marcsred

Hi again everyone. My husband and I have submitted our I-130 and things have moved VERY slowly, but smoothly. I have two questions though, because some unexpected stuff came up.


First, my husband got his police clearances from Australia and the UK, and we thought they were both going to come up clean, but both did not. His Australian one is clear, but his UK police clearance certificate shows that back in 2000, when he was 19, he was charged with "Theft By Housebreaking" and the disposal was "Compensation".


Long story short, after a night out, my husband found himself on the roof of a building on the High Street in Kirkcaldy in Scotland, and couldn't find a way down (he didn't know how he'd gotten up there). He broke an attic window to open the latch and was hoping to get down through a staircase in the building. Anyway, the alarm went off, the cops came, the shop owner came, etc. He was taken to court where he said that he had, in fact, broken the window, but had not stolen, nor intended to steal anything. The judge dismissed the charges but ordered that he pay 100 pounds to the shop owner for the broken window and the hassle of him having to come to his shop at 2 a.m.


The certificate just says that he committed "Theft By Housebreaking" though, and the thing is, no one in Kirkcaldy can find any records. The ACPO says they get their info from the Kirkcaldy Sheriff's Court, who said they had the information on the police clearance certificate, but no record they could extract. They then said they get their info from the Procurator Fiscal, and when we called them, they said they had no record of him, and so there should be nothing on the police clearance certificate. BUT OF COURSE, they wouldn't change anything or clear anything up.


SO...We're wondering how bad this is. Everything else is perfect, nothing before or after this, but we can't get a court record or anything like that. He wrote a letter of explanation which we submitted with his other document to the NVC, and were told the NVC just collects paperwork and they'd decide at his interview whether to approve or deny his visa.


Basically, I'm wondering if anyone has any experience with something like this. We're both feeling sick about this, and he's feeling even worse thinking that if our application gets denied, it'll be his fault for a misunderstanding about a stupid incident nearly 10 years ago. It's bee almost a year now since we submitted our application, and we're REEEEEEEEALLY ready to be done with this and just get to be together.




Other question: If the NVC has received all of our documents, I was wondering if anyone from Australia who has gone through this process could tell me how long it took, from when you sent off the last of the documents & DS-230 to the NVC, to when you actually had your interview in Sydney?


I'm graduating uni here in the States in December, so I could go out to Australia to be with him (our first wedding anniversary is on Christmas Day) until his visa goes through, but at the same time, if the NVC received the last of our documents in late November and we might get an interview soon, it doesn't make sense, financially, to spend all that money to go to Australia for just a month or so, you know? It makes sense emotionally, because it's our anniversary and we miss each other like hell, but we don't have thousands of dollars to be throwing around, and feel like it would be better to wait an extra month or two if it meant the next time we saw each other we could be starting our lives together properly in America.


So has anyone from Australia done this recently? How long, from submitting all paperwork to the NVC, did you have to wait before you had your interview in Sydney? One month? Two? Three? More?


Thank you all, as always, for all you help and advice!

marcsred

So many views and no advice? That makes me nervous!

Bluegrass Lass

Your question may be a little too technical for anyone on here to give you a good answer. And to be honest, it was a little confusing!

It sounds like you OH has a record, since an arrest showed up on his Police Clearance, but there are no court records to back it up? To be honest, I don't know how it will viewed at the visa interview. I hope someone else can give you a better answer.

Folinskyinla

Hi:

You need an expert opinion here -- probably from a Scott solicitor -- note I did not say English. Scottish law is a tad different from the English Common Law.

Based upon what you say, there may be a possibility that the crime may not even be a "CIMT", or if its if falls under the US immigration law concept of petty offense. If it is a problem, then a waiver might be needed. In fact, you may have to have an American immigration lawyer cooperating with the Scot solicitor.

The reason you don't have responses here is that it is so way beyond the scope of knowledge of the posters here, no one has the faintest clue.

Good luck.

anabella

Have you tried searching for an Aussie expat website? they might be able to tell you about Sydney's timelines...

Norri

Sigh!
he needs a Scot who is a solicitor or a Scottish solicitor

Got to wonder about someone who inexplicably finds themselves on a roof with the only way down through a skylight into a shop, but hey I'm a Fifer stranger things have happened espescially in Kirkcaldy on a saturday night.

Good luck anyway.

