new affidavit of support at interview time.