indiebird

well H has just walked to school with two friends from our road.... it is literally 2minutes but I'm wondering if I should follow ..... just in case!

lynnxa

Oh I've so missed this thread

whenever I feel like moaning about something in the Spanish school system I come here for a read & instantly feel better!!!


we get 'free' education here too

so far I've spent over 1000 euros on school books & supplies for 2 kids - & one of them doesn't start back til today!

got a list home from primary yesterday - dd2 needs a USB stick!!

Patty

Well Lynnxa console yourself that in Spain they use usb sticks The computer lab (if you can call it that) at sons school consists of 7 very ancient 2nd hand computers and he tells me they hardly ever go in there for a lesson. Its shocking how inadequate the equipment is here. His class looks like a tv clip from the 50's - all those funny little old desks, walls almost bare and the old 'blackboard'. My heart breaks when I go there for parents evenings. Luckily he has a really good teacher though so that compensates a bit for other things.

Pecora Nera

Ha Ha it is true.. My OH asked me if we have any floppy disks that she could use to save her children's work on. I said no but she could use our USB sticks. She said the computers didn't have USB connections and the Head told her if you want to save the work you need to go and buy some floppy discs. Apparently you can still buy them!!!

lynnxa

thing is, last time I looked there weren't that many computers there

they do have IT lessons, but it's not exactly an all singing & dancing IT lab!


I have a sneaky feeling she's going to be needing extra computer time for homework & take it in on the stick!

indiebird

My heart breaks when I think of when my son was in school in the UK three years ago.... a primary school with a multi-media board in each classroom a fully equipped state of the art computer lab etc... here I noticed on Monday that the class has plaster coming off the walls and must have last been decorated circa 1978 I think.... I worry my son won't know how to USE a computer when he gets back to England!!

Patty

Another thing (just one of the many) that makes me mad is this Gelmini talks of reforms reforms reforms - but they are so out of touch with todays needs. They still make kids do things like latin and hours and hours of grammatical analysis - its so in the dark ages.
Just before coming here my middle son was attending a grammar school - a new building - it had swimming pool, athletics field, tennis courts, gym, theatre, music room, IT lab, and science labs etc etc. When I explain this to students they say 'oh you must be rich' and I say 'no - this was free state education' and I never had to buy one book !
The reforms should be organised by people who really know what children today need and not some silly woman who doesnt have a clue

indiebird

I agree with you Patty, but then I think the same about things in the UK too!! My son's school had a pool too in the UK and he learned to swim for free there and it was open for babies and toddlers during lunch times and I used to pay 50p to take my daughter there!! There was also art education and creative writing for all kids and not just if your teacher has that particular leaning.... all for FREE!!

Patty

Its like you said the other day Indie - why, when we pay probably the highest taxes in Europe - do we have this huge difference in the education system. I dont have the answer but I do have some ideas and I think that while the same old politicians stay in power here until they literally drop dead, then nothing will ever change much. Its sad isnt it.
The sickening thing is that politicians get SO much money that once they're on the merry go round they never want to get off. And even once they're off they get a very handsome monthly wage anyway - all money that this country hasnt got and should be directing instead towards its children, healthcare and roads

(just out of curiousity - when an MP steps downs in England do they get a nice monthly wage for the rest of their life like here or not ? I'm not very up on England as in Guernsey we have an independent government nothing like the UK)

indiebird

I don't think they do but I'm not sure.... we've obviously just had the big expenses pallaver in the UK but I don't think it's quite as bad as it is here.... I also think that one of the other problems here is that a lot of work is done 'in nero' and therefore not declared... I am sure it's only idiots like us who pay tax on anything.... my hubbies tax bill is huge and I'm sure it's not right ...especially with an Italian accountant who takes a percentage payment!

Lorna at Vicenza

Ever felt like you're going round in circles and getting nowhere?

You peeps wanted the low down so here it is in all it's ugliness.

The head 'phoned me at 9.05 and said "either come now or you'll have to wait until Friday."

- Friday is too late, I'm coming now."

So I explained what has been going on and he first said that I should have asked for a meeting with the maths teacher and why did I go to him.

I told him that I wanted answers from him, the headmaster, about the legality of holiay homework, the rules, if any, and who gets to decide how much is given out.

He replied, "oh Signora, you're using all the wrong kind of terms here. Let's not get into the legality of things and formalities. There is no legal or illegal. Holiday homework is a school regulation thing and you're talking to the wrong man here anyway as I completely agree with it and I'm all for it.

- I never said I disagreed. I agree with some homework over the three months, although I think homework at Easter when they only get 5 days off is a bit much. I'm asking who gets to decide how much homework because there was loads and loads this year. It would have been better if the kids had a book like the other years because at least a book has a fixed number of counted pages. I know some other mums feel the same way about this.

"My son in seconda media in a different school got 50 maths problems this year and he did them all and I think it's right." (who gives a flying monkey about his son?)

I had Chloe's book with me and said - look here, my daughter who is 3 years younger had over 65 maths problems to do, plus a heap of Italian, geography, history and science and she's bloody lucky in that she doesn't have the English book to do on top of all that like the other kids do. She didn't finish all of the maths and now she's terrified and cying in bed and school has only been going for 2 days. Do you think that's right too?

