Folinskyinla

Hi:

You did not talk to a consular officer -- you either spoke to a "FSN" British worker OR an American Expat working for the embassy [the later is a not so uncommon way to give the Foreign Service spouses a job and avoid boredom].

They are NOT supposed to EVER tell you "you don't need a lawyer." Your particular case is a demonstration why.

There are American immigration lawyers in London, but they tend to business immigration and are on the expensive side to my eyes [but I don't live in London -- and we don't have a VAT on top of it].

It is also possible to retain lawyers in the United States. Between FAX, telephone, e-mail and DHL, you'd be surprised it isn't all that hard. I've had clients I have never met.

Costs, it varies. Also, I think you need at least a consultation with a lawyer. It strikes me that you "mixing apples and oranges" quite a bit.

[Totally off topic -- is the "apples and oranges" metaphor used in the UK or is it an American one. I remember once asked by a Korean translator to suggest an American metaphor equivalent to common Korean metaphor which translated as "kill two birds with one stone." ]

Hilda

Dear Folinskyinla,

First two were born to me involving 'natural' father who then chose to be off the scene completely (was it something i said? LOL). My husband and I met when the first two were tiny and we then married and he adopted them so he is now legal/adoptive father. On paper and everything. This adoption process was finalized last year after a looooooong wait, and lots of courtly correspondance as one would expect. It's been a step by step wading through paperwork experience for us the whole way.

I realise that the whole path of the discussion has changed as we are now dealing with, first and foremost sorting out 'who' our kids are to be as far as nationality goes, which comes first, before I set a foot in my immigration process.

Um, hope I haven't been misguiding by not mentioning their adoption first, was concerned that I concentrate on one aspect of our en masse applications at a time. It's a case of uncovering what is needed to be seen to as I clumsily plod around the beginnings.

Seeing a lawyer would mean that I would lay all the facts on the table at once, I see that now, and that the lawyer could then tell me x,y,z.

But no, none of the children were born within our present marriage, we married after the last baby was born. Does the 'born out of wedlock' and the adoption affect the 322 application other than the (nearly) two year wait required for the adopted two? *sheepishly* We are married now, but I guess we did it all backwards.

Hilda

Dear Folinskyinla,

Okay. Well the person I spoke to seem very officious. I was a little taken aback by the number of "..between you and I..." bits of advice I was given, as it seemed to me that I was getting inside information, the person seemed genuinely concerned about me so that, of course, sold me.

But I have to say, I was given a list of very impressive 'do's' and 'don'ts' in the course of the conversation by this particular person which threw me. The original two people I had spoken to on seperate occasions were just as formal and careful with their language as I'd expected them to be, nothing was really given away.

Does the phrase 'mixing apples and oranges' mean that I am not quite yet focused? If so, I agree. But if the apple is my immigration application and the orange is getting my kids expeditious naturalization rolling then I can see I going to have to peel orange first.

I know that lawyers in England are expensive, and it is good that we have other options. Is anybody able to offer advice about their personal recommendations for particular lawyers? Or is that not done on forum as rule?

And am I to gather that I shouldn't bother phoning the embassy for guidance any more? (Had sort of planned, before reading this forum, that when I had questions I would 'just' ring the embassy again, spend long minutes on hold as I have done a few times and then ask them whatever my question is).

Also, anybody had any experience of being told to email their personal questions into embassy? Am bit wary of doing this because I am concerned that it is all in the phrasing and am not sure about if I would be charged for any such email, and if such an email would then be considered part of an application?

fatbrit

Many failures to take citizenship while you can seem to be based on a misunderstanding of the laws and practices regarding dual citizenship. 'Strongly recommend" is necessary to pressure the poster into actually investigating the benefits and pitfalls themselves rather than relying on rumor and misconception.

JAJ

If he has lived all of his life in Britain, then it is quite foolish on his part to pass up the chance to become a British citizen. Especially as he would keep his American citizenship.

Is he aware that his U.K. resident status will lapse after he leaves the United Kingdom?

chicagojlo

If you have the option to have the same nationality as your kids it's always a smart idea to do so in my opinion. That's why I will still retain my British nationality when I am lucky enough to be able to say I am a citizen of somewhere else, even if it will be with gritted teeth!

Folinskyinla

Hi:

Not quite meaning not focused -- the goal is getting everyone over to the United States -- its just that there are two separate strategies and sub-strategies. I'm often asked "which one is best" and I often respond "what ever works." And, no this is not a way to increase attorney's fees, since there is a hefty discount on the alternative paths -- it is using a bit of British engineering jargon "belts and braces."

By the way, the fact situation you pose has gotten beyond the point where I can give any general information. I would have to hit the books on this one.

Good luck.

Hilda

Dear JAJ,

Yes he is aware his status will change. It's been tough deciding to relinquish that.

I didn't know he could keep American citizenship if he got English too?!???

Hilda

Dear Chicagojlo,

It is really important to me to have the same national identity as my kids.

I was under the impression that dual nationalities are not encouraged by the US?!?

Hilda

Dear Folinskyinla,

I appreciate the suggestions you have made so far and for helping us to understand some of our basic options.

Belt and braces sounds like what we need indeed.

fatbrit

Thank you for proving the common misconception standpoint.

He (and you!) should both read here:
www.richw.org/dualcit

ian-mstm

Fortunately, "not encouraged" is not the same as "not allowed"!

Ian - dual UKC/USC

JAJ

He can't get "English" because there is no such thing but he can become a British citizen.

Becoming a British citizen does not cause loss of American citizenship provided he intends to keep American citizenship. The State Department will presume he intends to stay American unless the contrary is demonstrated.
http://travel.state.gov/law/citizens...nship_778.html
also http://www.richw.org/dualcit/

The process of becoming a British citizen can usually be done in 6 months but if keen he should apply straight away as there are proposals out there to make it even tougher:
http://www.bia.homeoffice.gov.uk/bri...ship/applying/

He needs to do the Life in the UK Test first: http://www.lifeintheuktest.gov.uk

Hilda

Dear JAJ,

I perused the 'Life In The UK' test site and looked at the questions asked of people wishing to stay.

Waves of nausea overcame me, to be quite honest.

I am not sure why, but the questions in themselves made me want to run screaming.

I suppose it is the knowledge that so many Brits do not know the answers to these questions that made my stomach turn. Ah well. It's a funny old world.

Thanks for your help in that respect. Am having a 'oh crikey this is all too much' moment as brain struggles to compute, and shall have to take a breather for a day, do my math and come back with a whole load of new questions.

This forum has been so helpful. Ta very much.

scrubbedexpat099

Hopefully the answers in the book are at least correct, which would be one up on the US Test.