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-   -   Coronavirus (https://britishexpats.com/forum/maple-leaf-98/coronavirus-930602/)

Zoe Bell Feb 26th 2020 12:24 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 
Well I'm off to check into my hotel and organize the move in ( and be a part of the human races ultimate doom)
have fun folks

Jerseygirl Feb 26th 2020 12:27 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by Zoe Bell (Post 12812204)
Well I'm off to check into my hotel and organize the move in ( and be a part of the human races ultimate doom)
have fun folks

stay safe Zoe. Good luck.

Pulaski Feb 26th 2020 12:45 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by bats (Post 12812054)
SARS-CoV-2 is the virus not the disease.
They aren't the same disease.

As per BiP, one "disease" can have multiple different causes. For example, meningitis has both bacterial and viral causes, as does pneumonia, and there are several different strains of the bacteria that causes tuberculosis, some of which cause symptomless infections - in other words you will have lung nodules visible in an X-ray and have a positive Mantout skin test but have never apparently suffered from tuberculosis,

tumbleweedly Feb 26th 2020 1:59 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 
Covid 19 is the name of the disease. Severe Acute Respitory Syndrome is what you get from it hence the name of the little buggers is SARS -Cov-2 because they cause the SARS. It is a respiratory disease not the flu.
This a new coronavirus, and is the second (hence the number 2 after its name) of the SARS coronavirus's.

This is nothing like a regular flu bug, or even a "bad flu".

NOtice that Italy had 3 cases last Friday, today it has around 350 cases and 11 people dead.
That is a lot of people dead quite quickly.

I am a little bit more jumpy these days than you all over in Canada because I live in France which is just too close to North Italy ATM.


BritInParis Feb 26th 2020 4:10 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 
The average number of deaths from winter flu in the UK alone is 800 per annum. The outbreak is great for 24 hour rolling news but doesn’t mean much in the grand scheme of things.

bats Feb 26th 2020 4:43 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by BritInParis (Post 12812142)
It’s the same disease caused by different strains of the same virus - SARS-CoV in 2003 and SARS-CoV-2 in 2019/2020, hence the nomenclature.


Originally Posted by Pulaski (Post 12812215)
As per BiP, one "disease" can have multiple different causes. For example, meningitis has both bacterial and viral causes, as does pneumonia, and there are several different strains of the bacteria that causes tuberculosis, some of which cause symptomless infections - in other words you will have lung nodules visible in an X-ray and have a positive Mantout skin test but have never apparently suffered from tuberculosis,

https://mcusercontent.com/cdd7cfdd3d...5e8dc30ae5.jpg

if it were the same disease it would have the same name

Meningitis and pneumonia are medical terms describing conditions not names of diseases.

Pulaski Feb 26th 2020 4:47 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by bats (Post 12812373)
.... Meningitis and pneumonia are medical terms describing conditions ....

As, funnily enough, is SARS (Severe acute respiratory syndrome) - it's even in plain English, not a fancy Latin word. :)

BristolUK Feb 26th 2020 5:40 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by tumbleweedly (Post 12812264)
This is nothing like a regular flu bug, or even a "bad flu".

NOtice that Italy had 3 cases last Friday, today it has around 350 cases and 11 people dead.
That is a lot of people dead quite quickly.

I am a little bit more jumpy these days than you all over in Canada because I live in France which is just too close to North Italy ATM.

Because Italy seems to have the focus in Europe at the moment I looked up flu figures for the country.
Flu outbreak in Italy: Half a million people struck down in a week

Almost three million cases of flu have been reported in Italy since the start of the winter season, and the number of confirmed cases is rising. Since the start of flu season in October 2019, 2,768,000 cases across the country have been confirmed by laboratory tests...A total of 488,000 cases were reported last week alone, signalling that flu season is hitting its peak in January as predicted. ...240 deaths have so far been reported, slightly lower than the expected 258. Most of the fatal cases are elderly patients who suffered complications after contracting the virus.

tumbleweedly Feb 26th 2020 6:45 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by BristolUK (Post 12812411)
Because Italy seems to have the focus in Europe at the moment I looked up flu figures for the country.
Flu outbreak in Italy: Half a million people struck down in a week


..... and so?

It doesn't change the fact that Covid 19 is a respiratory illness and it causes severe acute respiratory syndrome.
It seems evident, according to the WHO that the rate of infection is higher for Covid 19 than for the regular flu.
By the way, flu in europe this year is a beast and here in France regular flu virus was declared to be an epidemic two weeks ago.

BristolUK Feb 26th 2020 7:31 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by tumbleweedly (Post 12812445)
..... and so?

