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New biometric card

New biometric card

Old Dec 17th 2020, 8:52 am
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Default New biometric card

Here’s a link about the new biometric card for UK citizens covered by the WA. The vademecum is available in both Italian and English. The card will be standard across Europe and will save carrying bits of paper to evidence WA rights. It will cost €30.46 plus bollo plus 4 passport photos and is available from your local questura.

https://www.interno.gov.it/it/notizi...sidenti-italia
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Old Dec 17th 2020, 10:42 am
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Default Re: New biometric card

That is a good thing. You dont have to show income to obtain it either. I wonder if they will give you a Tessera Sanitaria too?
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Old Dec 17th 2020, 11:30 am
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Default Re: New biometric card

Originally Posted by philat98 View Post
That is a good thing. You dont have to show income to obtain it either. I wonder if they will give you a Tessera Sanitaria too?
The Questura is linked to the comune -and more- they just look you up.
As for the TS, I think that that might be wishful thinking.
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Old Dec 17th 2020, 2:49 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

Okay. To be fair I have to say that it seems to be efficiently and clearly communicated.

But do I need it? For most people (except students which I'll mention below) it seems to be a choice. Not obligatory. And it's a bit of hassle (not much maybe). And it costs 46.46 euro. And in my case I already have the other WA form (the certificate of personal registration, issued by the Municipality of residence, proving the registration by 31st December 2020). And I have a plastic Italian ID card with photo and biometric information (which they have been issuing for the past few years)....

Students -
"Starting from 1st January 2021, British students who are
registered in the Temporary Population Register by 31st
December 2020, in order to stay in Italy will have to
apply for an electronic residence permit at the Police
Headquarters of the province of residence, within 8
working days starting from 1st January 2021, by
submitting the specific application kit at the
authorized post office.
Vademecum
This residence permit will last one year and will be
renewable until the end of the course of study, by
submitting the following documents:
» a valid passport;
» receipt of payment of € 70,46 (€ 30.46 - a sum equal
to the production cost of the document and € 40,00 -
a contribution to issue the residence permit) - to be
made via postal order on C/A n. 67422402;
» a revenue stamp of € 16.00;
» 4 passport-sized photographs;
» documents certifying the availability of adequate
financial resources for the duration of stay;
» certification from the University attesting the student
has successfully passed his/her exams;
» health and accident insurance."

OUCH! 8 DAYS!!!

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Old Dec 17th 2020, 3:07 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

The Biometric card will also be avaialble to those with the WA document and will be used to demonstrate that the holder is protected under the agreement , it is not avaialble for anyone not resident prior to 31/12 and its main purpose is to make it easier getting though borders etc , it distinguishes us from tourists and non residents and so we wont get our passports stamped or have to carry tons of bits of paper about with you.
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Old Dec 17th 2020, 3:27 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

How many of the French police frontalier at Calais or wherever in Northern France can read Italian do you think? By having a card that is recognised throughout the EU will be so easy and will stop you having to carry a folder of paper about And of course an Italian ID card issued to a Non Italian is of no use outside the Italian border hence you need your UK passport as well
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Old Dec 17th 2020, 4:42 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

Aw, come on. It's not exactly 'tons' of paper is it? One piece of A4. And when I'm not in Italy then yes I am a tourist and I take my passport with me. I'll keep the WA letter with my passport. SImple.

As for the problems of translation...do you think the WA Card will be in French? And German? And Spanish? And all the other languages? I think it will be in Italian and English (English being the common language of the EU). And the authorities in various countries will be able to understand it because it has a standard format/layout for all EU countries....which is...er....exactly the same as the ID card I have now!

My ID card is like a credit card, not a paper ID. Similar to a driving licence. Italy has been issuing them since 2016. And they're in a format which is standard in all EU countries (except Denmark, Iceland, Ireland and the UK). It has my photo and they took my fingerprints etc.

I guess if you don't have this type of card (maybe you have the old paper one?) then the new one is maybe useful for you.

