Chuck

Okay ladies and gentlemen,

I am hoping someone can shed some light on my questions. Just FYI I
have reviewed the past posts in this newsgroup and the FAQ, I am just
hoping for some more up to date info especially in light of the recent
changes in the INS procedures.

In October of 2002, I my fiancee and I applied for her K-1 visa. At
that time I was informed by the INS that it would take 4-6 months for
processing. Of course as time passed the processing time continued to
increase. As of yesterday I was informed that the visa process would
not be completed until July and that it could only be approved IF
there were still enough visas!

Needless to say I am extremely frustrated. After reviewing some of
the posts in this group, I am of the opinion that our best option at
this point is for her to travel to the U.S. on a tourist visa and for
us to get married here and then apply for her visa. I actually spoke
to someone with the INS who said that this would be perfectly fine and
then she proceeded to give me exact details of how to go about it.
There was no mention of the 30/60 day "rule" and I was also wondering
that if we were married within a week after she arrives if this would
create any problems. On one hand if she arrives with a long stay (3
month) ticket, this might create difficulties when she tries to enter
the country. On the other hand if she arrives with less than a one
month return ticket, then we have to get married quickly.

Does anyone have any opinions or suggestions?

Any input would be greatly appreciated. For those of you who believe
that if you try to circumvent the "proper" procedures, I can
understand how you feel but the K-1 process seems to be neverending at
this point. 10 months to process a K-1 seems crazy.

Thanks

ExpatMedic

Steggy

Chuck wrote:
    >
    > Okay ladies and gentlemen,
    >
    > I am hoping someone can shed some light on my questions. Just FYI I
    > have reviewed the past posts in this newsgroup and the FAQ, I am just
    > hoping for some more up to date info especially in light of the recent
    > changes in the INS procedures.
    >
    > In October of 2002, I my fiancee and I applied for her K-1 visa. At
    > that time I was informed by the INS that it would take 4-6 months for
    > processing. Of course as time passed the processing time continued to
    > increase. As of yesterday I was informed that the visa process would
    > not be completed until July and that it could only be approved IF
    > there were still enough visas!
    >
    > Needless to say I am extremely frustrated. After reviewing some of
    > the posts in this group, I am of the opinion that our best option at
    > this point is for her to travel to the U.S. on a tourist visa and for
    > us to get married here and then apply for her visa. I actually spoke
    > to someone with the INS who said that this would be perfectly fine and
    > then she proceeded to give me exact details of how to go about it.
    > There was no mention of the 30/60 day "rule" and I was also wondering
    > that if we were married within a week after she arrives if this would
    > create any problems. On one hand if she arrives with a long stay (3
    > month) ticket, this might create difficulties when she tries to enter
    > the country. On the other hand if she arrives with less than a one
    > month return ticket, then we have to get married quickly.
    >
    > Does anyone have any opinions or suggestions?
    >
    > Any input would be greatly appreciated. For those of you who believe
    > that if you try to circumvent the "proper" procedures, I can
    > understand how you feel but the K-1 process seems to be neverending at
    > this point. 10 months to process a K-1 seems crazy.
    >
    > Thanks
    >
    > ExpatMedic

mmmmmmmm Forgive me, I have no answer for you, but I do
wonder what will happen if you already applied for your K-1
and in the same processing period get married and then go
for a K-3..............just a thought, and I am curious what
others think of that....how will INS react when she arrives
based on her Tourist Visa? They can see in the database that
there is an application running as far as I know.
--
steg

Just Jenney

Firstly, you don't give enough information regarding your particular situation. What service center are you using? What consulate are you going through? This makes a difference in the kind of advice people can provide.

Secondly, let me state for the record that I am "one of those" who is against people trying to circumvent the proper procedures. These procedures are there for a reason -- it's called the law. That's what makes them proper as opposed to improper.

In any case, your "best option" scenaro is very confusing and doesn't make much sense.

You say your "best option" is to marry on a tourist visa and then "apply for a visa." While you can marry on her tourist visa, since your fiancee has the *intent* to immigrate, applying for a spousal visa requires her to return to her home country while the visa is being processed. Otherwise, she is committing immigration fraud.

Since your motivation for dropping the K-1 application is to avoid separation, it seems contradictory that you want to go down a different route which also involves separation. Which is why I believe your intention is NOT to apply for a spousal visa, but rather to marry on the tourist visa and then adjust status.

Either way, because she already has intent to immigrate, you'd be breaking the law (unless she returns home during visa processing). I believe this is what you called "circumventing the 'proper' procedures."

Also, I wonder how the INS and/or State Dept would view someone who abandoned their K-1 visa application, turned around and applied for a tourist visa, and then ultimately got married on that tourist visa and stayed.

My advice is to just stick it out like the rest of us who are following the rules. You're already half-way there, maybe even less. Whether it's 10 months or 5 months, separation is separation. It's hard on everyone. What's 10 months apart compared to a lifetime together?

~ Jenney

pondhopper

Hi Jenney

For what its worth I totally agree with your comments and think that you put the case for being patient very well.

