Karen

Okay, I'm confused. I'm hearing way too many conflicting stories
here. So from what I gather from the INS I cannot work until I get
work authorization yet some people on this site say we are allowed for
the duration of the ninety days. Why is this not mentioned on the INS
website? And if this is the case why have I read numerous mentions on
this site about people wanting to work badly but can't do it until
they are approved? I have also noticed several arguements about this,
claiming this information is false.
So has anyone done this and if so how exactly is it done?

Thanks

Karen

dazeychain

Hiya...I'm in Mixedupville too. I thikn I'm going to wait until we get married, then file for EAD and AOS and Advance Parole all at the same time. I think it also depends on where you file. We'll be using Chicago, and they don't let you file EAD on its own (from what I can tell).

I know this isn't helpful...but you're not alone :-)

Peace,

D.

Daxx

"Karen" wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > Okay, I'm confused. I'm hearing way too many conflicting stories
    > here. So from what I gather from the INS I cannot work until I get
    > work authorization yet some people on this site say we are allowed for
    > the duration of the ninety days. Why is this not mentioned on the INS
    > website? And if this is the case why have I read numerous mentions on
    > this site about people wanting to work badly but can't do it until
    > they are approved? I have also noticed several arguements about this,
    > claiming this information is false.
    > So has anyone done this and if so how exactly is it done?

You can only work if you have an EAD. Some POE's give (or used to give) a 90
day EAD when you arrived on a K1. With this you could get a SS#, then get a
bank account, drivers license, etc. The 90 day EAD is supposed to cover you
until you can apply for the full one year card when you adjust status. From
personal experience however, for working it is pretty useless. I entered
through Atlanta (K1) and got a 90 day EAD, then a couple of weeks later we
applied for the one year EAD along with my AOS. It took over three months to
get the notification to attend the INS office for the one year EAD, by which
time the temp card had long expired. If I had been working I would have had
to stop while I waited for the one year EAD. Of course, the INS being what
it is, I was back in Atlanta less than one month after getting the one year
EAD to attend my AOS interview, when I got the I-551 and two year green
card, making the one year EAD and it's ~$100 cost a rather expensive
souvenier.

Regarding the SS#, the office I went to did not know what to do with the
EAD, and had to contact another office to determine whether or not I should
have the card. In the end I got the SS card, but it has a notification that
it is only valid as long as I have a valid INS work permit (EAD or I-551)


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Karen

I'm going to call the INS tomorrow and find out exactly what the deal
is. I just can't see any potential employer hiring someone who hasn't
been granted anything saying they can work by the INS. Besides if it
was possible you'd think INS would mention it but I already said that.

It doesn't really matter anyways probably, I've already filed my AOS
and EAD not that its been productive at all since I still havn't heard
anything. Grrrr..... :-(

Thanks!

Karen

Just to prove my theory. Found this directly from INS's website.

-If you are a lawful permanent resident or a conditional permanent
resident, you do not need an Employment Authorization Document. Your
Alien Registration Card (don't think I have one of these) proves that
you may work in the United States.
-The specific categories that require an Employment Authorization
Document include (but are not limited to) asylees and asylum seekers;
refugees; students seeking particular types of employment; applicants
to adjust to permanent residence status; people in or applying for
temporary protected status; fiancés of American citizens; and
dependents of foreign government officials.

So when you entered the US on a K-1....exactly what is our status???
What category do we fall into???

Thanks

Daxx

"Karen" wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > Just to prove my theory. Found this directly from INS's website.
    > -If you are a lawful permanent resident or a conditional permanent
    > resident, you do not need an Employment Authorization Document. Your
    > Alien Registration Card (don't think I have one of these) proves that
    > you may work in the United States.
    > -The specific categories that require an Employment Authorization
    > Document include (but are not limited to) asylees and asylum seekers;
    > refugees; students seeking particular types of employment; applicants
    > to adjust to permanent residence status; people in or applying for
    > temporary protected status; fiancés of American citizens; and
    > dependents of foreign government officials.
    > So when you entered the US on a K-1....exactly what is our status???
    > What category do we fall into???

Until your AOS has been approved and you have the I-551, you are *not* a
lawful permanent resident *or* a conditional permanent resident. Until you
get the I-551, you fall into the second category.


