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Almost Canadian Apr 30th 2020 11:59 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by dbd33 (Post 12846535)
I lasted eight minutes. Hitchens argued that people will get bored and go out so the lock down should be lifted before they do. I think he's wrong but, even if he's right, it's a prediction, not a plan, and he's not an immunologist so, ok, he thinks that but it has no more weight than what my dog thinks about it all.

At least the lockdown is good for the climate; no one's going out and drilling for gas or oil.

It's a series of discussions where they debate the merits of those jurisdictions that have imposed lockdowns versus those that haven't. In essence, there is little difference in mortality outcomes..

It appears to me that, if one isn't living in a nursing home, one has little to fear from this disease so why are we destroying people's financial lives?

I can't disagree with you comments regarding the environment and we can leave rhe debate as to how.we assist those in abusive relationships that are in lockdown to another time.

bc2015 May 1st 2020 12:19 am

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by Almost Canadian (Post 12846544)
It appears to me that, if one isn't living in a nursing home, one has little to fear from this disease so why are we destroying people's financial lives?

What nursing homes do show is that if you have a group of people in close proximity then the virus spreads rapidly. Of course in nursing homes the outcomes are not going to be as good as the general population (underlying conditions etc..) but the general point still stands. Most of us have no immunity from this virus and we will get infected if exposed and it is spread very easily. Just look at patient 31 in South Korea or the office floor where on one side of the floor, pretty much every employee was infected https://www.businessinsider.com/sout...g-chart-2020-4

A couple of my otherwise healthy friends got it and they were extremely ill for 2-3 weeks but have since recovered. But there are unanswered questions around the long term effect of being infected, considering how much it affects the lungs and can affect the kidneys/liver.

In BC anyway, I think the measures being taken are prudent and have been effective.


dbd33 May 1st 2020 12:26 am

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by Almost Canadian (Post 12846544)
so why are we destroying people's financial lives?
.

Due to a shared belief life is more important than money, even if it is someone else's life. It's a demonstration that there is such a thing as society.


(and yes, I see the warning coming)

Jsmth321 May 1st 2020 1:58 am

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by caretaker (Post 12846496)
Meat packing plants are full of cold, moist, circulating air, so are the perfect vector for transmitting the virus.

Yes good point.

BristolUK May 1st 2020 2:24 am

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by Almost Canadian (Post 12846524)
Should we rely upon the WHO who said there was no need to stop international travel

This came up on another thread. It was quite a bit more than no need to stop international travel.

Widespread travel bans not needed. A quote - no need for measures that “unnecessarily interfere with international travel and trade

Not the same thing at all.

spouse of scouse May 1st 2020 7:12 am

Re: Coronavirus
 
JS, I thought you might find this story interesting :)

When the garden eels at a Tokyo aquarium remove their heads from the sand, they are usually confronted by pairs of human eyes staring back at them through the glass.

But like other animals around the world, the eels at Sumida Aquarium are finding their environment transformed by the effects of the coronavirus outbreak.

They also appear to be forgetting what humans look like. Concerned that the garden eels – so named because their grass-like appearance when, en masse, they poke their heads out of the seabed – could come to see visitors as a threat, the aquarium is asking people to get in touch in the form of a calming video call.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...g-humans-exist

Shard May 1st 2020 12:44 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by dbd33 (Post 12846535)
I lasted eight minutes. Hitchens argued that people will get bored and go out so the lock down should be lifted before they do. I think he's wrong but, even if he's right, it's a prediction, not a plan, and he's not an immunologist so, ok, he thinks that but it has no more weight than what my dog thinks about it all.

At least the lockdown is good for the climate; no one's going out and drilling for gas or oil.

Eight minutes, are you masochist ? He's one of the most moronic commentators on this whole episode.

Paul_Shepherd May 1st 2020 12:48 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by dbd33 (Post 12846549)
Due to a shared belief life is more important than money, even if it is someone else's life. It's a demonstration that there is such a thing as society.

I would agree with this, each of those people means something to someone, you could look at it from a collateral damage point of view, to save the economy, but I think people would view it differently if they were personally affected, plus an economy can eventually recover, unlike human life, that will always be the priority.




Originally Posted by Almost Canadian (Post 12846524)
Which such expert has produced any science that has supported everyone being in lockdown?