Ray

in London we had a different view ..we called them thieving bastards ..

marcsred

Wow, you know what? I said I was giving a summary of what happened. The things that were black and white on paper. Obviously my husband will be given a chance to explain at his interview what happened.

But thank you, Ray. That figures. When I lived in London I found it to be full of thieving bastards and just scum in general. My first night there I had my drink spiked and someone tried to rape me. Then I was also robbed twice, and a guy beat the crap out of my sister when she was walking home (not all on the same night). Even the children were scum. My sister and I had eggs and bottles thrown at us while we were walking down the street at 9 p.m. I guess there was nothing better for kids to do with their lives than hang out in shopping centre parking lots like little thugs waiting to hurt people. The little prick even pulled a knife on us when we turned around to see what the hell was going on. I needed 13 stitches to the back of my head because of a little bottle-throwing 8 or 9 year old bastard. So I understand what you mean. London was full of bastards so I left school there as soon as I could.

For the record, for all you judgemental jerks out there, my husband had no idea how he'd gotten up there. When the police came, his nose was broken and his shirt was soaked in his own blood. He didn't do that to himself. And he's not your typical guy who loves getting into punch ups and had just gotten himself into a fight on the way home.

My husband is tall, thin, and very reserved. He has more scars and cracked teeth from having his head kicked in by bullies as a young kid/teenager than I even thought possible (I was raised in a middle-class suburb in America). He'd rather TAKE a beating than raise a fist. Not that he had much choice as a slight young boy, but he continues to be the same way today. He'll do anything he can to avoid a fight, and that's a big reason why we're trying to settle in America - because he has flat out refused to have us raise our children in the UK after what he experienced as a child. And after my shining experience with the lovely youth of England, I couldn't agree more.

I know a small-minded Londoner like yourself, Ray, probably hasn't ventured out of your little London bubble, but the Kirkcaldy High Street isn't something where you can tell what the hell you're getting into from the roof, and there isn't an obvious way of getting down (like the fire escapes we have here in America). He broke one pane of an attic window so he could unlatch it to get inside and get down. He did not bust through a skylight or break into a store to steal something. If he were a thieving bastard he would not have just been standing in the shop waiting for the police to come when the alarm went off. He would have tried to escape in some way. But all my husband wanted was to get down from the roof and onto street level, so he just waited there until the cops came and let him out of the shop.

When he was released because the charges were dropped, he voluntarily submitted to drug testing because he wanted to know what the hell had happened - if he'd been drugged or something like that. Unfortunately, the doctor collected his specimen in the wrong type of container, and when they tested it, the sample was unreadable. AND BEFORE YOU GO, "Oh sure. Yeah right," I have a copy of his medical record where the doctor specifically states that fact, and states that by the time they figured out what they'd done, it was too late (a few days later) to take another sample that would be useful.

I have never been more disgusted with this forum in my life. It's not as though I came on here and said, "My husband has an extensive criminal record, what can I do?" I asked for help because a screwed up situation that happened nearly 10 years ago to a man who has never been anything other than gentle, with no other criminal record whatsoever, is making us feel sick about whether or not we'll ever get to be together in America.

It's good to know that if some poor girl posted on here (because she was worried sick this incident might keep her and her husband apart) that she'd been done for prostitution because she'd woken up and found herself half-naked and beaten up in an alley, and couldn't explain how she'd gotten there, lovely gentlemen like Ray, here, would say, "In London we had a different view. We called them filthy w&*res." Ray, you are a shining example of why I got the hell out of London as quickly as I could. People like you disgust me.

Luckily, there are people on this forum (like meauxna) who are here to be nice, supportive, and helpful, not rude, sarcastic, and judgemental. Thank you, Ray, for turning this forum into a place where people can come to get help to a place where people can come to get unfairly judged and ridiculed by small-minded idiots like yourself. Can't say I'm surprised you're a Londoner. I'll add you to my list of bad experiences with the people and the place.

Ray

UK police clearance certificate shows that back in 2000, when he was 19, he was charged with "Theft By Housebreaking"

I believe that version ....

Bluegrass Lass

If he didn't actually take anything though, is that really theft?

I don't the OP is lying or anything, he was just caught out in a really stupid bad situation. How many people have done stupid shit while drunk, that they don't remember, and still pay for it later?

Marcsred, go over to the USA Visa section and have a read over the thread by Fong about CIMT (crimes invovling moral turpitude). That may give you an idea of if the crime would be a CIMT. However, I would still highly suggest that you consult with a Scot lawyer about the situation. They may know of other ways & means of obtaining info about his record, or who knows.