There isn't a so, what has been a general observation by others I just put some figures on to make it less general. :nod:

BEVS Feb 27th 2020 1:06 am

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by Zoe Bell (Post 12812204)
Well I'm off to check into my hotel and organize the move in ( and be a part of the human races ultimate doom)
have fun folks

Hope all goes well.


Originally Posted by tumbleweedly (Post 12812264)
Covid 19 is the name of the disease. Severe Acute Respitory Syndrome is what you get from it hence the name of the little buggers is SARS -Cov-2 because they cause the SARS. It is a respiratory disease not the flu.
This a new coronavirus, and is the second (hence the number 2 after its name) of the SARS coronavirus's.

Agree.


This is nothing like a regular flu bug, or even a "bad flu".

Notice that Italy had 3 cases last Friday, today it has around 350 cases and 11 people dead.
That is a lot of people dead quite quickly.

I am a little bit more jumpy these days than you all over in Canada because I live in France which is just too close to North Italy ATM.
I'm not surprised. You have the right and should be concerned.

I am in NZ and we have our quake safe emergency stocks and kits as a matter of course. They say it isn't here ...yet...but I rather think otherwise. I am being sensible my end and ensuring we have what we need . I've also cancelled our plans to travel to the UK in Sept. If things settle then we have plenty of time to think again. Meanwhile I shall not commit to the bug soup that is two long haul flights.

spouse of scouse Feb 27th 2020 6:27 am

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by BEVS (Post 12812605)

I've also cancelled our plans to travel to the UK in Sept. If things settle then we have plenty of time to think again. Meanwhile I shall not commit to the bug soup that is two long haul flights.

Sorry to hear you've had to cancel your plans Bevs, I know how much this trip meant to you. But as you say, you can do it a bit down the track. Everyone has to do what they feel is best/right for them.

Scouse and I have pretty much decided to go ahead with ours unless something drastic happens (airline cancels flights etc). The only change we're making is telling our family in the UK that we'll rent independent accommodation rather than stay with them. Hand sanitiser in my handbag will be my best friend, if the second best friend is good I'll let him use it too.

spouse of scouse Feb 27th 2020 6:36 am

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by dave_j (Post 12811766)
Perhaps we should simply stand back and let it run it's course, survivors would be immune and the population as a whole would be a little less vulnerable to the next similar outbreak.

The BBC reports today that a Japanese tour guide in Osaka was confirmed to have the virus in late January, and was discharged from hospital in February after recovering and testing negative. Some time later she developed a sore throat and chest pains and then tested positive again. The information was released by the Japanese government.

tumbleweedly Feb 27th 2020 1:00 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 
Morality rate for ordinary flu at a pandemic level is 1% die. It is much less for ordinary flu seasons.


Mortality rate as of 77,000 cases of Covid 19 is 2.3% die.

tumbleweedly Feb 27th 2020 1:05 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by BEVS (Post 12812605)
Hope all goes well.



Agree.



I'm not surprised. You have the right and should be concerned.

I am in NZ and we have our quake safe emergency stocks and kits as a matter of course. They say it isn't here ...yet...but I rather think otherwise. I am being sensible my end and ensuring we have what we need . I've also cancelled our plans to travel to the UK in Sept. If things settle then we have plenty of time to think again. Meanwhile I shall not commit to the bug soup that is two long haul flights.

We have TP, dry goods, canned goods for three months sustenance. How to know if that is going to carry us through or not though? I am hoping to know soon if it is going to slow down with sunnier weather and how quickly it devours France.

Jingsamichty Feb 27th 2020 1:27 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/british...eab9be4dd6.jpg

BristolUK Feb 27th 2020 1:29 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by tumbleweedly (Post 12812818)
Morality rate for ordinary flu at a pandemic level is 1% die. It is much less for ordinary flu seasons.


Mortality rate as of 77,000 cases of Covid 19 is 2.3% die.

Usefu stat, thanks. :thumbup:

Danny B Feb 27th 2020 3:12 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

tumbleweedly Feb 27th 2020 3:16 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by Jingsamichty (Post 12812830)

LOL! first laugh of my day. :D

tumbleweedly Feb 27th 2020 3:23 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by Danny B (Post 12812876)

We used something called Lemon Gin back at Uni and I survived the Hong Kong flu!
That was a real crusher, my roomates were all zonked for two weeks solid, a very strange experience that flu was.




dave_j Feb 27th 2020 4:27 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by spouse of scouse (Post 12812689)
The BBC reports today that a Japanese tour guide in Osaka was confirmed to have the virus in late January, and was discharged from hospital in February after recovering and testing negative. Some time later she developed a sore throat and chest pains and then tested positive again. The information was released by the Japanese government.

