Euro 2012

Old Jun 25th 2012, 9:50 am
  #91  
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Default Re: Euro 2012

Was just listening to TalkSport and Rafi Honesgstein and another Spanish journalist were on to give their tuppence. The question asked was, "why can't English players - who clearly can control, pass, move, stay in formation and perform for their clubs - do that for England?" A statistic was read out that Ashley Young completed two forward passes successfully all game. To which the quick jokey reply was, "they don't have to play with 10 other English players."

So the guy asked it again a different way - "Really though - how is it that English players have looked that inept at basic football for so long and yet Ukraine and Sweden passed the ball about with ease?"

The more measured but better reply from the Spanish bloke (I was trying to type quickly so.....), "Really? This continual analysis confuses Spanish people. Because how many times this season did the English punditry confess that there were so many games with poor football in them? Where nobody seemed able to pass? Nobody could control a ball? Can't stay in formation? The takeaway in Europe this season was that the English clubs have fallen so far behind that the joke was that they can't even pass backwards anymore and can only win games by not playing football. The view in Spain is that we don't think that Gerrard and Rooney are world class players because they never play well. It's pretty strange to us to hear that they are both supposedly these great performers when Rooney hasn't been anything but problematic for England since 2004 and Gerrard can't play well without Alonso next to him. So when you say they do it at club level is that even really accurate?"

Sounds painful but smells true.

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Old Jun 25th 2012, 12:09 pm
  #92  
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Default Re: Euro 2012

Originally Posted by Herpes Simplex View Post
So the guy asked it again a different way - "Really though - how is it that English players have looked that inept at basic football for so long and yet Ukraine and Sweden passed the ball about with ease?"

The more measured but better reply from the Spanish bloke (I was trying to type quickly so.....), "Really? This continual analysis confuses Spanish people. Because how many times this season did the English punditry confess that there were so many games with poor football in them? Where nobody seemed able to pass? Nobody could control a ball? Can't stay in formation? The takeaway in Europe this season was that the English clubs have fallen so far behind that the joke was that they can't even pass backwards anymore and can only win games by not playing football. The view in Spain is that we don't think that Gerrard and Rooney are world class players because they never play well. It's pretty strange to us to hear that they are both supposedly these great performers when Rooney hasn't been anything but problematic for England since 2004 and Gerrard can't play well without Alonso next to him. So when you say they do it at club level is that even really accurate?"

Sounds painful but smells true.


Couldn't have said it better. That's disturbingly accurate. Winning European Cups by parking the bus (yes, you - Chelsea rent boys) is masking the deficiencies in Englsih football, and by definition, English players who still make up the bulk of the EPL.

Remember when United won it in '99 - playing attacking football with Brits at the heart of that team (albeit a couple of taffs, micks and a Norweigan and a Dane)? Those days feel long gone. England (and English teams) can win the odd cup final - and playing every game as if it were your cup final will get you to Quarter-Finals and no further, but this has felt like it's been a long time coming, and I don't know what the answer is.

I still say that "why England lose" is the best summary of why we are so far behind everyone else....

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Why-England-.../dp/0007301111
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Old Jun 25th 2012, 12:33 pm
  #93  
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Default Re: Euro 2012

For me the writing was on the wall yesterday when Bobby Charlton started telling the Press we could win the tournament but the game itself was a 0-0 massacre if ever there was one from a pisspoor Italian side. Other than the 8-1-1 formation and passing the ball back to the Italian midfield for another shot on goal, it was difficult to see what England's strategy was.

They should go back to basics, like controlling and passing the ball. How many times did they go on daft mazey runs trying to beat men before running into trouble and hoofing the ball to anyone without looking where it was going? Rooney was useless - all the pace and finesse of an athlete 6 stone overweight.

The only saving grace is there'll be no humiliation against the Huns while the FA pat themselves on the back for making the last 8.

Utter shite.
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Old Jun 25th 2012, 12:40 pm
  #94  
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Default Re: Euro 2012

you can't be disappointed, when you had no expectation to begin with.
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Old Jun 25th 2012, 12:50 pm
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Default Re: Euro 2012

Originally Posted by Manc View Post
you can't be disappointed, when you had no expectation to begin with.
The outcome was a foregone conclusion. It's the manner of the defeat that's disappointing.
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Old Jun 25th 2012, 12:56 pm
  #96  
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Default Re: Euro 2012

So who's the player of the tournament so far?

I'd go for Pirlo, he might not be the massive goal scorer, but every time he's played, he's made people around him look like pillocks and had great balls into the box. Also his penalty didn't half take the piss.

Hart, as a keeper too.

Orzil, for Germany has been really good too, but he's just too creepy to look at.
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Old Jun 25th 2012, 12:56 pm
  #97  
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Default Re: Euro 2012

Originally Posted by Macca67 View Post
It's the manner of the defeat that's disappointing.
Even when Montolivo missed his, I knew we'd fuck up somewhere along the way. Fair play to Young, he at least put his laces through the ball and smashed it, but Ashley Cole dropped a massive blob. He isn't Pirlo, so don't try to act like it.

People can say it's utter shite all they want, it's reactionary nonsense, we're not in the top 4 teams in Europe, so we shouldn't be in the semi finals, we are where we are, and got where we got. And to be frank, in theory we did it without losing a game. Which I can live with now the crushing disappointment of Losing on Penalties Part 6 has sunk in.
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Old Jun 25th 2012, 12:57 pm
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Default Re: Euro 2012

Originally Posted by Bob View Post
So who's the player of the tournament so far?

