Go Back  British Expats > Living & Moving Abroad > Canada > The Maple Leaf
Reload this Page >

UN Security Council Seat

UN Security Council Seat

Old Jun 18th 2020, 4:44 pm
  #1  
BE Forum Addict
Thread Starter
 
jimf's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2008
Location: Calgary
Posts: 3,340
jimf has a reputation beyond reputejimf has a reputation beyond reputejimf has a reputation beyond reputejimf has a reputation beyond reputejimf has a reputation beyond reputejimf has a reputation beyond reputejimf has a reputation beyond reputejimf has a reputation beyond reputejimf has a reputation beyond reputejimf has a reputation beyond reputejimf has a reputation beyond repute
Default UN Security Council Seat

Not so popular then...

https://www.macleans.ca/opinion/the-...s-at-the-back/
jimf is offline  
Old Jun 18th 2020, 5:09 pm
  #2  
Stand-up Philosopher
 
caretaker's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2009
Location: Regina and Oliver
Posts: 13,899
caretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: UN Security Council Seat

Originally Posted by jimf View Post
Not so popular then...
Trudeau or Paul Wells? I read the article, and all it really seemed to say was, "Hey, you shouldn't have expected to win the seat." I didn't, did you? Trudeau could eat babies on tv and still be more appealing than Harper, but his foreign policy is too much the same. Our laws protecting human rights lose us some votes from nations where same sex marriage is outlawed, and our alliance with the US loses the votes of those allied with the Russian Federation and China, and our support of Israel takes care of all the Arab votes, but even if it was an appointed temporary seat we probably wouldn't get it because of our stance on some UN resolutions. In 2014 the UN warned Israel that IDF soldiers might be committing war crimes in Gaza. Benjamin Netanyahu said he considered that they were just defending Israel. Barack Obama said he found the reports very concerning. Trudeau Harper said we support our ally Israel unconditionally. After Trudeau's election the next year he followed the same course of supporting Israel in the 2nd seige of Gaza. Why would they give us a seat on that council if we have no respect for their findings? Israel won't ratify membership in the ICC so IDF soldiers cannot be investigated in the Hague for war crimes. The USA won't ratify membership in the ICC so American soldiers can't be investigated in the Hague for war crimes. Canada has a full membership in the ICC so if the need arises, Canadian soldiers can be investigated in the Hague for war crimes. If we're going to take the high road we should demand the same of our allies.
Edit: Whoops, the election was in 2015, so Harper was the one; post edited to reflect proper villans.

Last edited by caretaker; Jun 18th 2020 at 5:21 pm.
caretaker is offline  
Old Jun 18th 2020, 5:13 pm
  #3  
L/R
 
Pulaski's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2001
Location: Dixie, ex UK
Posts: 49,497
Pulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: UN Security Council Seat

The Liberals now find that the boot is on the other foot, after they described the loss of the 2010 vote under the Conservatives, "an embarrassing failure".
Pulaski is offline  
Old Jun 18th 2020, 5:41 pm
  #4  
Forum Regular
 
Joined: Sep 2017
Location: Halifax, NS
Posts: 265
Tumbling_Dice has a reputation beyond reputeTumbling_Dice has a reputation beyond reputeTumbling_Dice has a reputation beyond reputeTumbling_Dice has a reputation beyond reputeTumbling_Dice has a reputation beyond reputeTumbling_Dice has a reputation beyond reputeTumbling_Dice has a reputation beyond reputeTumbling_Dice has a reputation beyond reputeTumbling_Dice has a reputation beyond reputeTumbling_Dice has a reputation beyond reputeTumbling_Dice has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: UN Security Council Seat

Slap it right into him. I would love to think we might see some humility, and perhaps some substance from him, but I won't hold my breath.
Tumbling_Dice is offline  
Old Jun 18th 2020, 5:44 pm
  #5  
BE Forum Addict
 