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kitty-uk

Karen

I to am confused over the same thing, good luck with your search.
I know there are many here who would love to know your out come, looking forward to hearing your answers
kit

Steggy

Karen wrote:
    >
    > Just to prove my theory. Found this directly from INS's website.
    >
    > -If you are a lawful permanent resident or a conditional permanent
    > resident, you do not need an Employment Authorization Document. Your
    > Alien Registration Card (don't think I have one of these) proves that
    > you may work in the United States.
    > -The specific categories that require an Employment Authorization
    > Document include (but are not limited to) asylees and asylum seekers;
    > refugees; students seeking particular types of employment; applicants
    > to adjust to permanent residence status; people in or applying for
    > temporary protected status; fiancés of American citizens; and
    > dependents of foreign government officials.
    >
    > So when you entered the US on a K-1....exactly what is our status???
    > What category do we fall into???
    >
    > Thanks

Like Daxx said: you are not a lawful or conditional
permanent resident. That status you get after your interview
(stamp in passport, Greencard, or in my case a pretty low
profile piece of paper, not even sure if that has any status).

I am a bit surprised by all the stories I read about the EAD
(which is in effect also an Alien Registration Card as I was
told) and the SSN#. It is apparently very hard to get these
days. I came in on a K-1 in July 2000 and had both of them
instantly after visiting INS and the Social Security office,
even before getting married. September 11, I suppose..............
--
steg

gentlelady

Dax , which soc sec office in Atlanta did you go too? Did you apply as a k1 or were you married? Thx

Folinskyinla

Hi:

The rules are fairly simple. Part of the problem is that people conflate employment authorization and proof of employment authorization. They are two separate issues.

In enforcement of the employment rules there are two questions: first of all, are you an "authorized alien" or a US citizen. If so, you can work without penalty and an employer cannot be assessed the larger sanctions for employing an "unauthorized alien".

Second, there are the paperwork requirements -- the employer must complete an I-9 form in which the employer attests authorization to work and the employer attests to what documents were examined. The employee is not penalized for violating this requirement [assuming no lieing] but the EMPLOYER can be assessed a small paperwork fine.

Lets put it this way, lets say an employer has a workforce of all citizens and "authorized aliens" -- there will be no fine for employing "unauthorized aliens" but there could be fine for paperwork violations. There will be no penalty imposed on the workers.

So, what about a K-1 -- the K-1 is defined as being authorized to work "incident to status" -- So the K-1 can work without being in violation of status. The employer cannot be dinged for employing an "unauthorized alien."

However, the ONLY permissible "evidence" of this status is the EAD. So the employer can be dinged for paperwork violations.

However, please note that there are strict time limitations imposed on INS. They have 90 days from date of application to process the EAD application. If they don't give it to you, then you are ENTITLED to an interim EAD good for 270 days. However, please note that the EAD for a K-1 can never be valid beyond the 90th day after admission. So, assuming you apply on the day after you arrive, on day 91 after APPLICATION, you will be ENTITLED to issuance of an EAD which will expire the day before.

So bottom line: YOU can work, but an employer will be subject to a small fine for paperwork violations.

This is an FAQ and I try to make it as simple as possible.

Daxx

"gentlelady" wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

    > Dax , which soc sec office in Atlanta did you go too? Did you apply as
    > a k1 or were you married? Thx

We got married withing a few days of my arriving in the US, then applied for
the SS# around the same time the EAD and AOS were filed. We were in Macon
not Atlanta, which is probably why the staff at the SS office had to get
clarification - they probably didn't get to see many K1-ers! :)


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Targaff

"Daxx" wrote in
news:[email protected]:

    > I entered through Atlanta (K1) and got a 90 day
    > EAD, then a couple of weeks later we applied for the one year EAD
    > along with my AOS. It took over three months to get the notification
    > to attend the INS office for the one year EAD, by which time the temp
    > card had long expired

Back in the golden days when Atlanta still issued them, eh? ;p

Just curious, though; if it took over 3 months to get the notification,
weren't you entitled to go there anyway and ask for a 270 day EAD because
it had taken them over 90 days?

--

Targaff

Ccalgreen

Folinskyinla wrote in message news:...