But otherwise it just sounds like a con to take more money from us whilst simultaneously making it easier for the authorities. Why don't they let us use the existing ID cards? The authorities in all EU countries understand them and can check immediately on their database whether or not they are still valid. I don't understand why you're all being so positive about it.



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Old Dec 17th 2020, 4:43 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

The card is "il documento digitale di soggiorno." When you go to any public offices they will want to see it.
The 10 year card is a "Permesso di Soggiorno Permanent" and a replacement for the current EU version. I would have thought the card is essential.

Last edited by philat98; Dec 17th 2020 at 4:45 pm.
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Old Dec 17th 2020, 5:26 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

Can it be a replacement if it's not obligatory? Are they making all the citizens of other countries get a digital soggiorno document so that it will become a standard document? Do Americans living in Italy need one, or d they already have one? If not you know what will happen...the local public offices won't know what it is and they'll probably ask you for the normal ID card!-) Tbf how many Brits do they deal with? And if necessary I can take the WA letter from the commune (which they will understand as it's in Italian).

And besides, as I said, my current residency card is already digital and linked to a database so they can already check it's validity if they want to, so even if they are trying to make it 'essential' it's still at worst an excuse to take more money from us, or at best another bit of Brexit bureacracy which could have been avoided.

It seems there is no requirement to get this now, and it's going to be difficult if all the students are applying within 8 days of Jan 1st...so I think I would wait and see how I get on before rushing to get one

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Old Dec 17th 2020, 9:03 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

Originally Posted by C.2s View Post
Can it be a replacement if it's not obligatory? Are they making all the citizens of other countries get a digital soggiorno document so that it will become a standard document? Do Americans living in Italy need one, or d they already have one? If not you know what will happen...the local public offices won't know what it is and they'll probably ask you for the normal ID card!-) Tbf how many Brits do they deal with? And if necessary I can take the WA letter from the commune (which they will understand as it's in Italian).

And besides, as I said, my current residency card is already digital and linked to a database so they can already check it's validity if they want to, so even if they are trying to make it 'essential' it's still at worst an excuse to take more money from us, or at best another bit of Brexit bureacracy which could have been avoided.

It seems there is no requirement to get this now, and it's going to be difficult if all the students are applying within 8 days of Jan 1st...so I think I would wait and see how I get on before rushing to get one
It is an EU wide document for all British citizens. It is intended to make our life simpler. It last 5 or 10 years according to your residency status. What is the problem?
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Old Dec 18th 2020, 7:34 am
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Default Re: New biometric card

Originally Posted by 37100 View Post
It is an EU wide document for all British citizens. It is intended to make our life simpler. It last 5 or 10 years according to your residency status. What is the problem?
Hmmm...it is unusual for me to find myself at odds with so many people on this forum. Most of the time I agree with most of what people are saying. I do think my feelings have to be understood in the general context of the various illogical, unnecessary, costly things that Brexit has caused (but I am sure you are all feeling this too). Illogical, unnecessary and costly things irk me. To say "it's the straw that breaks the camel's back" would give you the sense of how I feel, but would overstate the strength of my feeling. This is more like another fly buzzing around getting on my nerves.

The problems are these:
1. I already possess a biometric ID card that is in a standard format and recognisable in all EU countries. If this was really about making lives simpler why not just pass a piece of legislation to allow us continue using this type of card?
2. Why do I have to take copies of all my documents and passport photos to the Questura? They already have digital copies of all of this from when I applied for the ID card.
3. What sense does it make to require people to physically go to an office (and for students within 8 working days) given the current Covid situation? One person going maybe isn't a huge risk, but multiply it...
4. Why do we have to pay again? 46 euro isn't much, but on top of all the fees I've already paid (for permesso di soggiorno registration, the ID card, the WA attestation letter) it's not great. Think about that in terms of all the costs that people are having to pay all over Europe and for EU citizens in the UK and...
5. Are the downsides of not having one being exaggerated? See the comments about the amount of paper above. Okay these are figures of speech, but they are exaggerations. Carrying one piece of paper when travelling = not really a problem. Taking it with me to a govt office = not really a problem. Risk of passport being stamped = not an immediate problem for me because I don't intend driving to the UK in the next 12 months. And I believe there won't really be problems with stamping our passports at Calais as someone suggested ((time will tale). When I fly into Italy I can show my ID card and the WA letter. Where else will my passport be checked?
6. I'm also generally sceptical of announcements from organisations that claim new things are much better simply because they are 'new' (for example 'gesture control' in cars...necessary? ). What does 'new biometric' really mean? Does it change our rights? Not really. So I think the upsides are also being exaggerated.

