Originally Posted by Jingsamichty

How am I meant to hear my wife say yes with that gag in her mouth and that tight leather hood on?

Originally Posted by Almost Canadian

The length of the relationship was mentioned simply to point out that, one assumes, those that have been together for some time are likely to act differently than those that have only just met.

I have to admit that I don't ask my wife if it is OK to kiss her when I leave for work each morning. According to the Supreme Court of Canada, if I do this, I am committing a sexual assault, just as I would be if I gave her a cuddle in the middle of the night while she is sleeping.



I am not suggesting it is difficult but I am suggesting that, in reality and in the vast majority of cases, such "question and answer" consent in a long term relationship does not occur. I suggest that one party will initiate something, the other party will either say words to the effect of "not now, I have a headache" or things move forward. That is not consent in accordance with Canadian law.

Clearly, if someone says "no" there can be no argument that there is no consent but, for example, the Canadian law appears to prevent any form of spontaneity at all and, in effect, requires a question and an answer.

Hollywood's spectacle of ripping clothes off, throwing up against walls is outlawed unless one says, "can I rip your clothes off" to wish the answer must be "yes", followed by, "can I throw you up against the wall" to which the answer must be "yes" and so on, and so on. Consent cannot be inferred from the other's apparent willingness to participate.

Edit: I see that others have made similar points which I hadn't read when I posted this.

Originally Posted by Shard

Is there some kind of reasonableness test which must be considered? How long has Canadian law suffered from this paranoia on physical contact?

Originally Posted by raindropsandroses

I do. My husband and I have been together (and happy!) for fifteen years and we both do, we ask before anything, even hugging. Its been the norm with previous partners too, ime.

I don't find it frustrating or interrupting, I find it increases trust and makes it so much more enjoyable.

Originally Posted by Siouxie

Each to their own, I suppose.

I would just find it very strange, in a long term relationship.

Originally Posted by bats

Originally Posted by sharkus

Once I'm in a relationship with someone, no, I don't tend to ask about kissing and hugging, and hand holding. I just do it

Originally Posted by raindropsandroses

You see for me personally this is when consent is perhaps even more important. Fifteen years down the road my husband still asks every time, and it means the world to me that he does, that he doesn't just feel that he has the right to do what he wants to my body just because we've been together for a while. His respect for me in that way means that he has my absolute trust, and vice versa.

Originally Posted by BritInParis

Originally Posted by raindropsandroses

You see for me personally this is when consent is perhaps even more important. Fifteen years down the road my husband still asks every time, and it means the world to me that he does, that he doesn't just feel that he has the right to do what he wants to my body just because we've been together for a while. His respect for me in that way means that he has my absolute trust, and vice versa.

I used to counsel for the equivalent of Rape Crisis in the country I lived in at the time. It was genuinely horrifying how many women and men telephoned for support as they felt that their partners were violating them. It was even more horrifying the number of those who thought that their partners would be distraught if they knew how they were making them feel. Despite that, they still couldn't/wouldn't talk to their partners about it as "its something they've always done and I liked it before but I don't now" or "I don't want to hurt their feelings, they think they're being romantic and spontaneous" or any other of the myriad of reasons. In many cases its just not as simple as saying no, or not tonight.

I don't ever want my husband to be in that position, the thought makes me feel sick, hence why we always ask.

Originally Posted by Shard

At this point in the thread, the title is more apposite than ever. Good grief.

Originally Posted by sharkus

Probably not intended that way, but sounds like there is a hint of a suggestion that I lack respect for my girlfriend. Certainly not true. I do respect my girlfriend, and trust her, and I know, unequivocally, that the same is true from her to myself. If she didn't want me to do something, be it a kiss, hug, or something more intimate, she would make it very clearly known, and I would refrain from continuing.

Out of curiosity, what would you do if your husband did hold your hand or give you a peck on the cheek without asking? Would you see it as a complete breakdown in trust and respect?

Originally Posted by GermanytoCanada

Brilliant



I'm curious, was this also the case at your wedding:

Vicar or equivalent - 'You may kiss the bride'
Husband - 'May I kiss you'?
You - 'Yes I consent'
Everyone else thinking 'Oh for f**** sake, just get on with it'!