    > Hi:
    >
    > The rules are fairly simple. Part of the problem is that people
    > conflate employment authorization and proof of employment authorization.
    > They are two separate issues.
    >
    > In enforcement of the employment rules there are two questions: first
    > of all, are you an "authorized alien" or a US citizen. If so, you can
    > work without penalty and an employer cannot be assessed the larger
    > sanctions for employing an "unauthorized alien".
    >
    > Second, there are the paperwork requirements -- the employer must
    > complete an I-9 form in which the employer attests authorization to work
    > and the employer attests to what documents were examined. The employee
    > is not penalized for violating this requirement [assuming no lieing] but
    > the EMPLOYER can be assessed a small paperwork fine.
    >
    > Lets put it this way, lets say an employer has a workforce of all
    > citizens and "authorized aliens" -- there will be no fine for employing
    > "unauthorized aliens" but there could be fine for paperwork violations.
    > There will be no penalty imposed on the workers.
    >
    > So, what about a K-1 -- the K-1 is defined as being authorized to work
    > "incident to status" -- So the K-1 can work without being in violation
    > of status. The employer cannot be dinged for employing an
    > "unauthorized alien."
    >
    > However, the ONLY permissible "evidence" of this status is the EAD. So
    > the employer can be dinged for paperwork violations.
    >
    > However, please note that there are strict time limitations imposed on
    > INS. They have 90 days from date of application to process the EAD
    > application. If they don't give it to you, then you are ENTITLED to an
    > interim EAD good for 270 days. However, please note that the EAD for a
    > K-1 can never be valid beyond the 90th day after admission. So,
    > assuming you apply on the day after you arrive, on day 91 after
    > APPLICATION, you will be ENTITLED to issuance of an EAD which will
    > expire the day before.
    >
    > So bottom line: YOU can work, but an employer will be subject to a
    > small fine for paperwork violations.
    >
    > This is an FAQ and I try to make it as simple as possible.

*A BIG THANK YOU*! :) This is just about the clearest explanation
I've read of the whole thing. IMHO, it would do very well to post
this response on the K1FAQ, if the powers that be are watching!

mjones

We can stick it in there somehow. This is mostly already covered in the FAQ, but
mostly covering what you can *do* to get an EAD *somehow*, but no explanations
of *why* this oddball situation exists. People need to get it hammered thru
their heads that applying for a 90 day EAD thru the Service Center (on the basis
of being a K1) is fruitless and a waste of money.
Probably what I might do is write up a little essay on it, incorporating Mr F's
commentary, with the simple attribution that it came from "an attorney who
posted this on 12-30-02", and link it to the FAQ and the Envelope.
Mike

On 4 Jan 2003 01:23:43 -0800, [email protected] (ccalgreen) wrote:

    >*A BIG THANK YOU*! :) This is just about the clearest explanation
    >I've read of the whole thing. IMHO, it would do very well to post
    >this response on the K1FAQ, if the powers that be are watching!

    >Folinskyinla wrote in message news:...
    >
    >> Hi:
    >>
    >> The rules are fairly simple. Part of the problem is that people
    >> conflate employment authorization and proof of employment authorization.
    >> They are two separate issues.
    >>
    >> In enforcement of the employment rules there are two questions: first
    >> of all, are you an "authorized alien" or a US citizen. If so, you can
    >> work without penalty and an employer cannot be assessed the larger
    >> sanctions for employing an "unauthorized alien".
    >>
    >> Second, there are the paperwork requirements -- the employer must
    >> complete an I-9 form in which the employer attests authorization to work
    >> and the employer attests to what documents were examined. The employee
    >> is not penalized for violating this requirement [assuming no lieing] but
    >> the EMPLOYER can be assessed a small paperwork fine.
    >>
    >> Lets put it this way, lets say an employer has a workforce of all
    >> citizens and "authorized aliens" -- there will be no fine for employing
    >> "unauthorized aliens" but there could be fine for paperwork violations.
    >> There will be no penalty imposed on the workers.
    >>
    >> So, what about a K-1 -- the K-1 is defined as being authorized to work
    >> "incident to status" -- So the K-1 can work without being in violation
    >> of status. The employer cannot be dinged for employing an
    >> "unauthorized alien."
    >>
    >> However, the ONLY permissible "evidence" of this status is the EAD. So
    >> the employer can be dinged for paperwork violations.
    >>
    >> However, please note that there are strict time limitations imposed on
    >> INS. They have 90 days from date of application to process the EAD
    >> application. If they don't give it to you, then you are ENTITLED to an
    >> interim EAD good for 270 days. However, please note that the EAD for a
    >> K-1 can never be valid beyond the 90th day after admission. So,
    >> assuming you apply on the day after you arrive, on day 91 after
    >> APPLICATION, you will be ENTITLED to issuance of an EAD which will
    >> expire the day before.
    >>
    >> So bottom line: YOU can work, but an employer will be subject to a
    >> small fine for paperwork violations.
    >>
    >> This is an FAQ and I try to make it as simple as possible.