ciquta

I'm not talking just about blood tests, there are so many test you can have of your body and they can require more than one visit.
Trust me, without a little ticket that would be a huge waste of money, we already tried that way.

highlander1

You mean there was a time without tickets ? When was that as far as you know ?

ciquta

Yes a long time without.
I guess the ticket was introduced in the 90s, at the beginning just for the prescriptions then it was extended for the services too.
Then every govern changed the rules, for example freeing the tickets for emergencies or low salary people.

The fun thing is the people who doesn't pay all the taxes often figures in these categories, so they steal the money twice.

sunnysider

aha, that rather confirms my cultural speculation then doesn't it ciquta?

sunny

PS: If I turn more Italian turning Italian I really think so, can I ask if you've picked up any of your dad's knowledge - can we ask you about our odd little aches, that mysterious tiny tiny tickle at the back of our throat on waking, that food we didn't quite digest and it's possible implications?


all the best

fleetwoodmac1975

the number of blood tests prescribed in the UK is still much lower than those carried out in Italy. Whether this is because of the Italian NHS wasting money or it is more through and detailed...

I don't have good experiences with NHS GPS, I find them to be more gatekeepers than healers imho

Maybe1day

Sorry my son was told. That's it good luck. And my wifes' uncle received nothing for the last 10 yrs until he got his pension.
Every day on state and other Tv there is a constant barrage of the poor who recieve no subsistance in Italy. How do you explain that?
There are I believe 4 countries in Europe which provide only limited unemployment benefit and no social security system of which Italy is the richest by far. Do not believe what they put up to a European information office last year. complete bullshit, I saw this a few months ago. Go to your local bar and Ask the guys there when they last worked and how much they receive now. No Bullshit do it! Don't believe the net on this one.
Germany provides unemployment benefit at the max level for one year but does not dump people under the motorway bridges thereafter.
They have long term unemployed that are in receipt of monthly cheques/transfers as in most of the N European countries.
I would like to think that you are right so in 2 months when we return I will get my wife to register as unemployed and ask for the benefit.
She has worked in the past so there should no be any problem ????????????????????????????????????????????????
How much are the out of work young receiving every month?
An Answer Please ?

sunnysider

For a fair while now I've had the sort of idea that the Italian version of social benefits is those local/state jobs that don't really need doing/are overmanned.

Corpo Forestale, multiplicity of off local "police forces", pointless paper-shufflers, keyboard twiddlers, a commune and town hall for the tiddliest of places. Bit of Italy I go to I marvel at the slowness of the postie even on a scooter, the daily (no idea if this is common in Italy) collection of rubbish of one type or another, two or three guys very slowly patching a small hole in the road/street. Jobs doubtless badly paid but funnels social benefits and I suppose you could argue that it gives the recipients of those jobs more self respect than benefits. Though of course its far far from universal and gawd knows what grovelling has to be gone through with local worthies to get such a placement.

This theory would also POSSIBLY explain where the tax money goes (and by the by do all of the percentage tax rates above take account of the fact that in Italy, as I understand it, there is no tax free allowance so you are taxed on everything - in the UK you can I think earn over £10,000 tax free.) despite providing sod all in benefits. Pay for your blood tests etc etc etc.

Maybe1day

One of my wifes' uncles was a postie, he retired with 60% of his salary at................................................ .................................................. .................................................. ................Age 35. with 17 years service. He's been getting his pension for more than 35 years now

sunnysider

Interesting maybe1day - it's always good to have real life examples.

I know about those sorts of pensions - I well remember over 20 years ago talking about it with an Italian. Alarmed, I said that they made no economic sense, that the country couldn't possibly afford them. I could only assume that some Italians thought that, blessed with unique genius and creativity, they had discovered an economic formula the rest of the planet was to rule-bound and thick to have figured out.

