Gender equality

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Feb 1st 2017, 1:17 am

#151

BristolUK

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Re: Gender equality

I was in the Boys Brigade for a short time.

Looking it up now, it all seems a bit Hitler Youth.

Feb 1st 2017, 1:22 am

#152

Teaandtoday5

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Re: Gender equality

Quote:

Originally Posted by BristolUK

I was in the Boys Brigade for a short time.

Looking it up now, it all seems a bit Hitler Youth.

Middle child was in BB before we came here. He enjoyed it, and they had good leaders. Switched to Scouts in Canada, which was also good, but no drills. He is still a MedVent, which is very well run by the York region paramedics.

Feb 1st 2017, 1:32 am

#153

dbd33

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Joined: Mar 2005

Location: Ontario

Posts: 40,018

Re: Gender equality

Quote:

Originally Posted by moneypenny20

Both daughters did Brownies, first one loved it, second one hated it. Time came for first one to go to Guides, did one session and said never again. Got her into Scouts and she had a ball. Second one doesn't do organised anything if she can help it. Guides is no where near as fun as Scouts, can't imagine why a boy would want to join them.

I blame the Scouts for interfering with my daughter's ideas of their station in life. One sailed all over the world, met a chap in the Detroit bus station, moved to Alaska with him, stayed up there a couple of years then missed getting educated so went to law school. The other one that was in the Scouts emigrated from Toronto to London then spent a year working in Africa, one in Iraq and is now back in Africa again, she learned Italian along the way as that's the language of her employer. But for all that gender equaled nonsense of camping in February and building bridges from poles and ropes they'd be quietly married in Oakville by now, free of all that gung ho spirit and they'd know what an iron is. Being in them gender neutered Scouts, it's a wonder they didn't end up as lesbyterians.

Feb 1st 2017, 1:50 am

#154

bats

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Joined: Jul 2012

Posts: 9,982

Re: Gender equality

Quote:

Originally Posted by BristolUK

I was in the Boys Brigade for a short time.

Looking it up now, it all seems a bit Hitler Youth.

I was in the Girls Brigade. I didn't mind the churchy bit as there were no dead men on crosses and the priests didn't wear dresses. The activity bit after church was fun, plenty of painting and craft work. Oh and I learned of the evils of alcohol.

I tried the Brownies just going once and hating it. I hid behind an upright piano while they danced round a toadstool singing silly songs. Really cringe making, stuff. My brother and his friends had much more fun in the Cubs.

Feb 1st 2017, 3:28 am

#155

Siouxie

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Joined: Apr 2009

Location: SW Ontario

Posts: 19,879

Re: Gender equality

I was in the brownies, I cut a cake with Lady Baden Powell (wish I still had the press cutting).

My son was in Woodcraft Folk, equality ruled.

Feb 1st 2017, 10:44 am

#156

morpeth

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Joined: Jul 2016

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Re: Gender equality

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oakvillian

I know there are several other replies to this, but I think it's worth rehearsing the same old, tired, arguments about Scouts once more.

There are significant differences between the Scouts organization in the USA and Scouts organizations practically everywhere else in the world. Some of these differences, no doubt, are due to the Boy Scouts of America having been colonised by the religious right-wing several years ago. Far from the inclusiveness and welcoming mantra that pervades Scouting in the rest of the world, the US organization has been very slow to include girls, LGBT youth, and now transgender youth. They still don't admit girls, but have been forced by a court ruling to change their policy so as to allow transgender boys to become members. And it was a very grudging decision a couple of years ago (which actually led to a breakaway of a more intolerant group of Southern Baptists) to allow gay youth to join.

Boy Scouts of America, in contrast to the Scouts organizations in most other countries including Canada, the UK and Australia, is exclusively open to boys in the youth programmes (although women may become adult volunteers). It is also not open to "agnostic or atheist" members, again unlike the organization elsewhere in the world, where the references to "God" in the Law and Promise have been much more liberally interpreted for the last 20 years or so.

I am a volunteer with Scouts Canada, and my children have been or are youth members of the organization. If I lived in the USA, I do not think I would be so keen to be associated with a movement that promulgated such out-of-date and, frankly, bigoted world-views amongst its youth membership.

Every one entitled to their own opinion which organization they wish to join, but courts interfering with a private organization membership policies is not right.

Feb 1st 2017, 12:02 pm

#157

dbd33

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Joined: Mar 2005

Location: Ontario

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Re: Gender equality

Quote:

Originally Posted by morpeth

Every one entitled to their own opinion which organization they wish to join, but courts interfering with a private organization membership policies is not right.

I don't think private organizations should be allowed to have membership policies at odds with the law as it would apply to, for example, a pub. It is, for example, ridiculous to exclude women from games, such as golf and darts, that are not played using the penis.

I understand the desire to have women only swimming pools in order to accommodate superstitions about men and suggest that some arrangement of scheduled single-sex use would serve as well as a total gender based ban.

I can't see any case for allowing race based club membership restrictions though I personally would not rush to join, for example, the Ukrainian Club.

Feb 1st 2017, 12:49 pm

#158

Oakvillian

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Re: Gender equality

Quote:

Originally Posted by morpeth

Every one entitled to their own opinion which organization they wish to join, but courts interfering with a private organization membership policies is not right.

Look at what you've written, carefully. "Every one entitled to their own opinion which organization they wish to join," you say. Exactly, I reply. How dare the Boy Scouts of America overrule that individual's opinion if they decide they want to join the organization? What kind of message is that sending to children? Not all of your friends are created equal... some are better than others and only the best sort can come and join us here?

I'm glad you agree with me on that - even if, as I suspect, you didn't mean to.

As for the courts' right to interfere in restrictive membership policies: that is exactly what the courts are there for; that is precisely their role if a club has membership restrictions that contravene laws.