Interesting isn't it.
You have to query the ability of the body to protect itself, whether there's more than one strain present or simply just how accurate the test is (always assuming the samples weren't mixed up).
My guess is that the test at the moment isn't 100% accurate.
https://www.medicinenet.com/script/m...iclekey=228250


Danny B Feb 27th 2020 5:04 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 
Jesus, Italy suddenly went up to 4th place.

https://www.worldometers.info/corona...us-has-spread/

spouse of scouse Feb 27th 2020 5:20 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by dave_j (Post 12812901)
Interesting isn't it.
You have to query the ability of the body to protect itself, whether there's more than one strain present or simply just how accurate the test is (always assuming the samples weren't mixed up).
My guess is that the test at the moment isn't 100% accurate.
https://www.medicinenet.com/script/m...iclekey=228250

You could be right there Dave. Lots of unknowns about it at the moment.

tumbleweedly Feb 28th 2020 8:07 am

Re: Coronavirus
 
Grim news from the BBC last night:Councils are being asked about their plans to deal with pressures on public services if deaths from coronavirus are severe, including where they might locate new - perhaps mass - burial sites.

spouse of scouse Feb 28th 2020 10:47 am

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by tumbleweedly (Post 12813205)
Grim news from the BBC last night:Councils are being asked about their plans to deal with pressures on public services if deaths from coronavirus are severe, including where they might locate new - perhaps mass - burial sites.

This type of contingency planning's been done before though, I think it was last done in the UK in 2009 for the SARS outbreak.

tumbleweedly Feb 28th 2020 4:42 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by spouse of scouse (Post 12813236)
This type of contingency planning's been done before though, I think it was last done in the UK in 2009 for the SARS outbreak.

Thanks for the info. I had no idea things like this would be planned for except in wars or nuclear fallout.

Siouxie Feb 28th 2020 5:09 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 
ChinaXiv.org 中国科学院科技论文预发布平台

interesting

SARS-CoV-2 seems to possess enhanced infectivity and subtle different clinical features, which may hamper the early screening of suspected patients as well as the control of virus transmission.
We further confirm a putative furin-cleavage site reported recently in the spike protein of SARS-CoV-2, which may facilitate the virus-cell fusion. Based on these findings, we develop a novel approach that comprehensively analyzed the virus receptor expression, ACE2 shedding, membrane fusion activity, virus uptake and virus replication to evaluate the infectivity of SARS-CoV-2 to different human organs. Our results indicate that, in addition to airway epithelia, cardiac tissue and enteric canals are susceptible to SARS-CoV-2 as well.

scrubbedexpat091 Feb 28th 2020 6:06 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 
British Man on the cruise ship in Japan has died.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-51677846

If it becomes widespread in Canada no way hospitals here can handle it, Hospitals in a bad flu season can barely handle the uptake in patients.


US CDC revised its guidelines for testing, they had previously had strict testing guidelines and after the woman in California fell ill it took persistent doctors before CDC would test because she had no travel history or contact with anyone who had travel to China, and believed to be the first in US to get it without having gone anywhere known to be affected.

Also seems like a huge coincidence the area this woman lived is the same where they are quarantine some of the American's from China but she had no contact or travel, so seems that its possible workers on the base got infected, didn't know and took the virus off the base?





DaveLovesDee Feb 28th 2020 6:24 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

scrubbedexpat091 Feb 29th 2020 1:12 am

Re: Coronavirus
 
Something of a concern is if you ended up in self isolation and miss work and have no income coming in. Could cause issues for people.

https://globalnews.ca/news/6596383/c...8y_8jfViyx0Bx8




dave_j Feb 29th 2020 2:25 am

Re: Coronavirus
 
This virus outbreak will generate any number of inconvenient issues.
You have only to track the downward progress of the TSX or the DOW this week to realise that greater minds than ours are anticipating events.

Here's a fantasy to contemplate.

If you remember the 2008 financial crisis, it was created by the banks selling property to people who were patently unable to repay the loans and then repackaging and reselling them to the extent that nobody knew who owned what.
Imagine that a sizeable proportion of the population become ill, take time off, or simply stop spending and staying at home.
Companies run into liquidity problems, they lay off or sack workers, who then default on debts.
Imagine those in the US who get ill will purposely stay away from the health sector simply because they can't afford it, but need to work to pay bills. Who's to prevent contamination of the population at large?
Imagine a sizable number in the US become sick, are hospitalised and made bankrupt as a result, who owns their debts.
Imagine schools closing for a period, who'll look after the kids when you need to earn money to pay the bills?
Imagine you have this and a government run by an egotistical maniacal idiot and it's easy to understand market fears.
I strongly suspect that life could become very inconvenient, especially for those with debts.
Imagine the reaction drives economies into recession, house prices fall, nobody buys, owners default... we've been here before.
And.. What happens when society becomes stressed?
Those in charge assume strict population controls to protect society as a whole.
This elephant just south of the border better get it's act together quickly.
China's been able to do things unacceptable elsewhere.. but it could happen here.



scrubbedexpat091 Feb 29th 2020 2:53 am

Re: Coronavirus
 
Companies in the US are starting to cancel & reduce employee travel, and cancelling conferences so things like that will hit airlines and hotels, I don't expect great quarter 1 results this year, but we wont know until mid-late April since we have another month in the first quarter to go.