How did they justify the pension for the 35 year old postie? Was he deemed to be sick/injured in the course of his work? Was it some sort of staff reduction scheme? If so was he replaced or not? Did any strings have to be pulled to secure this pension or was it a general entitlement? Did he get another job afterwards?

Lots of questions I know but it's always good to have real stories. I sometimes find that some Italians are reluctant to discuss the real workings of the various systems - "raccommandazione" springs to mind.

ononno

I'm afraid you are not quite up to date with what goes on in the rest of your country, viewing things from your well paid job in the prosperous North. My wife and I live in a small, relatively prosperous, southern village. Note I say 'relatively'. I need 3 types of pills just to be able to wake up in the morning. My only income is the 'pensione minima' of 419 eurines per month.
I collect my pills every 2 months. Pill A - ticket 5 eurines, Pill B - ticket 5 eurines, Pill C - you won't believe this - I buy over the counter for 3 eurines per box, because if I have a prescription, this also carries a 5 eurine 'ticket'.
I have a painful mouth infection for which the GP reccomended 'a slice of lemon covered in salt' for which I have to purchase my own medication and painkillers.
My wife is beginning to be treated for Alzheimer,she needs Aricept. We have to purchase it ourselves. Her pension is 409 eurines per month. I am her full time carer. We are still waiting for INPS/ASL to maybe perhaps consider conceding us an 'indennità di accompagnamento'. Tomorrow morning I have to collect the results of blood & urine tests, and an elettrocardiogram as proof that I do in fact need the statins (post stroke stuff).
That is the reality on the ground. At the moment I'm pissed of with pontificating by folks who have no idea of this reality, and believe me I could show you lots of older people far far worse off than us.
bye bye dicette l'inglese

HADENOUGHPIZZA

You surprise me Ononno because you' ve mentioned working hard for many years , surely you souldn't be on the minimum basic pension ? And I do think it wrong that you pay prescription charges out of that too, you ought ti be exempt.

ononno

An application for indennità di accompagnamento has to be made by your GP, with a medical certificate, and costs 50 eurines. Re exemptions, you obviously don't know about the big black hole that is the Regione Campania. Re pension, yes I worked bleeding hard.Managed 30 years of contributions, not 40, because INPS lost my contribution for years 1974/5/6 and because an employer didn't pay out 1964-1969. Part of the 80's worked in UK for which I get 35 pounds a week :-). Saved hard for a rainy day too, bit the last 4/5 years have been more like a cloudburst than a rainy day.
bye bye dicette l'înglese

gioppino

You sound like the perfect DM poster boy. You seem to blame Italy's state deficit to government inefficiency, a sort of genetic laziness of the populace and lots of other useless (but useful to you) stereotypes.

Well I tell you, this is total tripe!

If you add public sector to public sector debt, the UK is around 4 times more indebted than Italy. Families in Italy don't pay with credit cards, so the can't get too much in debt. Despite inefficiency and corruption the health system can offer a decent service, you can speak to your GP for way longer than the stingy 10 minutes back in Blighty and most of the time you have the felling that you are actually speaking to a human being.

If the interest rates in UK increase by only 2% the whole system in UK goes tits up. And how much gold has the Bank of England left?

It's ok to rant but get your fact right!

highlander1

You seem to blame Italy's state deficit to government inefficiency, a sort of genetic laziness of the populace and lots of other useless (but useful to you) stereotypes.

So, enlighten us, who is to blame ?

I though in this thread we were talking about Renzi ?

ciquta

In the second half of the past century Italy has developed an economy based strongly on manufacturing.
At that time we were the "european chinese", hard workers at low cost, low safety measures (many thousands of deaths every year), low controls overall, huge tax evasion, moonlight workers and so on....

The world has changed in the meanwhile, no one can afford anymore to produce fridges in western europe, and you can't really blame Renzi nor EU for that.

I'm not sold on "evolve or die", but 2 years of unemployement is more than enough time to find yourself a different position, no one can pay you lifetime more than few hundreds euro if you aren't able to get cracking.

Sorry but that's it