Hurlabrick's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2013
Location: London, ON
Posts: 2,413
Hurlabrick has a reputation beyond reputeHurlabrick has a reputation beyond reputeHurlabrick has a reputation beyond reputeHurlabrick has a reputation beyond reputeHurlabrick has a reputation beyond reputeHurlabrick has a reputation beyond reputeHurlabrick has a reputation beyond reputeHurlabrick has a reputation beyond reputeHurlabrick has a reputation beyond reputeHurlabrick has a reputation beyond reputeHurlabrick has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: UN Security Council Seat

Honestly, who cares if we do or don't have a seat on the UN Security Council?

Feels more like a politicians vanity project than anything that will make any difference to Canadians. Not wanting to be insular here, but really?
Hurlabrick is offline  
Old Jun 18th 2020, 5:57 pm
  #6  
Lost in BE Cyberspace
 
Almost Canadian's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: South of Calgary
Posts: 13,043
Almost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: UN Security Council Seat

Originally Posted by caretaker View Post
Trudeau or Paul Wells? I read the article, and all it really seemed to say was, "Hey, you shouldn't have expected to win the seat." I didn't, did you? Trudeau could eat babies on tv and still be more appealing than Harper, but his foreign policy is too much the same. Our laws protecting human rights lose us some votes from nations where same sex marriage is outlawed, and our alliance with the US loses the votes of those allied with the Russian Federation and China, and our support of Israel takes care of all the Arab votes, but even if it was an appointed temporary seat we probably wouldn't get it because of our stance on some UN resolutions. In 2014 the UN warned Israel that IDF soldiers might be committing war crimes in Gaza. Benjamin Netanyahu said he considered that they were just defending Israel. Barack Obama said he found the reports very concerning. Trudeau Harper said we support our ally Israel unconditionally. After Trudeau's election the next year he followed the same course of supporting Israel in the 2nd seige of Gaza. Why would they give us a seat on that council if we have no respect for their findings? Israel won't ratify membership in the ICC so IDF soldiers cannot be investigated in the Hague for war crimes. The USA won't ratify membership in the ICC so American soldiers can't be investigated in the Hague for war crimes. Canada has a full membership in the ICC so if the need arises, Canadian soldiers can be investigated in the Hague for war crimes. If we're going to take the high road we should demand the same of our allies.
Edit: Whoops, the election was in 2015, so Harper was the one; post edited to reflect proper villans.
You'll have to explain to me why Norway's or Ireland's human rights laws are so different from Canada's.

Trudeau expended lots of capital into this and lost. He should accept that his criticism of Harper when he failed is just as applicable in this case too.
Almost Canadian is offline  
Old Jun 18th 2020, 6:04 pm
  #7  
Stand-up Philosopher
 
caretaker's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2009
Location: Regina and Oliver
Posts: 13,899
caretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond reputecaretaker has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: UN Security Council Seat

Originally Posted by Hurlabrick View Post
Honestly, who cares if we do or don't have a seat on the UN Security Council?
Feels more like a politicians vanity project than anything that will make any difference to Canadians. Not wanting to be insular here, but really?
It's a legit question. As you know (being a fellow Canadian) our history with the creation of the organisation, human rights declaration, peacekeeping etc has continued since inception, and that probably means more to the older generation. Because the main UNSC players have veto power the temporary seat is sort of ornamental, and Canada's commitment to UN projects continues regardless of whether we occupy it or not. Harper lost it for the first time in 60 years, Trudeau failed to win it back, but Canada still supports and works within the UN. I suspect that if and when the time comes when we regain that temporary seat, this may be a nicer country.
caretaker is offline  
Old Jun 19th 2020, 12:20 am
  #8  
BE Enthusiast
 
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 360
abner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: UN Security Council Seat

Originally Posted by caretaker View Post
Trudeau could eat babies on tv and still be more appealing than Harper...
Just about spat out my morning coffee, laughing at that one.

