From fires to floods

Old Nov 17th 2021, 4:48 am
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Default Re: From fires to floods

Originally Posted by Jerseygirl View Post
I have lost count the number of similar pics I have seen over the last 20 months, in Canada, the UK, US and goodness knows how many other countries. It is mostly scare mongering. We can get by very well, even if we have to go without a few things.
Oh dear... having to live (however temporarily) in a situation such as that surely deserves a degree of empathy or understanding? Living in Toronto, you won't be having similar problems. It's nothing to do with panic buying.

The 'many pictures worldwide' were about shortages caused by Covid panic buying - not due to flooding and mudslides in BC causing issues with supply, because towns/people are cut off... who knows for how long. 2 totally different scenarios.
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Old Nov 17th 2021, 4:52 am
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Default Re: From fires to floods

Originally Posted by scilly View Post
But some of us can remember trying to get food during and after the war.

No eggs .......... use powdered eggs

No milk .......... use powdered milk. Or use condensed milk as my grandparents did. I think my grandmother used to water it down for cooking, grandfather had it "neat" in his tea.

little meat ........... rationed to ca 4 oz for a family a week.

no veggies because there was only local, and it was winter. Eat canned


OH and I still live very much by what our parents taught us about survival in the depression and our memories of life in the 40s and 50s war-torn Britain.

I'm most certainly not denying that life is very hard for people on various pensions, whether that be disabled or seniors.

But the problem is that there are so few of us left who were taught how to eat when there were no supplies in the shops, and we have all become used to plenty of food available all year round and a great supply system.
Irrelevant!
Totally different scenario to those being experienced by people in Chilliwack and other towns that are cut off due to flooding.
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Old Nov 17th 2021, 4:57 am
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Default Re: From fires to floods

Originally Posted by Siouxie View Post
Oh dear... having to live (however temporarily) in a situation such as that surely deserves a degree of empathy or understanding? Living in Toronto, you won't be having similar problems. It's nothing to do with panic buying.

The 'many pictures worldwide' were about shortages caused by Covid panic buying - not due to flooding and mudslides in BC causing issues with supply, because towns/people are cut off... who knows for how long. 2 totally different scenarios.
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The picture posted was in Chilliwack was it not…post # 35?
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Old Nov 17th 2021, 5:04 am
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Default Re: From fires to floods

Originally Posted by Jsmth321 View Post
Could BC handle natural disaster better?

CBC article.

Chilliwack Super Store sometime today.

Originally Posted by Jerseygirl View Post
I have lost count the number of similar pics I have seen over the last 20 months, in Canada, the UK, US and goodness knows how many other countries. It is mostly scare mongering. We can get by very well, even if we have to go without a few things.
Originally Posted by Jerseygirl View Post
The picture posted was in Chilliwack was it not…post # 35?
It was indeed - but your comment to that picture was that you had lost count of the number of similar pics... in Canada, the UK.. US etc... (see quote above) - I was quoting what you said in my response..
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Old Nov 17th 2021, 5:09 am
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Default Re: From fires to floods

Originally Posted by Siouxie View Post
It was indeed - but your comment to that picture was that you had lost count of the number of similar pics... in Canada, the UK.. US etc... see quote above.

The supermarket shelves are empty, in that pic and other pics for whatever reason…for what most probably is a short while…but reposting them creates a false impression. My point is…there is no need to panic…as humans we can make do for a few days/weeks.
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Old Nov 17th 2021, 5:19 am
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Default Re: From fires to floods

Something to keep in mind this is the 3rd widespread natural disater we have had in BC since end of June, Vancouver was lucky the tornado a week or 2 back was small and didn't venture far into land.

These are for most people living today, once in their lifetime natural disasters.

BC has seen 5 atmospheric rivers since September.

And Abbotsford where the highway 1 is currently under a small lake, things are only getting worse for them.

In a release issued at 7:25 p.m. PT, city officials says conditions have deteriorated significantly in the past hour because of the imminent failure of the Barrowtown Pump Station. The station is the only thing keeping excess water flow from the Fraser River from entering the flooded area.