It is acceptable by the INS to enter on a visa waiver and marry as long as there is no prior intent to do so and of course that you do not tell lies to the INS at the POE.
I do know that the INS inspector at the POE DOES have all of the information from your K1 petition on his computer as I saw it when I visited my loved one in December after filing our I-129F in September at the dreaded TSC.
I was questioned in a way that would have made it impossible to enter to marry without telling him lies. As it was my intention to return to the UK at the end of my visit and that is exactly what I did. I DID take supporting evidence of my intention to leave. They expect honesty and that is what they got , They let me in.

Dont risk it and stick with the K1 visa, The times they are quoting are nonsense anyway.

Charles

Still waiting

jeninifer

Hey Chuck,

You're in luck! I happen to have a very similar situation to yours. In September 2001 my fiance and I sent off all the paperwork for the Fiancee's Visa. Nothing good happened with this! There were major INS malfunctions which ended in our file being archived.

The year changed and still we waited, but my fiancee had sold his house and moved in with his parents, retired from the military and took a temporary job. He had even shipped large amounts of his posessions to me. We were quickly getting into a bad situation, yet we stuck it out.

March 29, 2002, Philip came for a visit and a friend's wedding. On the way home from the airport that night we joked about just getting married with Brandon and Lucy the next day. Of course, we couldn't do that, but it did make up our minds to go ahead and wed while he was here.

The next week day we found an attorney, met with her the next weekend and she took our case. We married April 12, 2002 and my husband stayed in the US while we applied for his AOS. We just let the Fiancee Visa lapse.

Because of our early wedding we planned a reception for a month later, on May 11, 2002. After all of the hullaballoo we presented our completed paperwork to our attorney and it was submitted on July 14, 2002 - approx. two weeks after Philip's visa waiver expired.

There was en error in the fee, but was quickly corrected and re-submitted. Philip got his "receipt" in September that allowed him to get his work authorization card.

In early January we received notice of our interview on January 14. We had less than two weeks to prepare. After a long, stressful wait we passed the interview process which resulted in the coveted stamp in Philip's passport and NO MORE INS until Oct. 2004 when we can apply to have the conditions removed. The details of our interview were posted in this forum on January 14.

I realize that there are a lot of people here that wait a long, long time to be with their fiance(e)'s and spouses. Philip and I tried to do it the "right" way, but the INS was very against it happening for us! For those people waiting - I hope that you are never dealt the problems we were. For those who are lucky enough to have use of a visa waiver - I absolutely suggest doing it the way Philip and I did. Of course, I can't guarantee that it'll have the same outcome, but worked well for us.

Sincerely,
Jen

thing2

Am I missing something here - is there an annual quota of K-1 visas ?

thing2

Patrick

Thanks to your post I just written to George W Bush and told him to abolish the INS and Homeland security as there is no need for it anymore. Don't bother filing people just go over and get married!!! It doesn't matter. Woooo hooooo everyone marry without filing.

You will save us tons of money and time, save the US government tons of money, Thank you Jennifer for your great idea.

Come on everyone, lets go to America - even if you don't want to marry someone just go and stay anyway, and as you pass the INS on the passport desk raise your middle finger and shout "**** you INS and all you stand for"

Patrick

Just Jenney

So, only 6 months had passed between the time you filed for your fiance's visa and when you decided you couldn't wait and follow through on the process properly.

Before we even sent off any paperwork, Mark and I accepted the fact that the visa process might take *at least* 6 months from start to finish. And that's even though we were going the "easy path" -- Vermont and then London. If it takes fewer than 6 months, great. But if it takes a little bit more, from the get-go we mentally and emotionally prepared ourselves for that possibility.

I often wonder why other people don't seem to do this themselves. While being separated is difficult, being realistic about the timeframe involved makes it a bit easier to deal with.

You are lucky that things worked out for you. You're lucky that he wasn't turned away from the POE to begin with -- no permanent job, no permanent home, a K-1 visa in the works (which clearly shows intent to immigrate; I'm curious how he got around all that at the POE). Perhaps your marriage was "spur-of-the-moment" (although retaining an attorney -- which you didn't need previously -- a week before you actually marry doesn't seem to correspond with that).

But please don't encourage others to break the law. Especially in a forum where there are so many who are trying to go about things legally and have to be separated from their loved ones to do so. It's borderline disrespectful, in my book, not to mention unethical.

~ Jenney

Caro

No there is no limitation that I know of for K1, nor is there for spousal visas.

Caroline

meauxna

Jenney, and Patrick,

I'd like to add my two cents' worth here to point out a couple of things:
First, what jeninifer did is not illegal. Even if they did retain a lawyer to file their paperwork, the wedding itself was not planned on during that visit. From what I've read of jeninifer's posts, her now husband made a clean, legal and sanctioned entry. VW rules allow for exactly what they did. Seperation from one's beloved is NOT a requirement of the immigration process; there are lots of ways around it (the USC can relocate, for example).