Should we rely upon the WHO who said there was no need to stop international travel, Dr Tam who said the same thing and said that those that were asymptomatic could not be contagious? Have any of the models be shown to be even remotely accurate?

Can you disagree with the comments made here:

https://youtu.be/Id5L4uD51XI

If countries didn’t have the lock down , I do think we would be looking at more deaths, it stands to reason, but its speculative on how many lives a lockdown has saved, but its also speculative on how many it wouldn’t, we will never know.

However I think figures speak for themselves…..the jury is still out on how Sweden from an over all perspective at the moment, but there is a marked difference between them and their Scandinavian neighbours such as Norway and Denmark who followed the rest of the world into lockdown.

Norway population 6 million , 210 deaths
Denmark population 6 million 452 deaths
Sweden population 10million 2586 deaths

As we have said before every country is a different case, there are so many variables per country but if we use the above as a basis, I don’t think for example the UK had any choice but to take the action it has, given its dense population.



Danny B May 1st 2020 3:36 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by dbd33 (Post 12846549)
Due to a shared belief life is more important than money, even if it is someone else's life. It's a demonstration that there is such a thing as society.


(and yes, I see the warning coming)

Half of us are working from a couch and luxuriating in the myth of shared sacrifice. The other half are getting their livelihoods crushed.

dbd33 May 1st 2020 3:48 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by Danny B (Post 12846797)
Half of us are working from a couch and luxuriating in the myth of shared sacrifice. The other half are getting their livelihoods crushed.

I don't know that there's any myth of shared sacrifice. I know that I have more work now than ever because people are being laid off. I know that meat packers will die so I have dinner on the table. I'm just glad not to be a meat packer or divorce lawyer.

Almost Canadian May 1st 2020 8:34 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by dbd33 (Post 12846805)
I don't know that there's any myth of shared sacrifice. I know that I have more work now than ever because people are being laid off. I know that meat packers will die so I have dinner on the table. I'm just glad not to be a meat packer or divorce lawyer.

The Courts are closed so lots of parents are misbehaving but I haven't noticed a massive loss of work just yet. Bear in mind, most families don't spend lots of time together normally, (they profess to but most work and have kids that attend school) so what I am experiencing is that being locked in with a partner and kids is exposing the faults in some relationships such that I have had to stop post pounding on a number of occasions to take calls from prospective new clients.

dbd33 May 1st 2020 8:45 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by Almost Canadian (Post 12846929)
The Courts are closed so lots of parents are misbehaving but I haven't noticed a massive loss of work just yet. Bear in mind, most families don't spend lots of time together normally, (they profess to but most work and have kids that attend school) so what I am experiencing is that being locked in with a partner and kids is exposing the faults in some relationships such that I have had to stop post pounding on a number of occasions to take calls from prospective new clients.

I can't say I'm surprised, family holidays are often a strain so I would expect actually living with one's family would be very difficult indeed.

Jsmth321 May 1st 2020 11:22 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by spouse of scouse (Post 12846610)
JS, I thought you might find this story interesting :)

When the garden eels at a Tokyo aquarium remove their heads from the sand, they are usually confronted by pairs of human eyes staring back at them through the glass.

But like other animals around the world, the eels at Sumida Aquarium are finding their environment transformed by the effects of the coronavirus outbreak.

They also appear to be forgetting what humans look like. Concerned that the garden eels – so named because their grass-like appearance when, en masse, they poke their heads out of the seabed – could come to see visitors as a threat, the aquarium is asking people to get in touch in the form of a calming video call.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...g-humans-exist


Interesting article, thanks for sharing.

Fish do get accustomed to their tanks and what they see through the glass, and they will react to changes they see through the glass.


Jsmth321 May 1st 2020 11:28 pm

Re: Coronavirus
 
Humans need personal space, we normally get it by working, school, doing things giving a break from family we live with, its hard spending 24/7 with the same person day after day, the smaller the space the harder it is.


Danny B May 2nd 2020 12:19 am

Re: Coronavirus
 

Originally Posted by Jsmth321 (Post 12847001)
Humans need personal space, we normally get it by working, school, doing things giving a break from family we live with, its hard spending 24/7 with the same person day after day, the smaller the space the harder it is.

This COVID experience has certainly made me realize that I do not want to go to prison...EVER.


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