Sunday just 1 day Abbotsford 100.4 mm of rain, Aggasiz 127.3 mm, Hope 174mm, this was just 1 day totals, and it rained for days, rainfall in September was upwards of 300% over average, October was 200% to 240% above average.

Princeton, BC natural gas pipe broken, no potable water, people without heat, expecting -9 overnight, minus 9 degrees overnight.

Over 1,000 people stranded in Hope, BC sleeping in the local school gym with no way to get home, province is working to chopper in some food and water, but the town is running out of bottled water, gas, and food. (its a small town with limited resources)












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Old Nov 17th 2021, 5:27 am
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Default Re: From fires to floods

Originally Posted by Jerseygirl View Post
The supermarket shelves are empty, in that pic and other pics for whatever reason…for what most probably is a short while…but reposting them creates a false impression. My point is…there is no need to panic…as humans we can make do for a few days/weeks.
My point is, unless someone is personally experiencing having their town cut off due to floods and landslides, with no expectation as to when roads / rail might be open again - are they in any position to judge?

Not everyone has the funds to keep a supply of food in to last a few days / weeks to feed their family. Many people have to live from day to day so are perhaps trying to buy enough food or basic supplies when they have money to do so.

You assume the reason for the empty shelves is due to panic buying.. and possibly a few people have done so, but more likely the majority are just buying sufficient food to feed their family for a few days - and there are no stockpiles to restock the shelves, because there are no deliveries! There are no indications when roads might be open again and all the stores in Chilliwack say they don't know when they will be getting new supplies in as the roads are flooded... a concern for anyone with children.

The newspaper printed the photo of the empty shelf - it's not random people posting pictures on social media, creating a so called 'panic'... they were just reporting the facts.

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Old Nov 17th 2021, 6:16 am
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Default Re: From fires to floods

I suspect there will be a milk shortage in the near future, from the BC Milk Board website.

Dairy farms are being instructed to dump their milk into manure patch aligned with their normal pick up schedule until further notice.

Dairy Farms in Abbotsford and Chilliwack east of Sumas, Way (which most are) Milk will not be picked up until further notice.
Producers in Agassiz East of the mudslide at ‘Mountain Water Harrison Way, will not be picked up until further notice.
All producers in the BC Interior will not be picked up until further notice due to all roads to Lower Mainland being closed, and limited access to Alberta market.
Producers in Prince George/Bulkley Valley/Smithers will not be picked up until further notice due to no roads to the Lower Mainland.
Producers in the Creston/Kootenays will continue pickup as they have access to the Alberta market.

I can't find anything on the BC Eggs website about if they are still picking up eggs, presumably they are not in Abbotsford or Chilliwack, but maybe elsewhere they are.




I have seen powdered milk in stores, but I have never seen powdered eggs in any grocery store, I know they exist because we used them in hotels for the scrambled eggs at the free buffet, but I have never seen them at the consumer retail level in the run of mill grocery stores.

I have checked Save On, Super Store & Wal-Mart websites for powdered eggs and none seem to sell them according to lack of said item on their websites.

The butter seems to make 204 servings, they calling a serving 1 tablespoon approx prepared, so I guess about 49 cents per serving. I don't buy butter really, so I have no idea if this is a good value or not for butter but powder form.

$99.99 will get you 2lb of butter powder on Amazon though, something I never seen in stores either.







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Old Nov 17th 2021, 6:59 am
  #54  
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Default Re: From fires to floods

I’ve seen some climate deniers bring up the 1948 flood as evidence that this is “normal”, ignoring the fact it took over 60 years to happen again AND even that terrible flood was nowhere near the scope we’ve seen this time. That flood limited to the fraser valley, not the whole of south-western BC like this.

I bet the people looking forward to “California north” aren’t so happy now. Messing with the climate is more than just turning up the thermostat.
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Old Nov 17th 2021, 7:12 am
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Default Re: From fires to floods

Found the map of the mandatory evacuation in Sumas area of Abby, the city posted it at 7:30pm Pacific Time as the pumps holding back the Fraser River were expected to fail.

This is what the city of Abbotsford said in the notice on Twitter this image is from.

"This event is anticipated to be catastrophic. Residents remaining and can’t evacuate safely are requested to call 911 and report their location immediately."

