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New biometric card

New biometric card

Old Mar 12th 2021, 4:48 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

Originally Posted by nicktonight View Post
Reading through the different threads on the biometric card and WA certificate has made me decide to go the full monty, i.e. get Italian citizenship in order to restore all my lost rights and avoid these other two administrative formalities. I hope there are some useful threads here on that and in particular how to get birth certificate and police record documents certified in the UK?
Have we also lost the right of all Europeans to ask for Italian citizenship after only 4 years residence so that we now have to justify 10 years residence?
The main drawback is the increased tax on pension income from abroad..The positive is you get an unlimited tessera sanitaria and a more useful carta d'identita . In the national anthem it mentions you may be required to die for your country.
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Old Mar 12th 2021, 4:55 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

Originally Posted by philat98 View Post
The main drawback is the increased tax on pension income from abroad.
Now I'm confused - in what way does Italian citizenship (as opposed to residency) change the treatment of tax on pensions (or any other income from wherever, for that matter)?

Originally Posted by philat98 View Post
In the national anthem it mentions you may be required to die for your country.
Does it also mention Covid?
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Old Mar 12th 2021, 5:17 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

Originally Posted by Serrano View Post
Now I'm confused - in what way does Italian citizenship (as opposed to residency) change the treatment of tax on pensions (or any other income from wherever, for that matter)?


Does it also mention Covid?
The bad news on pensions...Pensions for public functions are subject to taxation only in Italy if the contributor resides in Italy and has Italian nationality (or dual nationality Italy-UK/USA). On the other hand, pensions for public functions earned by a contributor who is resident in Italy but has exclusively UK or USA nationality are subject to taxation only in the UK or the USA.



Private pensions received by contributors resident in Italy are, on the other hand, always subject to taxation only in Italy.

https://www.theflorentine.net/2019/0...pension-italy/
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Old Mar 12th 2021, 5:35 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

Originally Posted by philat98 View Post
The bad news on pensions...Pensions for public functions are subject to taxation only in Italy if the contributor resides in Italy and has Italian nationality (or dual nationality Italy-UK/USA). On the other hand, pensions for public functions earned by a contributor who is resident in Italy but has exclusively UK or USA nationality are subject to taxation only in the UK or the USA.



Private pensions received by contributors resident in Italy are, on the other hand, always subject to taxation only in Italy.

https://www.theflorentine.net/2019/0...pension-italy/
OK, panic over (at least on my part). So this gets to be a consideration exclusively for former public sector employees. I hadn't underestood that, thanks for the clarification.
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Old Mar 12th 2021, 7:32 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

The DTA is very difficult to understand on this matter, so this gives a much better understanding. So there will be many there in Italy ex Army, Civil Service and other public sector pensions that are only taxable in the UK for those resident in Italy, but still UK citizens. Still I would not want to argue the toss with the Italian authorities ....
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Old Mar 12th 2021, 7:48 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

Originally Posted by Geordieborn View Post
The DTA is very difficult to understand on this matter, so this gives a much better understanding. So there will be many there in Italy ex Army, Civil Service and other public sector pensions that are only taxable in the UK for those resident in Italy, but still UK citizens. Still I would not want to argue the toss with the Italian authorities ....
It also raises a few odd questions. For example most countries have progressive Income Tax rates - does this mean that a pensioner with UK public sector pension income of, let's say, £12,000 per annum (thus in effect tax-free) would be charged tax in Italy only on any remaining income (investments, private pensions etc) as if it were only that remaining income they were receiving (in the most extreme case, €8,000, which would also be tax free)?
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Old Mar 12th 2021, 8:02 pm
  #67  
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Default Re: New biometric card

In Italy, yes. A very strange but advantageous quirk of the Italy/UK Double Taxation Treaty. You still need to complete a tax return in Italy though.
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Old Mar 12th 2021, 10:17 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

Not sure about the 8000 Euro being free, but as I read it (and always have, but never certain) the public sector pension no matter how much is tax free. From what I've read it is not just the UK/Italy, it is most DTAs and stems from diplomatic staff working abroad?
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Old Mar 18th 2021, 1:18 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

I'm still confused about the utility of this biometric card for the following reasons. According to the excellent Facebook group recommended above by Ruby 2, since 1st January, UK nationals must now have resided in Italy for 10 years before they can request citizenship. What is more they must also now have a valid carta di soggiorno. What is the relation between this carta di soggiorno and the biometric card (and WA certificate?). Are they the same thing?
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Old Mar 18th 2021, 3:51 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