Not a huge fan of either, but a grudging admirer of the best moments of both.

But you've certainly pinpointed the difference between them!!
abner is offline  
Old Jun 19th 2020, 12:22 am
  #9  
BE Enthusiast
 
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 360
abner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond reputeabner has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: UN Security Council Seat

Originally Posted by Hurlabrick View Post
Honestly, who cares if we do or don't have a seat on the UN Security Council?

Feels more like a politicians vanity project than anything that will make any difference to Canadians. Not wanting to be insular here, but really?
+1
abner is offline  
Old Jun 19th 2020, 9:40 pm
  #10  
Magnificently Withering
 
Oakvillian's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Location: Oakville, ON
Posts: 6,770
Oakvillian has a reputation beyond reputeOakvillian has a reputation beyond reputeOakvillian has a reputation beyond reputeOakvillian has a reputation beyond reputeOakvillian has a reputation beyond reputeOakvillian has a reputation beyond reputeOakvillian has a reputation beyond reputeOakvillian has a reputation beyond reputeOakvillian has a reputation beyond reputeOakvillian has a reputation beyond reputeOakvillian has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: UN Security Council Seat

Originally Posted by Almost Canadian View Post
You'll have to explain to me why Norway's or Ireland's human rights laws are so different from Canada's.

Trudeau expended lots of capital into this and lost. He should accept that his criticism of Harper when he failed is just as applicable in this case too.
This. It is indeed an embarrassing failure for Trudeau. As Caretaker said, it was naive to have expected to win a seat, especially give the other candidates and the lack of a positive differentiator for Canada. Too close to Israel for the Arabs; too close to the US for China, not as hot on the peacekeeping missions these days as Ireland, not quite as progressive as Norway, not really much in the Canadian bid for people to vote for.

Plus, of course, both Ireland and Norway had been quietly campaigning for about the last 10 years, whereas Canada only announced its intention to seek a seat, what, 18 months ago? 2 years, maybe... not nearly enough time to curry favour with those whose influence must be won (I was going to say must be bought & paid for, but no, that's not the UN way, surely?!)

I don't anticipate that there'll be much blowback, though. Trudeau may have failed, here, but the Parliamentary opposition is woefully ineffective, even for a minority government, and I don't see that either Jagmeet Singh or Andrew Scheer (or whoever replaces him, although MacKay would IMO be more likely than that buffoon O'Toole to land a scoring punch) will be troubling the PMO to provide difficult answers.
Oakvillian is offline  
Old Jun 19th 2020, 9:49 pm
  #11  
Lost in BE Cyberspace
 
Almost Canadian's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: South of Calgary
Posts: 13,043
Almost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond reputeAlmost Canadian has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: UN Security Council Seat

Originally Posted by Oakvillian View Post
This. It is indeed an embarrassing failure for Trudeau. As Caretaker said, it was naive to have expected to win a seat, especially give the other candidates and the lack of a positive differentiator for Canada. Too close to Israel for the Arabs; too close to the US for China, not as hot on the peacekeeping missions these days as Ireland, not quite as progressive as Norway, not really much in the Canadian bid for people to vote for.

Plus, of course, both Ireland and Norway had been quietly campaigning for about the last 10 years, whereas Canada only announced its intention to seek a seat, what, 18 months ago? 2 years, maybe... not nearly enough time to curry favour with those whose influence must be won (I was going to say must be bought & paid for, but no, that's not the UN way, surely?!)

I don't anticipate that there'll be much blowback, though. Trudeau may have failed, here, but the Parliamentary opposition is woefully ineffective, even for a minority government, and I don't see that either Jagmeet Singh or Andrew Scheer (or whoever replaces him, although MacKay would IMO be more likely than that buffoon O'Toole to land a scoring punch) will be troubling the PMO to provide difficult answers.
I can't disagree with any of that. It will be interesting to see what happens when Parliament returns to proper sittings.
Almost Canadian is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.