Parts of Abbotsford have lost water service due to a water main breach, only effects the Sumas area of Abbotsford at this time.

City of Abbotsford is asking federal and provincial government for help, search and rescue resources from elsewhere in the province are headed to Abbotsford, they will attempt to build a sandbag wall around the pump station to buy time, and will attempt to use a helicopter to bring in additional pumps, if not able to tonight they will try again tomorrow, primarily a water rescue situation, and farmers are being asked to leave their livestock at this point the situation is too dangerous for humans to remain in the area, 9-11 system receiving heavy call volume.




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Old Nov 17th 2021, 7:15 am
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Default Re: From fires to floods

Good article from the Guardian that points the finger at poor forestry practices

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...itish-columbia
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Old Nov 17th 2021, 7:36 am
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Default Re: From fires to floods

It's the 2nd busiest pump station on the continent, and this is what the 2016 article quotes the person in charge at the time “If we were to turn off these pumps, the lake would resume all the way past Whatcom Road,” says Tim Henry, the city’s director of utility operations."


Anyone interested this is an article from 2016 about the pump station that is close to failing.



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Old Nov 17th 2021, 7:49 am
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Default Re: From fires to floods

Yesterday a Sumas dairy farmer told a reporter he and his neighbours had been sending their cows to safety, but that there were simply not enough cattle trailers available to meet the demand. Something I hadn't considered is in a link above; most if not all the feed will have been destroyed, so that's going to have to come in after roads and rails are open. I could be wrong, but I think dairy cows can probably be kept alive on whatever the "foster farms" can provide (they'd still need to be milked) but before going back into major production they need hi-grade feed. Most of the chickens in the flooded areas could be goners, but it's easier to replace chickens than cattle. It will take some time but chicken and egg producers in other areas can expand and ramp up production, and milk can probably be imported from the US to help ease shortages.
The other item about the pumping station being close to failure is kind of a cliff-hanger. If it goes, it means more damage and longer recovery.
In the short term, airlifting food and water to cut-off communities shouldn't be any problem. If necessary they can be supplied from both east and west.

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Old Nov 17th 2021, 8:11 am
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Default Re: From fires to floods

Originally Posted by caretaker View Post
Yesterday a Sumas dairy farmer told a reporter he and his neighbours had been sending their cows to safety, but that there were simply not enough cattle trailers available to meet the demand. Something I hadn't considered is in a link above; most if not all the feed will have been destroyed, so that's going to have to come in after roads and rails are open. I could be wrong, but I think dairy cows can probably be kept alive on whatever the "foster farms" can provide (they'd still need to be milked) but before going back into major production they need hi-grade feed. Most of the chickens in the flooded areas could be goners, but it's easier to replace chickens than cattle. It will take some time but chicken and egg producers in other areas can expand and ramp up production, and milk can probably be imported from the US to help ease shortages.
The other item about the pumping station being close to failure is kind of a cliff-hanger. If it goes, it means more damage and longer recovery.
Someone I used to work with whose family owns a dairy farm in that area had posted they had to leave their cows behind, they couldn't find trailers and trucks available, just simply is no way to move that many animals, looking at the photos of the chicken barns, those chickens are gone, the water in some areas is above the air vents so they are most certainly done for, pigs and cows can be set loose to find higher ground, it appeared on one photo there was a group of pigs swimming so hopefully any animal that can be set loose has been to increase their chance of survival.

I don't know if this is true, but is going around that if the pumps fail, the water would rise by 8-10 feet from its current level.

Hwy 7 west of Aggasiz has been cleared enough to open a lane to get emergency vehicles through.

Looks like Hwy 7 and Hwy 3 will be priority to reopen as they sustained the least amount of damage but not ETA of when for Hwy 3 at this point in time on BC Highway updates. The Coq has 5 confirmed washouts, and Hwy 1 is a mess up and down the canyon.












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Old Nov 17th 2021, 4:36 pm
  #60  
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Default Re: From fires to floods

Originally Posted by dbd33 View Post
OMG! My Mum said that used to happen during the war.
I don't know how the kids survived in those deep underground bunkers with no internet connection. They must have been playing games in offline mode.
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