Brit3964

What about the court record? Have you tried that avenue yet?

marcsred

According to the Procurator Fiscal, he is not in their system, so no record should exist and nothing should show on his certificate. According to the Kirkcaldy Sheriff Court, what's on his certificate should be there, but they have no records to extract (and they supposedly get their info from the Fiscal's office, which means nothing should be there). So it's circles and circles. No record exists, but he has a record. But the Fiscal's office should have the final word, according to all other departments, but they won't do anything. They just say, it shouldn't be there since we have no record, but we won't do anything about it or look into it. Someone must have screwed up along the line. Good luck with your immigration. CLICK. That's the conversation my husband and I each separately had with them.

Folinskyinla

Sigh, you intrigued me to go look up what a Sheriff Court was! Note -- this was a google and not legal research. I looked at the Scottish Court Service website

Query: Do the records you have already make any mention of "summary" or "solemn?" "Summary" procedures can impose a maximum sentence of three months. Accordingly, even if the crime was a CIMT, it would be in the petty offense exception. In contrast, a "solemn" court can impose a sentence up to three years.

It also seems that the age of 19 may have an affect too. And the idea of a "compensation order" is interesting. There seems to be an analogue in US law -- called restitution.

nettlebed

If you've come to the conclusion that you can't get any help from the authorities in Scotland, there's no point in pursuing that avenue, so it's not worth worrying about it any further.

What you need now, I would think, is somebody who can present the facts as you have stated them to the USCIS in the best possible light. That means, as Mr. F. has pointed out, somebody who understands (i) the legal ramifications of "Theft by Housebreaking" under Scottish law; and (ii) also understands enough about the immigration consequences of (i), and how best to be able to obtain a waiver (if required), or convince USCIS that a waiver is not required.

It sounds like a tall order, but unless you concentrate on that, you are likely to be striking the problem with a series of glancing blows, and not making any progress.

Good luck.

Folinskyinla

Hi:

OT to the line of inquiry here --

Hubby is going for an Immigrant Visa -- if ConOff is convinced no waiver needed, bypass USCIS. Once visa issued, the matter is one for CBP. And if CBP gets hung up -- it is either to the Immigration Judge [who works for the Department of Justice] or if paroled in -- it would be USCIS.

The split up of the former INS is one of those instances of being careful on what one wishes for -- it might happen.

AlanR

Now I assume that you've been able to get a written response/letter that no record exists. Again Scottish law may be different but (and this may be irrelevant, so apologies in advance), in England the MOC (Memorandum of Conviction) - if this happened and it seems that it maybe was not the case - always exists. However, the police records are destroyed after x years (x maybe 10 but it does depend on the offense) due to 'retention guidelines'. I trust that the 2 forms of 'record' are not being confused.
If the court or police can't find an appropriate record they usually (and again England, my apologies) will issue an official letter to that effect.
I hope you get through this crisis alright and that you'll be able to relax about it in years to come but I understand your stress on the issue. Time eventually is a healer.

marcsred

HA! I wish. When we asked for a letter or something written saying he wasn't in their record or that they couldn't find a record, we're were told, "It's not our policy to issue written statements." We just can't win with these people. They have nothing to give us, but then say, we won't give you something saying we have nothing. It's ridiculous.

nettlebed

To reiterate, then: If you have satisfied yourself that there is no way you can get any more records from the authorities in Bonnie Scotland, you need to find somebody to help you navigate with the appropriate US immigration authorities, bit somebody who has knowledge of the ramifications of being charged "Theft by Housebreaking" in Scotland, and how it corresponds to charges in the United States. There doesn't seem to be anything else to add.

Dwelling on the injustices and problems you have experiences you have had will just cause you to waste energy and get depressed. Look forwards, not backwards.

marcsred

The only "record" we have and that supposedly exists to the Scottish government is the police certificate itself. That makes no mention of summary or solemn...

marcsred

Hi again,

I know you said this post was off topic, but it completely baffled me. So if the Consular Officer at the Embassy when he has his interview says no waiver is needed and issues his visa, we then have to worry about what CBP will say? Where does that come into play? At the POE? What do you mean by paroled in?

I think I will try my best to just set this aside until I'm done with finals. Folinskyinla - I saw you're located in LA. I'm in my last few weeks at USC! I don't know how you do it, but I can't wait to get out of LA and back to Austin. I think this city makes me feel even lonlier being away from my hubby.

And yes, always looking forward. That's the scariest part sometimes. The last few years my husband and I (especially) have taken so many blows (most NOT having to do with immigration), and everything that could possibly go wrong seems like it has. But getting to be together here in the States has always been the light at the end of the tunnel. I just don't want that light to grow any dimmer or get any farther away than it seems like it already is.


I think the holidays coming up (and our first wedding anniversary on Christmas Day) is making it just that GIANT bit harder to be apart. We had really hoped the process would take less than a year. Anyway, just holding onto the hope that this will all be over soon, and end up with me and my hubby getting to be together here in the States.

Folinskyinla

Hi:

I gather you have spoken to them by telephone. FYI, here is the official State Department stuff on British records. This is what the ConOff in Australia will look at.

http://travel.state.gov/visa/frvi/re...html?css=print

I suggest your husband write to the appropriate authority as noted in the instructions. Make sure to send the request via DHL or international registered mail so you have proof of delivery. If he doesn't hear in a month -- do it again. Letter should be polite. Keep copy and proof of delivery for the ConOff. Sometimes, something that is listed as "available" turns out not be available after all -- but it is up to him to show he tried.

Folinskyinla

Hi:

As to the first paragraph -- I was just noting that people tend to say "USCIS" when they talk about the governmental agencies. Don't worry about that right now.

I have a fairly simple reason for living in Los Angeles -- I was born here. Went away for law school. Grew up as a Valley Boy but have lived in Echo Park and then Los Feliz for many years -- Valley is not for me.

USC, eh? Go Bruins!

marcsred

I could probably live in LA if I could live in Los Feliz. I love Los Feliz. Not a Trojan fan, eh? I just can't catch a break!

marcsred

I guess I'm just not good at letting things lie. Especially when not doing so would provide a great form of procrastination for a paper I'm writing. I just realized that it's normal business hours in the UK, so I thought I'd try my hand again with the Procurator Fiscal's Office. Today I got a man who was actually rather helpful, and who, after searching for about half an hour found out some information. Of course they couldn't give me specific details because I am not my husband, but what I was told was this:

• My husband's charge was a SUMMARY charge.
  
  
• He was given a compensation order, which, in Scotland, DOES NOT constitute a full court appearance (if that is important - the Procurator Fiscal seemed to think it was).
  
  
• Compensation orders are reserved for people with an otherwise clean record and for only the least serious of charges (or charges that are not "solemn" and even on the less serious side of summary charges).
  
  
• While Theft by Housebreaking can range from a petty offense to something quite serious, the level of seriousness can be gauged by the sentence given. Being given a compensation order reflects that even among summary charges, his was not a serious one.
  
  
• The man said that if my husband wrote to him, he might be able to give him more details in writing.

What do you think Folinskyinla? Just asking for advice, of course, not something to pin our hopes on. If we can get something in writing that says it was a summary charge and compensation order sentence, and perhaps even something stating that those are the Scottish equivalent of a petty/misdemeanor offence and small fine, would that hold any weight?

AlanR

No contest.
Just express your request in writing today.
Any written evidence that you have tried and other stuff is vital.