Point 5 is the one which makes me think I'll wait and see if it is really necessary to get one. It might be, it might not

What type of ID card do you (all) have currently? As I said above, I can see that there might be more benefit if you have a different type of ID card to the one I have.
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Old Dec 18th 2020, 3:10 pm
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Default Re: New biometric card

Originally Posted by C.2s View Post
Hmmm...it is unusual for me to find myself at odds with so many people on this forum. Most of the time I agree with most of what people are saying. I do think my feelings have to be understood in the general context of the various illogical, unnecessary, costly things that Brexit has caused (but I am sure you are all feeling this too). Illogical, unnecessary and costly things irk me. To say "it's the straw that breaks the camel's back" would give you the sense of how I feel, but would overstate the strength of my feeling. This is more like another fly buzzing around getting on my nerves.

The problems are these:
1. I already possess a biometric ID card that is in a standard format and recognisable in all EU countries. If this was really about making lives simpler why not just pass a piece of legislation to allow us continue using this type of card?
2. Why do I have to take copies of all my documents and passport photos to the Questura? They already have digital copies of all of this from when I applied for the ID card.
3. What sense does it make to require people to physically go to an office (and for students within 8 working days) given the current Covid situation? One person going maybe isn't a huge risk, but multiply it...
4. Why do we have to pay again? 46 euro isn't much, but on top of all the fees I've already paid (for permesso di soggiorno registration, the ID card, the WA attestation letter) it's not great. Think about that in terms of all the costs that people are having to pay all over Europe and for EU citizens in the UK and...
5. Are the downsides of not having one being exaggerated? See the comments about the amount of paper above. Okay these are figures of speech, but they are exaggerations. Carrying one piece of paper when travelling = not really a problem. Taking it with me to a govt office = not really a problem. Risk of passport being stamped = not an immediate problem for me because I don't intend driving to the UK in the next 12 months. And I believe there won't really be problems with stamping our passports at Calais as someone suggested ((time will tale). When I fly into Italy I can show my ID card and the WA letter. Where else will my passport be checked?
6. I'm also generally sceptical of announcements from organisations that claim new things are much better simply because they are 'new' (for example 'gesture control' in cars...necessary? ). What does 'new biometric' really mean? Does it change our rights? Not really. So I think the upsides are also being exaggerated.

Point 5 is the one which makes me think I'll wait and see if it is really necessary to get one. It might be, it might not

What type of ID card do you (all) have currently? As I said above, I can see that there might be more benefit if you have a different type of ID card to the one I have.
Hope I didn't sound rude. My question, 'what's the problem' was a genuine question, albeit blunt due to iffy internet.
1. The biometric ID card does not distinguish people here under the W.A. and those not. And cards issued before Oct (?) 2018 don't work - they can be replaced free of charge.
2. I once asked a friend why they needed copies, photos and new fingerprints. People try it on i.e.people not in the country send a friend. This was confirmed by a friend who hired a badante only to discover it was the sister of the passport holder.
3. 8 days is only for students and repairs etc who aren't enrolled at the anagrafe of permante residents and would otherwise find themselves in a bureaucratic limbo.
4. Yes, paying again sucks, but Italy can't afford to hand out anything for free.
5. The downside of not having one? Try waving a piece of paper at the e.g. Swiss. It just won't cut it as was proved when the extended ID cards to 10yrs. Groups like Brits in Europe etc lobbied hard for a standard EU card to avoid any problems. EU in UK is also lobbying for a card as proof of right. So far, the UK has ignored all request, even a piece of paper, for physical proof of right to remain.
6. Though Th's a new card, it was a due to be rolled out earlier, but Covid delayed it.
That said, I do not think tthink people need to rush out to get it, with the exception of students etc and, possibly, cross border workers.
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Old Dec 19th 2020, 11:05 am
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Default Re: New biometric card

