gioppino

If you are from the EU you don't need the Libretto di Lavoro anymore, only the intention of coming to Italy to work or study. This is the theory, because the practice is that the bureaucrats at the Anagrafe can make your life difficult if they want to or because they can or because a racist mayor instructs them to do so.

A good command of the language can make a big difference.

Lorna at Vicenza

We know that the Libretto di Lavoro is no longer in use but, Ononno was talking about 50 years ago.

fleetwoodmac1975

Don't blame the EU, it is your government's fault. If it applied the CURRENT regs properly the NHS would not be fled dry by foreign baby machines, benefit tourists etc etc

highlander1

How is it that the PM of Poland , among others, did scream to the UK government , saying that his citizens were ENTITLED to all kind of benefits, whereas as a Brit you will get NOUGHT !!! if you were to move to Poland. ?

fleetwoodmac1975

All these other countries have the concept of residence and qualifying criteria which the UK does not have. That's why the UK govment has not got a clue of who is living in the UK. So long as any residence criteria applies to locals as well as foreigners the EU cannot do anything. It is not the EU's fault if the UK has a bloated benefit system and no residence criteria \ register.

highlander1

Oh, well then maybe another good reason why Britain should leave the EU ?

Ruby2

And the UK does not have a compulsory identity card system. It nearly introduced one a few years ago but the plan was axed in 2010: BBC News - Identity cards scheme will be axed 'within 100 days'

ononno

Brought up in Britain in the 40's and 50's I was taught to cherish the idea of respect for 'authority' without being afraid of the same authority. In fact with the idea that this 'authority' whoever it may be, should have the same respect for me as a person. It was the concept of reciprocal respect between state and citizens. Hence the continental idea of 'show me your papers' was abhorrent to me and my generation, and still is. Nothing irritates me more than when some official, at whatever level, says 'un documento per favore'.
In Britain at that time, if I said I was so and so, and I was x years old, that was it. I even remember that my first driving licence had the date of birth in a little dotted triangle in the top LH corner for you to check; and then you could snip it off. Your date of birth was nobody elses business but your own.
That concept/mentality fortunately still prevails amongst the majority of people in Britain. I can also understand, though not happily accept, that maybe in today's society maybe an ID document is becoming necessary - I mean apart from a passport; a necessary document for any of us stupid enough to have left, or want to leave, The Sceptered Isle.
bye bye dicette l'inglese

highlander1

I could not have put it better myself !

sunnysider

Yes, great post ononno - I couldn't possibly have expresed it better - thanks - I particularly liked the bit about reciprocal respect.

When being driven around in Italy I always find it an affront when the carabinieri with their lollipops in their boots (is there some sexual code related to which boot, which position?) pull the driver over for no apparent reason. I don't mind seasonal breathalysers or occasional paper checks (sometimes the UK police target certain areas) but it seems so much more common in Italy. And of course there are way too many police/police forces keeping each other company anyway.

I never carry any papers with me when I'm in Italy. Am I really going to carry my passport around?

On the original topic of access to UK/Italian healthcare and benefits I do know of one young Italian recently arrived in London who with some amazement (news/tips travel fast of course) said: "I've been told sunnysider that Indians can get their housing paid for". Apart from the oddity that it seemed, like some Italians, that he hadn't grasped that an "Indian" as he put it might have been in Britain for donkeys' years, or more likely been born here, it did rather imply that Britain was seen as rather welcoming compared to Italy. As the discussion progressed and I rather worried about the country's finances (anyone who knows anything beyond Cameron's PR knows that the situation is pretty bad) I was told with a certain air of triumph that XXX per cent (it is massive) of London's population was foreign born.

Mind you this certain triumphalism might deflate when he considers the effect that this has had on house/flat/cupboard prices.

fleetwoodmac1975

sunnys it is a well know fact that the UK is seen as the land of milk and honey with regards to benefits.
They are really given to all and sundry. There are plenty of italian single mummies who are living in London declaring themselves as single and claiming housing benefit but in reality they live with someone.
Lets not even talk about EE's bringing their grandparents over so that they can get free treatment on the NHS.
Anyone with a brain knows that Cameron's good PR has worked up to know but Britain's books are cooked......someone is going to have to pay for the bloated welfare and imho pensions will not be paid by the time I retire....for example.

Personally I don't mind being asked for ID so long as it helps a country keep control of crime / borders / know how many people live in it. Can we safely say that the UK does these three things effectively? I have my doubts...

highlander1

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Personally I don't mind being asked for ID so long as it helps a country keep control of crime / borders / know how many people live in it. Can we safely say that the UK does these three things effectively? I have my doubts...[/QUOTE]

Because Italy does that ?Italy keeps control of crime/borders/ how many people live in it... Ma non facciamo ridere, please.

fleetwoodmac1975

"Because Italy does that ?Italy keeps control of crime/borders/ how many people live in it... Ma non facciamo ridere, please.[/QUOTE]"

It is not my mission to educate you so I shall not do that.

However I invite you to read the Oecd statistics on crime particularly the UK position when compared to the rest of Europe.

If you don't want to read those just have a think about the Jihadis coming back to the UK from Syria, I don't see that going on anywhere else.

highlander1

Apart from taking Rome ?! Or Spain, as they said yesterday, or India ?!

By the way, I don't think I or many others on this forum needs to be educated, and especially not by you. If you find that living in the UK is so taxing, may I suggest you consider a move ? ... but Italy may not be a good place for you, what with the jobs situation and the much lower salaries !
A lot of the expats are retired and have given areas of Europe that were depopulating an injection, giving new life in places that were dying as the local populations were leaving escaping to the cities.

So if you hate so much the UK, just leave and go somewhere else, with all the problems you are describing there, I don't really know how you can cope.

fleetwoodmac1975

The same thing applies to you. You live in Italy yet you have nothing good to say about the place. Why don't you go home?
You have even had the audacity to state that Tony Blair is not a war criminal.
If I were you I would get rid of this false sense of superiority you seem to harbour against Italy, you post history speaks by itself regarding this...