No one here is expert enough to even remotely give you a straight-forward answer.

Songbird

Regardless of what it says on the arrest sheet - it wasn't considered serious enough to prosecute on a theft charge, hence the judge was happy to dismiss that and just proceed on the broken window compensation - sounds fair enough to me Not that it really matter what I ( or anyone else) thinks, the OP has no reason to offer ANY explanation at all to us. We are not here to judge merely to provide what ( if any) help / advice we can give regarding the issue at hand. I myself have criminal convictions ( and NO i'm not telling! ) That part of my life was done and dusted a LONG time ago - a view that USCIS took as well

As far as getting the info required to satisfy USCIS then I would agree that because the incident happened in Scotland ( which does have a different judicial process from England - which has been my only experience) then there is very little I can add to the advice already offered - namely a quick sit down with a Scottish lawyer ( or a lawyer familiar with the Scottish process) and take it from there.

Folinskyinla

Hi:

Sigh. I often have a conversation with clients with somewhat of a checkered past which I'm going to repeat here.

I understand the urge to explain what "really happened." However, at this stage of the game, your description does not help all that much. And stating you made a "summary" elicited a slightly bemused chuckle because it was too detailed and contained information which is highly "irrelevant" at this time.

To be concise, I view your description as follows: Your husband deliberately broke a window. The alarm went off. The police arrived and took you husband into custody. Charges were filed for "theft by housebreaking" and a judicial resolution took place.

At this point -- one will need to know Scot law on this. What legal section was he charged with? What are the specific elements of the crime? One will need a copy of the statue in question. What was the actual outcome -- was he actually "convicted." Look, John Lennon was convicted of possession of hashish under British law. The former INS wanted to deny his application for a green card based upon that "drug offense." However, at the time, British law did not require any intent whatsoever to be found guilty of possession -- even if you had no idea the stuff was there, you were guilty. It was on this little thing that John Lennon won and got his green card.

From your initial description, it may very well be that the charges were dismissed with no conviction because there was some type of what California calls a "civil compromise" -- in fact, this is common in most parts of the world.

You don't know what you really have here. Leave the ad hominem attacks aside for now -- they just get in the way.

It is yet to be "black and white" -- that is why I suggested the Scot solicitor.

marcsred

Thank you all so much for the super helpful replies. I'm so glad my and my husband's pain can cause so much amusement. In all the time I've been a part of this forum I've never experienced anything like this. Someone asks for help or advice and many of you just use it as an opportunity for a good laugh.

For the last 3 years my husband and I have spent about 9 months of every year apart. For some reason Ian says our application is taking longer than normal, which already sucks, but this latest thing is just heartbreaking.

Thinking that our whole future and the life we've planned in America could be jeopardized is absolutely devastating. But hey, if you can get a potty joke out of it and not offer any advice or encouraging words, why not? It's only the rest of our lives I'm inquiring about. Nothing serious.

meauxna

Aww, sweetie, if you didn't laugh, you'd have to cry, and that won't get us anywhere. I know that there is no one here who is genuinely amused by your situation. And I know that people have different styles and all that. None of which helps you deal with what you're going through *right now*. Your case *has* had its share of difficulties and then some, and this springing up at the last IS hard.
I really do wish there was some magic answer to offer you. Please pay the most attention to MrF's answers and pull what you need out of any others. I really think that Ray's post was more an effort to boil it down to the essentials.. as MrF said, the other info is important to you but to the people who make the decision, it's just trivia.

You've got no time and no energy for what is not helping you; spend both on what IS helping you. And remember that there are plenty of folk here who are encouraging you and wishing the best outcome for you.

Folinskyinla

Sigh. Please read what I wrote. I am not amused at the pain of your husband or yours. I am not amused about the length of time. All I was amused about was your use of the word "summary" for a longish fact description.

I could also say that your husband should have mentioned on day one and a lot of wasted time has now gone by in resolution of the problem. However, that is "water under the bridge" and "spilt milk" and need not be dwelled upon.

The fact is that you do have problem and it needs to be resolved. The problem may or may not be as bad as you think -- but I don't know. But I do see grounds for further investigation to see the proper path to take.

You are angry and frustrated. You think it is not fair. Those are legitimate emotions. Although legitimate, they are getting in the way of resolving the problem. I am quite sympathetic to your situation and I'm trying to be very practical and to the point.