California appears to have its 2nd case of community spread, an older female in Santa Clara County who had not traveled anywhere or any known contact with someone known to have come into contact with the virus, so it does appear its spreading in California via the community although slow at the moment.

8,400 people in California being monitored for the virus, but the state only has 200 test kits at the moment, but are supposed to receive more.

Health officials in Santa Clara County where the 2nd community transmission case is, told local schools to prepare for students calling in sick, and explore options for tele-learning and enhance surface cleaning.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/02/28/coro...wn-origin.html



spouse of scouse Feb 29th 2020 3:01 am

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee (Post 12813418)

Please tell me that's satire, I can't bear to think it's actually true!

scrubbedexpat091 Feb 29th 2020 4:49 am

Re: Coronavirus
 
Possibly good in regards to treating pneumonia caused by this virus?

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/32074550/

That medication is also effective at killing certain marine parasites that affect marine aquarium fish, although difficult to obtain its one of the better treatment options for fish as its not as harsh as copper or formalin treatments.




spouse of scouse Feb 29th 2020 5:47 am

Re: Coronavirus
 
Waiting my turn at the checkout this morning, the checkout person had a running nose and watering eyes. In between scanning groceries he was bringing out the same hanky, wiping his nose, then rubbing the hanky all over his face, then putting the hanky back in his pocket before doing it all over again. I don't care if it's a common cold, the flu or the bubonic plague, you just don't do that! I moved to another checkout.

spouse of scouse Feb 29th 2020 6:20 am

Re: Coronavirus
 
For the travellers amongst us, this IATA site is updated with information about which countries have travel restrictions, what those restrictions are, and who they do and don't apply to.
https://www.iatatravelcentre.com/int...1580226297.htmbbbb

scrubbedexpat091 Feb 29th 2020 6:40 am

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by spouse of scouse (Post 12813591)
Waiting my turn at the checkout this morning, the checkout person had a running nose and watering eyes. In between scanning groceries he was bringing out the same hanky, wiping his nose, then rubbing the hanky all over his face, then putting the hanky back in his pocket before doing it all over again. I don't care if it's a common cold, the flu or the bubonic plague, you just don't do that! I moved to another checkout.

Icky.

In an ideal world people would just be allowed to stay home when sick, but that would require employers to not be poop heads.

spouse of scouse Feb 29th 2020 7:04 am

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by Jsmth321 (Post 12813605)
Icky.

In an ideal world people would just be allowed to stay home when sick, but that would require employers to not be poop heads.

Yes, he's probably a casual worker (most of the young ones are), and when you're casual no work equals no pay. They do get a higher rate than permanent employees that's supposed to make up for no sick leave or annual leave.

dave_j Feb 29th 2020 7:22 am

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by Jsmth321 (Post 12813605)
In an ideal world people would just be allowed to stay home when sick, but that would require employers to not be poop heads.

I agree, sometimes we need to be saved from ourselves, but we need help.
I remember as a student suffering with an awful cold I moved heaven and earth to get to work.
I needed to be told it was ok to go home, but of course this was the UK and I was paid.
As someone on a minmum wage with no sick pay I might just have ignored the advice.
I was fortunate, others don't have the choice.



scrubbedexpat091 Feb 29th 2020 7:36 am

Re: Coronavirus
 
I've never had paid sick days in Canada, and employers have generally not been good about missing work, and sick call policies not understanding that people sometimes get sick and then they wonder why everyone at work is sick..well we can't afford to miss work, so we come to work sick, and we also don't want to get written up so we come to work sick. I've had co-workers come in with fevers because they can't afford to miss work or they dont want to be written up for missing a couple days.

All the jobs I had in California had paid sick days, anywhere from 3 to 7 a year, when I first moved to Canada, I was surprised sick days were not the norm.


Originally Posted by dave_j (Post 12813609)
I agree, sometimes we need to be saved from ourselves, but we need help.
I remember as a student suffering with an awful cold I moved heaven and earth to get to work.
I needed to be told it was ok to go home, but of course this was the UK and I was paid.
As someone on a minmum wage with no sick pay I might just have ignored the advice.
I was fortunate, others don't have the choice.



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