"Well obviously not but there are some rules you know. The teachers must show a united front in the clasrooms."

- Rules !!! What rules ???? Where is the rule about holiday homework? Do the teachers even communicate with each other? Do they say 'we'll give them 10 questions each' so the kids end up with 30 questions and not 300 or 400. Does anybody ever check what might be too much? And what about the teacher telling Chloe she'll only get a 5 on the register?


At this point the deputy head (nice lady) came in and stayed there.

"The holiday homework is there for the kids to show a yearly dedication and input at school." went on the headmaster.

- Okay, but I think my daughter has amply shown and proven her dedication and hard work getting all 9's and 10's on her report ... and what about this 5 score?

"The pagella is obviously the fixed and proven written report of any child's progress in the school year. Holiday homework obviously is there for a reason but it isn't really classified on the register. What register? We haven't even got the registers yet! Anyway Signora, I don't think you should be comparing a British system for example with our Italian one."

I very nearly blew a gasket. I'm sure my face got red as I tried not to lose it completely. Pissing wanker !

- I am not and have not compared the two systems here this morning. I am here talking about the Italian system but if you want to make comparisons then let me tell you that writing notes to an adult in fat, red ink in England is considered the height of rudeness and disrespect.

"Ah beh - we all use red ink here. That's just your personal grievance."

- Teachers in England used to use red pen - to mark the children's books - not to write notes home to parents and if you think that's just a personal grievance I have another. This teacher can't even spell my child's name properly after 4 years and I do find that extremely annoying and disrespectful.

The deputy head decided to open her mouth at this stage and said,

'Headmaster, we don't often say this about any of the kids but Chloe really is a marvellous girl, really. She's a delight.'

- Thankyou - I replied - so you can understand why it breaks my heart that she's crying in bed after just 2 days and you know how hard she works. She doesn't deserve this. I can tell you both one thing, she'll be getting regular daily homework now and I am not forcing her to finish that maths on top of the loads she'll be coming home with every day !!!!

'Actually I did see Chloe this morning and she told me that her mamma was going to see the preside. When I asked her why she told me it was about maths and that maestra Monica was going to give her a five and Chloe said she was scared and didn't deserve a 5. I actually agreed with her and said 'Chloe tesoro - you dont.'

"Right then" - said the headmaster, "That settles it. Signora, write a note in Chloe's book telling the maths teacher that in light of the last two days and the homework given you'd like to have a meeting with her. Sort it out with the teacher directly involved and any other issues you and any other mothers might have about holiday homework can be brought up in the parent meeting on October 26th. I have just set the dates so I know it's October 26th. Oh and Signora - if you're so bothered about the amount of homework now, wait until the liceo.

- She isn't at liceo yet though is she? I am talking about the here and now and what is suitable now - not when she's 15 or 16.

He shook my hand, the deputy head walked me out and in a private aside she told me not to worry and that Chloe won't be getting a 5 on any register.
I told her Chloe is more worried about one bad mark than I am and that I'm more upset at Chloe being scared of a teacher and crying in bed over maths.

She told me that she's sure I can sort things out with Maestra Monica and that she's not really that bad.

Whoop de doo !!!!!! Maestra Monica is not really that bad is she. Bad enough to scare Chloe half to death.

So - next step - go and have it out with maestra Monica.

I don't feel very satisfied and the headmaster has lost lots and lots of Brownie points with me this morning ....... and I still don't really have any solid answers for Chloe.

Very high praise from the deputy head though. That bit was nice.

I absolutely loath the British thing coming up in conversation though. I know us lot on here make loads of comparisons but I deliberately kept the UK out of the conversation this morning and the bloody head brought it up and tried to use it against me. Pillock.

indiebird

I hate to say it Lorna but welcome to my world. This is exactly the attitude I have had to put up with. I have never compared the UK system to the Italian system at the school but they always bring it up as any criticism I'm making is as an 'outsider' and therefore I should shut my fat gob! Also what exactly are the Head's paid to do as it ain't to keep the teachers or the kids in check is it??

Patty

What an absolute bloody pillock I dont quite know what to say Lorna - except that his attitude doesnt surprise me unfortunately.
As for saying about British schools - like you said you never once mentioned it and unlike me whose kids DID go to english schools - your children are in that sense 100% italian and so he's talking through his arse. I dont know how you kept your cool - he was rude, insolent and totally unprepared in his response. Good job the other lady was kinder and more understanding.

Lorna at Vicenza

Thanks girls.

I also said to him .... if it's all about the homework, where does the word vacanze come into it? But he never really answered that question either.

Taking dad out now for a bit of shopping. He leaves tomorrow and he's just listened to me rant and rave for 20 minutes.

He said Chloe should do like a lot of kids in British schools these days ......

..... stand up and say "I have human rights you know and you can shove your maths up your arse coz I aint doing it and you can't make me!!!"

He said that should shake up the head and the teachers a bit. He said he'd love to be a fly on the wall if she did but of course she won't. Would be interesting though.

Patty