Second, patience, or lack thereof, is not necessarily the issue. Just as your circumstances make the K1 the appropriate avenue for *you*, others' circumstances make their path appropriate for them. For example, it is not a lack of patience that caused my husband and I to choose DCF, we were fortunate enough and well informed enough to take advantage of a faster way to complete our case. Important to making our decision was the fact that after entry on a K1/K3/VW we would face a lengthy AOS during which his ability to leave the country might be inhibited. This was not an acceptable option as his mother is in ill health and he needed the freedom to come and go.

I appriciate that many of the K1/K3 people here are going through longer than anticipated waits, which is frustrating. However, for people who have chosen a mate from another culture, I find the lack of tolerance particularly disturbing. And, the moralizing pretty disgusting. I tend to stick to answering questions on the NG that I have personal experience with. I wish both of you would consider that along with Jenney's admonition "It's borderline disrespectful, in my book, not to mention unethical."

Targaff

[email protected] (Chuck) wrote in
news:[email protected]:

    > Does anyone have any opinions or suggestions?
    >
    > Any input would be greatly appreciated. For those of you who believe
    > that if you try to circumvent the "proper" procedures, I can
    > understand how you feel but the K-1 process seems to be neverending at
    > this point. 10 months to process a K-1 seems crazy.

I can see where you're coming from with your (well made) query; 10 months
is a long time, and I know I'd have been tempted if my K1 had taken so
long. I guess my main opinion would be that it's your conscious decision
to go the route you were suggesting. The main issue is that of "intent" -
whether you came over with the intention of marrying without having the
correct visa - and as others have posted with their experiences, it's
entirely possible that it won't be a problem; however the INS could
easily hold up the fact that you've submitted a K1 as evidence to show
that you entered the country with the intent to marry. They may not, of
course, but maybe they will...

I guess at the end of the day my opinion is that you should be aware of
the risk, and on your own head be it if you decide to take it.

--

Targaff

jeninifer

Patrick and Jenney,

Pardon me, but did you even read my post before you left such hasty replies?

Yes, we waited 6 months before giving up on our fiance visa, but did you miss the point where we heard NOTHING in that six months and that we made absolutely no progress? Due to INS error our file was archived and left to rot. We would have had to start over from the very beginning. We TRIED the K1 route and it didn't work for us. Can you imagine how devastated we were? How would you both feel if tomorrow you found out the very same thing?

What would YOU have done at that point? Put your lives on hold at the hands of INS beaurocracy or seek a perfectly legal alternate route at the advice of an immigration attorney?

Patrick, your sarcastic and malicious reply is unhelpful and shows little respect for the members of this forum. You have demonstrated a distinct lack of knowledge of the US Immigration Laws. I would appreciate you moderating your tone and language as your post was not constructive.

Jenney, how can you state that we were lucky that Philip wasn't turned away at the POE? On what grounds? Our visa application was basically nonexistent and Philip was a recently retired member of the British Army while maintaining an alternate UK address. Again, you display a lack of understanding of the INS legislation. If we acted "illegally" why does the INS cater for people in our situation?

May I remind you, that we have passed our interview and AOS situation flawlessly - even to the point of receiving the coveted "stamp" in Philip's passport with Philip acting as his own financial sponser on the Affidavit of Support.

Philip and I are proud of what we have achieved. We don't need to defend what we did because we acted within the guidelines and legistation laid down by the INS themselves. We are so thankful to be able to have the stress of dealing with the INS behind us for a while. We KNOW how a K1 applicant feels because we wore those shoes ourselves.

Chuck wrote asking for advice. I gave him my advice by illustrating my success with this particular INS process. What he choses to do with the information given to him here isn't my business or yours.

If you're going through the K1 visa application Philip and I wish you the best of luck.

May you be blessed in your endeavors,
Jennifer

beyness

You go girl! I probably would have done the same thing was I in your shoes... "Don't let the man get ya down..."

Patrick

Of course I am going to be sarcastic - you fragrently encourage people to break the law - your first posting says

"For those who are lucky enough to have use of a visa waiver - I absolutely suggest doing it the way Philip and I did."

If everyone just got on a plane and used the VW to get in the country and then marry and stay then there would be no need for the INS. By entering will willful intend to marry and lying to the INS you break the law - case closed. What you did may not be wrong but you are telling people to do it.

What if someone who has a criminal record or has been deported comes on this site and sees your advise and follows it. When they have a hard time with the INS they will say you told them to do it.

What you are saying is **** the rules - the rules are there for a reason by telling people not to do things the right way you have no right to post on this forum.

I respect everyone on this forum who gives legal and ethical advice, I have no time for people who advise people to break laws and use loopholes which in the long term will be closed due to abuse and make the whole process harder for people to follow. I find it very disresctful to tell people to abuse the system - whats worse is you think you are not sticking your middle finger up at the INS. The rules aren't there to keep you and your loved one apart they are they to keep undesirables out. If you can get in that way so can undesireables. Think about that the next time an act of terrorism takes place.

I have my gc, I have my ssn but surprisingly I still care about people coming in behind me

Patrick

Ranjini

Your reasoning powers are as feeble as your confidence in US security or the powers of the INS. Perhaps, they should get you on board as an advisor.
This young lady expressing her opinion on ths forum, isn't exactly going to cause a breach in US security. Give me a break..........