Danny B

Have you heard this saying before?
“There are only nine meals between mankind and anarchy.”

After 3 days of not eating you will do whatever it takes to feed your family. I can certainly relate to that. I did a one meal a day diet a few years ago and almost murdered someone after 23hrs of not eating.

scrubbedexpat091

I have not heard that saying before. But you are right, hunger is one of the most basic instincts and people will do what they need to. Social programs simply do not meet the needs of people, the amounts are insufficient and food banks provide a relatively small amount of food. I had to live on basic support before from social assistance, after my housing costs, I had about $2.50 a day to cover all my other needs.

Disability is a little better, a single person on disability works out to $39 per day but most of that will go towards housing. If someone on disability is able to get into BC housing, they would have $26 per day to cover all their other needs including their electric bill as generally BC Housing doesn't include electricity.

Shard

I thought that was you...and was thinking of raising it when you posted the muffin photo.

scilly

I can remember when the first food bank opened in Vancouver, after several churches had been providing food to needy people in their basements.

Food banks were supposed to be an emergency measure for a short period of time. Now they are a necessity with the local and provincial governments being praised for making a large donation at fund raising time.

Part of the reason that there is less help here than in the UK from the government via social programmes can be put down, I think, to the attitude that one should be able to take care of oneself.

There is more help here than I think can be found in the US, where that attitude seems to be more prevalent, at least from what I've understood from some of my friends. Social welfare payments are lower, and seem more degrading with the food stamp programmes, and food banks and free food from churches and other places seem to be much fewer.

I stand willing to be corrected on what I've said!

scrubbedexpat091

US food stamp program is one of the things the US does better vs Canada for the poor. Cash help in the US is more difficult to obtain however, and generally requires having a child. But not sure why you would see food stamp programs degrading, even if anything having to go to food bank vs being able to go to the grocery store is more degrading, food stamp program is one area Canada could learn from the US.

However food stamp program is only available to the very poorest of US society, cut off for a single is 16,000 a year in California, so anyone working full-time wont qualify.

Being poor or disabled in either the US or Canada sucks, neither takes care of the poor or disabled very well, but overall you will be better off in Canada if poor and/or disabled.

Danny B

It was incredibly tough at first, but I found it was the easiest way to consistently lose 2lbs per week without exercising. Now I am at my ideal weight, I do intermittent fasting which is essentially skipping breakfast.

BristolUK

It might be that you grew up in a society that does it. Perhaps it just seems normal. For those of us coming from the UK there would be a stigma.

I'm not entirely sure how food stamps work but within the UK system there was provision for food vouchers in very exceptional cases and it singled out the user. Presumably one uses them to buy food at a store where other people use money.

In the UK there was a system where certain kids would qualify for free school meals at lunchtime and it was done in a way other kids wouldn't know they got them free.

Danny B

Yes, been there done that, never again.

I lost my job in 1996, Wife not working and we had a new born baby. The dole office gives me some milk vouchers to use, I go to my local petrol station, get some 4% milk, and some baby milk formula, join the queue and to my horror the cashier says in a loud voice "we don't take government milk vouchers here" you need to go to Tescos up the road for that.

I walked out of the petrol station with everyone staring at me like I was a leper. I never used them and it taught me a valuable life lesson.

scrubbedexpat091

Food stamps is an outdated term really, most still call it that from the past, but the official name is Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program or SNAP for short, and some states like California call it by a different name, California calls it CalFresh. The program is for the lowest income earners/homeless/disabled, income cut off depends on family size.

California issues the benefits onto a debit card. When paying in a store one would need to look closely to tell its an EBT card for food.

There is also a separate program called WIC in the US which also provides food, but its for low income woman who are pregnant, breastfeeding and children under 5, and in California at least EBT debit card is used as well.

Back in the old days they were paper coupons or stamps and were quite obvious but that isn't the norm anymore.

In BC there are certain circumstances where the province will provide funding for food for those on assistance or disability, crisis fund which may provide up to $40 in a crisis, its dealt with on a case by case basis, basically one goes into the office and pleads their case to a government worker and see's what happens. (actually I think it might be possible to apply for crisis funding via online account now.)

There are also long term supplements for food if you have a medical need and doctor provides necessary information.

Diabetics can receive up to $35 per month
Cystic fibrosis patients up to $50 per month
Low sodium diet up to $10 per month
Gluten-free diet up to $40 per month

But there needs to be a medical need, can't just say hey I want to be gluten free, need your doctor to fill out a form and declare why you need a certain diet.

dbd33

I don't disagree but feel we should emphasize the gap between the services offered to disabled adults in the UK and those offered in Canada. It's another world. Granny dumping isn't something one can condone but it is something one can readily understand.

BristolUK

Funny thing...milk tokens were not actually an exception. Everyone that qualified for that particular benefit got it as tokens. Only if there were more than 5 weeks of arrears was it paid as cash equivalent.

The idea was to ensure they were only used for the milk but word has it that some shops exchanged them for all sorts of stuff.
But, yes, they did indicate (though not guarantee) someone was on a means tested benefit.

Too late now, of course, but a shop refusing them was illegal IIRC.

Shard

What was that ?

Shard

Recent article in the Guardian where an American family, with the aid of Brit, brought a elderly father with dementia over to Britain, dressed him in new Tesco clothes, and then the Brit took him to the hospital saying he found him wandering around. Horrendous behaviour.

dbd33

Yes, I read it. An interesting study in how shining the light of press coverage on something causes all the people involved to be worse off. That was certainly a story that didn't need telling.

I am, myself, an autie dumper and I've tagged along while an unentitled American got treated under OHIP. I tend to side with the people in need over the fiscal constraints of the local authorities.

Shard

Why did it not need telling ? Other than, perhaps, to not publicise and thereby encourage the practice. I think there's a distinction to be drawns between accessing public healthcare of someone, and off-loading someone into another country's long term care system. In the latter case, despite the human-care issues, it has very serious impacts on both countries' care systems.