I'd go for Pirlo, he might not be the massive goal scorer, but every time he's played, he's made people around him look like pillocks and had great balls into the box. Also his penalty didn't half take the piss.

Hart, as a keeper too.

Orzil, for Germany has been really good too, but he's just too creepy to look at.
Xabi Alonso.

Never gets mentioned with the Barcelona bum chums, but he's quality.
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Old Jun 25th 2012, 1:05 pm
  #99  
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Originally Posted by Macca67 View Post
the game itself was a 0-0 massacre if ever there was one from a pisspoor Italian side.

Rooney was useless - all the pace and finesse of an athlete 6 stone overweight.

The only saving grace is there'll be no humiliation against the Huns while the FA pat themselves on the back for making the last 8.

Utter shite.
+1

Originally Posted by Manc View Post
you can't be disappointed, when you had no expectation to begin with.
True, but to play with nothing but a desire to smash the ball up the pitch every chance you get is fast becoming the English way.

Originally Posted by Macca67 View Post
The outcome was a foregone conclusion. It's the manner of the defeat that's disappointing.
And yet none of us are really surprised.

Originally Posted by Bob View Post
So who's the player of the tournament so far?

I'd go for Pirlo, he might not be the massive goal scorer, but every time he's played, he's made people around him look like pillocks and had great balls into the box. Also his penalty didn't half take the piss.

Orzil, for Germany has been really good too, but he's just too creepy to look at.
Pirlo has been excellent. He made us look as bad as we actually are. Ozil gives me the creeps. Like a frog with myxomatosis. I wonder what his chick sees in the millionaire footballer?



Originally Posted by Manc View Post
Even when Montolivo missed his, I knew we'd fuck up somewhere along the way. Fair play to Young, he at least put his laces through the ball and smashed it, but Ashley Cole dropped a massive blob. He isn't Pirlo, so don't try to act like it.

People can say it's utter shite all they want, it's reactionary nonsense, we're not in the top 4 teams in Europe, so we shouldn't be in the semi finals, we are where we are, and got where we got. And to be frank, in theory we did it without losing a game. Which I can live with now the crushing disappointment of Losing on Penalties Part 6 has sunk in.
Agree about Young, and your last paragraph. As Macca said earlier, at least we have avoided being taught yet another lesson by the ****ing Germans.
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Old Jun 25th 2012, 1:21 pm
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Default Re: Euro 2012

Can't embed this as someone sent it to me...made me chuckle...
Attached Thumbnails Euro 2012-woy.jpg  
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Old Jun 25th 2012, 1:39 pm
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Default Re: Euro 2012

Originally Posted by Manc View Post
Even when Montolivo missed his, I knew we'd fuck up somewhere along the way. Fair play to Young, he at least put his laces through the ball and smashed it, but Ashley Cole dropped a massive blob. He isn't Pirlo, so don't try to act like it.

People can say it's utter shite all they want, it's reactionary nonsense, we're not in the top 4 teams in Europe, so we shouldn't be in the semi finals, we are where we are, and got where we got. And to be frank, in theory we did it without losing a game. Which I can live with now the crushing disappointment of Losing on Penalties Part 6 has sunk in.
Being a top 4 team doesn't guarantee reaching the semis - plenty of examples of teams who can punch above their weight a la the Greeks and Danes before them to name 2. Success hinges on having a plan that plays to the team's strengths. What I saw yesterday was playing for the draw in the hopes of reaching a penalty shoot-out and if you've lost 5 of 6 that doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
When they were down against the Swedes England showed some flair and fight to get a result and for 10 mins in the first half yesterday they did the same. Too bad there wasn't more of this.

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Old Jun 25th 2012, 4:31 pm
  #102  
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Default Re: Euro 2012

Originally Posted by Macca67 View Post
Too bad there wasn't more of this.
Agreed, but I don't think we have the horses to go toe to toe with the best.... we do defense pretty well and tried to nick it.
I'm not too downbeat really. It was better than South Africa, and that's progression
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Old Jun 25th 2012, 10:26 pm
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Default Re: Euro 2012

Why couldn't Ashley Cole score? Because the Italian goalkeeper wasn't a stupid Geordie slut.
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Old Jun 26th 2012, 5:05 am
  #104  
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Default Re: Euro 2012

Originally Posted by Manc View Post
Agreed, but I don't think we have the horses to go toe to toe with the best.... we do defense pretty well and tried to nick it.
I'm not too downbeat really. It was better than South Africa, and that's progression
Let's be honest, turning up was progression on the banquet of shit we served up down here.
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Old Jun 26th 2012, 2:25 pm
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Default Re: Euro 2012

Originally Posted by ededed View Post
Let's be honest, turning up was progression on the banquet of shit we served up down here.
Agreed. Only difference was the Italians seemed incapable of scoring and missed a hatful of chances otherwise it could've been 4 or 5 nil. What pisses me off is the apparent lack of tactical nous - where was the plan B? Also, Hodgson had mentioned the day before Pirlo was their danger man but still played 4 across the middle - isn't that what we did against the Huns in the WC and got spanked in midfield?

I'm still not happy.
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