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real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

Old Oct 20th 2021, 3:45 pm
  #751  
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Default Re: real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

Originally Posted by dbd33
I'm not going to look up your trendy terminology. If the suggestion is that successively younger cohorts have more dollars at a specific age than older ones did, that makes sense, inflation often makes that true. In absolute terms though, the younger you are, the poorer you are going to be. People who have houses now have a significant net worth tied to the increase in value in the houses. People starting out cannot buy houses and will forever subsidize the housing of specific earlier generations. Tax policies, especially in the US and the UK, exacerbate this effect by shifting the tax burden from amateur astronauts and their corporations to the people who create their wealth.

It's what Conservatives vote for but, my word, that's some stupid.
It's hard to guage, really. If you look at the standard of living of the younger generation, it does seem much higher than that of 30-40 years ago. Consumer goods are cheaper (especially electronics) and therefore homes are decorated to a higher standard, holidays are cheaper, cars might even be cheaper. The one thing that has gone up is property (admittedly the main component of personal wealth) but even there, necessity has meant that smaller properties (i.e.condos) have become more common, and they too become an asset.

Certainly agree on the flawed tax policy that permits (encourges) the uber wealthy to freeride all the way to the moon.


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Old Oct 20th 2021, 4:09 pm
  #752  
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Default Re: real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

As a general rule, people think that taxes should be higher for someone else. If you get 30K, then its the $70K people who are rich and should be taxed more. $70K ->$150K . $150K -> $300K. And so on.
In practice families on less than $70K (from memory) pay no net tax, are subsidized and the wealthiest pay the vast majority of taxes. We have progressive systems of taxation.
Suspect that flying to the moon isn't "free" and that a lot of well paid jobs depend on it. And certainly not funded by people who are not "wealthy".
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Old Oct 20th 2021, 4:31 pm
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Default Re: real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

Originally Posted by Mordko
Suspect that flying to the moon isn't "free" and that a lot of well paid jobs depend on it. And certainly not funded by people who are not "wealthy".
Does the phrase "the unacceptable face of capitalism" ring any bells for you? The people in question do not go to the moon, they go on junkets because they have more money than they know how to use. A good alternative use would be to pay some tax.
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Old Oct 20th 2021, 4:42 pm
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Default Re: real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

When you are in that position you will be able to pay voluntary tax. Which many super wealthy do, albeit often as charity. May need to bring people products they want to use to get there. Check out Elon Musk’s bio for specific examples. Until then stay healthy and don’t let the envy undermine your cardiovascular system.
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Old Oct 20th 2021, 4:59 pm
  #755  
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Default Re: real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

Originally Posted by Mordko
When you are in that position you will be able to pay voluntary tax. Which many super wealthy do, albeit often as charity. May need to bring people products they want to use to get there. Check out Elon Musk’s bio for specific examples. Until then stay healthy and don’t let the envy undermine your cardiovascular system.
Er, but I have made a small fortune by inventing and selling a product and I have had the opportunity for both tax avoidance and evasion. As noted above, I live as a country gent. None of that caused me to confuse taxation of individuals and corporations with charitable donations.
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Old Oct 20th 2021, 5:14 pm
  #756  
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Default Re: real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

Would you like me to point out which line to fill in for voluntary taxation?
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Old Oct 20th 2021, 5:26 pm
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Default Re: real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

Originally Posted by Mordko
Would you like me to point out which line to fill in for voluntary taxation?
I've no interest in voluntary taxation. My rule of thumb is 1/3 tax, 1/3 alimony, 1/3 spend. If everyone is mandated to pay the same proportions we're all good.
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Old Oct 20th 2021, 6:14 pm
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Default Re: real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

Awesome idea. And anyone who hasn’t been divorced and still looks after kids should pay double. That’ll teach ‘em.
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Old Oct 20th 2021, 6:18 pm
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Default Re: real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

…but I will vote for you as PM. Would very much appreciate the tax cut you are proposing.
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Old Oct 20th 2021, 6:28 pm
  #760  
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Default Re: real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

Originally Posted by Mordko
Awesome idea. And anyone who hasn’t been divorced and still looks after kids should pay double. That’ll teach ‘em.
"I don't think he's been divorced even once" said my boss, of an interview candidate, "he'll know nothing about life, let's get someone else".
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Old Oct 20th 2021, 6:51 pm
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Default Re: real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

Key to divorce is not to be the bread winner. at least in my experience with 1 divorce.

I can't only speak for myself, but I am certainly nowhere close to what my parents were earning at 42, my dad was bringing in about 72k a year at 42 which was year 2000 (I am 42 now) and I will never come close to 72k from a single income, but my mom made a bit less, they were divorced by this point in their life, she was making 65k-67k a year as a paramedic (she then got cancer in 2003 and couldn't do that job anymore, so she makes less now, comparable to what I generally earn.) but my dad is doing well in retirement, retired with a nice pension, still makes more than I would working full-time, so he got a pretty good deal with the school district, as did my step mom.