Residence is not citizenship-being a citizen of Italy means that you are in effect an Italian as well as a UK citizen and you obviously have to have the right to reside in Italy before you can become an Italian citizen Being "resident" does not make you a citizen
The WA card/certificate preserves the right of Brits resident in Italy prior to 1 jan 21 as if the UK was still in the EU eg right to work rights to healthcare etc
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Old Mar 18th 2021, 5:17 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

[QUOTE=The WA card/certificate preserves the right of Brits resident in Italy prior to 1 jan 21 as if the UK was still in the EU e.g. right to work rights to healthcare etc[/QUOTE] This seems to be untrue. Before 1 Jan 21 a British citizen could ask for Italian citizenship after 4 years. Now you must wait 10 years and the WA card seems to be irrelevant. My feeling from the citizenship application pages is that the key document in the future will be a carta di soggiorno as for all other people from non-EU countries. This also gives you the right to residence, work and therefore right to healthcare. Needless to say the WA card does not preserve lots of other rights such as the right to live and work in other EU countries or even to get help from the EU if you have administrative problems. The UK has been removed from all the drop-down menus on EU help sites and has not been replaced by WA card!
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Old Mar 18th 2021, 7:16 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

Originally Posted by nicktonight View Post
I'm still confused about the utility of this biometric card for the following reasons. According to the excellent Facebook group recommended above by Ruby 2, since 1st January, UK nationals must now have resided in Italy for 10 years before they can request citizenship. What is more they must also now have a valid carta di soggiorno. What is the relation between this carta di soggiorno and the biometric card (and WA certificate?). Are they the same thing?
Looking on the UKinItaly facebook you get the impression that nobody has the Biometric card yet.
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Old Mar 18th 2021, 7:49 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

I just got an email update, cards are being authorised in Rome and I will receive my card in 20 days time. I should treat it like Christmas very civil email .
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Old Mar 22nd 2021, 2:09 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

Lorna at Vicenza
Hi all, first post around these parts but I stumbled upon this thread and my actual issue revolves around the Vicenza anagrafe hence why I have tagged you Lorna, I hope that's ok as maybe you know more directly?

I'm living in Umbria and am moving to Vicenza with my Italian (non-married) partner.
We have sent off the residence applications and all necessary documents to Vicenza and heard back today saying that they require me, UK citizen, officially registered with all relevant Brexit docs and living here for 2 years already, to have the electronic residence document before they proceed.

Can I ask, as I understand it, this electronic document is NOT obligatory, not mandatory and optional, is that correct?
If so, are comunes permitted to decline processing a change of residence when someone has not got one of these new cards yet?
If they are, there is BOB Hope that I would be able to get one in time for the move as just to change the driving license from UK to Italy took 3 months of delays their end and with red zone fever about to hit....well, that's going to prove impossible.

Does anyone have any advice? What can/should I tell to the Vicenza comune regarding the lack of electronic residence document?
I feel like I would wish to point out to them that this is not a legal, mandatory requirement but also don't want to antagonise them to refuse me flat out.

Any help greatly appreciated.

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Old Mar 22nd 2021, 3:08 pm
  #75  
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Default Re: New biometric card

Try contacting IOM I’ve copied the information below from the www.britishinitaly.net web-site. Many people have found IOM very helpful resolving just your kind of problem. And very quick to respond.

IOM (International Organisation for Migration):

IOM - your first port of call for problems

IOM have been up and running for some months now providing invaluable advice and assistance to many of you who are having difficulty either registering as resident for the first time or even exchanging an old out-of-date permesso di soggiorno for the up-to-date version and WA attestazione should contact IOM.

IOM have been having some success in persuading various comuni to adopt the ‘correct’ procedure for the new ‘attestazione’. They have also been able to obtain the ‘attestazione’ by proxy for some individuals who for reasons of health or vulnerability (including isolating due to Covid) have not been able to go to the Anagrafe office.

New ‘attestazione’ by proxy: Please pass the message to anyone you know who needs such a proxy to get in touch with IOM.

IOM’s contact number is - 800684884.

IOM’s email address is - [email protected]

Hope this is helpful.
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