There are numerous standard "EU" documents that are not written in all the official languages- A COC for a car for example but because the document is standard it means that every bureaucrat knows what is in section A B C etc even if it is written in a language that the said bureaucrat does not speak and it will be the same format across the EU Personally I would rather spend the best part of a morning at a Questura getting the card than I would waving a piece of paper around at say Calais and engaging in an argument with an implaccable gendarme who is only speaking/reading French because he had bad nights kip or whatever
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Old Jan 14th 2021, 9:07 am
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Default Re: New biometric card

Anyone received their card yet?
If so how long did it take to process?
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Old Jan 15th 2021, 7:49 am
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Default Re: New biometric card

Originally Posted by dubster View Post
Anyone received their card yet?
If so how long did it take to process?
As far as I'm aware, nobody has got it yet. Although some questura have started putting up info about it on their websites, not all of them have. Some of them might be giving appointments but none of them seem to actually be ready to process it. A lot of them are using PEC email addresses to book an appointment so people are forced to get a PEC before they can do anything.
There also seems to be a problem with the payment. Some of the websites are saying to use a bollettino postale with payment to such and such and the causale is such and such...... but some of them are saying to get the pre-printed bollettino from the post office and of course, the smaller post offices don't have them yet or have never heard of them.
It's going to be a real pain in the neck because word has obvioulsy spread around Italian offices and many Brits are already being refused residency, health care or new or renewable job contracts until they have this new "permesso di soggiorno" in hand - which of course nobody does. It's also not a permesso di soggiorno so the wording is confusing lots of people too with some offices asking for the permesso, others the carta di soggiorno and others the new Brexit Card.
The questura have also forgotten or neglected to mention on their websites that it is NOT obligatory so state offices or employers are insisting on us having something that isn't any obligation at all.

The Veneto is "arancione" so I'm not supposed to leave my comune let alone drive 30 Km to the capoluogo di provincia which is where my questura is. I'm pretty sure that having an appointment will come under one of the travel exemptions but I can just imagine the conversation if I get stopped on the road:

Police – where are you going?

Me * To the Questura.

- Why?

* To get the new electronic carta di soggiorno.

- Never heard of it.

* Neither had most of the Questura until yesterday …… smile sweetly.

- What’s it for?

* It’s for British residents here. It’s something new since Brexit.

- Hahaha Brexit. That’s a mess isn’t it? So you’re Johnny English. Where are you from?

* England. York-shy-ear.

- Like the dog? I’ve never been to London. Patente e libretto. Documento di identità?

- It says Ooooo Kappa on your documents. That’s Ukraine.

* It’s UK. United Kingdom. Regno Unito.

- No. England is Geee Beeee. Gran Bretagna.

(Keep smiling Lorna. Avoid a Geography lesson)

- Where’s your Permesso di Soggiorno?

* It doesn’t exist anymore. I’ve got a certificate of permanent residency, a new attestazione di iscrizione anagrafica per l’accordo su recesso del Regno Unito e dell’Irlanda del Nord and an appointment at the Questura.

- Have you got the auto-dichiarazione for the motivo of your spostamento?

* Yes of course.

10 minute conflab with his pal and possibly some radio communication with the caserma or questura.

- Può andare Signora but go straight back home and stay inside. Do you understand the rules?

* Yes of course Sir. Thank you Sir. Have a nice day Sir. 3 bags full Sir.

Remember driving school lessons: indicate, triple check mirrors and look backwards before slowly pulling out onto the road and then turn up the stereo to Bat Out Of Hell.

This is an optimistic version lol.


This is the info on the Vicenza Questura website:
https://questure.poliziadistato.it/i...7d14e201516148


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