My dad started there in 1978 at $6/hr he says, which according to the US inflation calculator would be $24.24 in 2021, but the pay didn't keep with inflation they start now in the $15/$16/hr range nd top out pay is significantly less than my dads generation, so what my dad accomplished isn't even possible anymore, without a college education.

It is what it is, we just don't all have the ability to go to college and get high paid 100k/yr jobs.

So compared to my childhood, the only difference with stuff is we have a PC and cell phone, but my parents had a home phone, we don't, so really the only difference is the PC and internet, they had 2 cars and could take 2 vacations a year, so eh I would rather go back to a no-internet era, have 2 cars, a house, and 2 vacation a year rather than no house, 1 car, and no vacations most years, and vacation for us, is flying to see my parents for 5 days, we can't actually go anywhere like Hawaii, or Mexico, or Disneyland, so maybe more of family visitation rather than vacations.


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Old Oct 20th 2021, 9:58 pm
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Default Re: real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

Originally Posted by Mordko
1. Average GenX age is 48 year old.
2. You have to pay for the Economist. https://subscribenow.economist.com/ They'll give you access to back issues as well. I can find out which issue but it will take a bit of time to scroll through recent magazines so let me know if you need me to do that. Guessing it was around September 15th.

Unfortunately I am not aware of any studies focusing on Thatcher refugees, professional whiners and common cold survivors. Suspect it's a conservative-lead conspiracy to cover up the data.
Is this a trailer for the piece in question: https://www.economist.com/leaders/20...-and-held-back ? If so it depends on a conceit, it includes the whole population of the world. I accept that the children of Bob and Marcia are likely richer than Bob and Marcia were but our focus is Canada and the west in general; the relative affluence of the population of China or, indeed Jamaica, is of little relevance.
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Old Oct 20th 2021, 10:15 pm
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Default Re: real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

This is for the US millenials, but I really doubt there is a huge difference between Canadian and US millenials...

Millenials are indeed richer in that they make more than any previous generation, but they are not as wealthy.

"millennial households at age 40 — the oldest of the generation — are earning $85,000. That's more than Gen X earned at that age, $77,000, as well as boomers, who earned $70,000."

"millennials still hold less wealth than previous generations did at their age. When boomers were roughly the same age as millennials are now, they owned about 21% of America's wealth, compared to millennials' 5% share today,"

Wages in the US are up 19% in the US since 2006 however factor in our little friend named inflation, real wages have actually declined by 8.8% in that time frame.

Millenials are catching up slowly, but they are still pretty far behind boomers at the same age wealth wise.

https://www.businessinsider.com/mill...boomers-2021-9


Maybe Canada is super unique and millenials here are loaded with wealth, but it doesn't seem that way.



Now Gen X in the US is seeing a decent gain in wealth during the pandemic, but could be older Gen X having early boomer parents dying and leaving their wealth....who knows.




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Old Oct 20th 2021, 10:31 pm
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Default Re: real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

Originally Posted by Jsmth321
This is for the US millenials, but I really doubt there is a huge difference between Canadian and US millenials...

Millenials are indeed richer in that they make more than any previous generation, but they are not as wealthy.

"millennial households at age 40 — the oldest of the generation — are earning $85,000. That's more than Gen X earned at that age, $77,000, as well as boomers, who earned $70,000."

"millennials still hold less wealth than previous generations did at their age. When boomers were roughly the same age as millennials are now, they owned about 21% of America's wealth, compared to millennials' 5% share today,"

Wages in the US are up 19% in the US since 2006 however factor in our little friend named inflation, real wages have actually declined by 8.8% in that time frame.

Millenials are catching up slowly, but they are still pretty far behind boomers at the same age wealth wise.

https://www.businessinsider.com/mill...boomers-2021-9


Maybe Canada is super unique and millenials here are loaded with wealth, but it doesn't seem that way.
The current middle-class capitalistic/economic environment in the US and Canada has only really existed for around 1-2 generations, and we're already seeing the problem. People who got ahead 50-80 years ago pass on the wealth to their kids, causing wider and wider wealth disparity as time goes. It's a fundamentally flawed system, though it's made worse by low interest rates and high asset prices.

Last edited by CanadaJimmy; Oct 20th 2021 at 10:35 pm.
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Old Oct 20th 2021, 11:23 pm
  #765  
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Default Re: real estate prices in Canada sustainable?

Originally Posted by CanadaJimmy
The current middle-class capitalistic/economic environment in the US and Canada has only really existed for around 1-2 generations, and we're already seeing the problem. People who got ahead 50-80 years ago pass on the wealth to their kids, causing wider and wider wealth disparity as time goes. It's a fundamentally flawed system, though it's made worse by low interest rates and high asset prices.
Yes, we missed the point by going off on the tangent of how much people are worth at a certain age in differing generations. The problem, if one thinks it a problem, is that young people now will not be able to afford the lifestyle of their parents as we, the parents, cannot afford the lifestyle of our parents. A policy of high house values combined with one of placing the tax burden on the poor, to the benefit of the rich and corporations, is at the root of this.

Again, I'm perplexed by the conservative voters, policies aimed at improving the situation of the 1% should have 1% support. Instead we have Johnson and had Trump.
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