Healthcare... here it is again...
#1
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2017
Location: Saronno, Italy
Posts: 6
Healthcare... here it is again...
Firstly, apologies for repeating some parts, but every case I read or hear about is different, so I have a few questions to see if anyone has the same situation...
I've been in Italy now for 8 months, have been a resident for 5 months, work for an Italian company and pay taxes.
For the past 3 months I have tried to get healthcare and for 3 months have been denied.
I went to my local ASL and brought all the documents you are supposed to; Passport, Codice Fiscale, proof of Residency, work contract and my payslips for 3 months.
The woman on the desk said I needed proof from England that says "i am no longer covered by the NHS". Fair enough. She also told me this is the E104 form.
Here's my problem. I'm 25, moving abroad to live permanently and am NOT looking for England to support my medical expenses. I have read through most of these E forms and none of them seem eligible. I also called my surgery in England and they refused to help me or give me a telephone consultation to discuss with my Doctor. I have read about the S1 form, but according to the gov.uk website I am again not eligible...
Any of this sound familiar?
Any help would be greatly appreciated
Thanks,
Simon
I've been in Italy now for 8 months, have been a resident for 5 months, work for an Italian company and pay taxes.
For the past 3 months I have tried to get healthcare and for 3 months have been denied.
I went to my local ASL and brought all the documents you are supposed to; Passport, Codice Fiscale, proof of Residency, work contract and my payslips for 3 months.
The woman on the desk said I needed proof from England that says "i am no longer covered by the NHS". Fair enough. She also told me this is the E104 form.
Here's my problem. I'm 25, moving abroad to live permanently and am NOT looking for England to support my medical expenses. I have read through most of these E forms and none of them seem eligible. I also called my surgery in England and they refused to help me or give me a telephone consultation to discuss with my Doctor. I have read about the S1 form, but according to the gov.uk website I am again not eligible...
Any of this sound familiar?
Any help would be greatly appreciated
Thanks,
Simon
#2
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Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 404
Re: Healthcare... here it is again...
In my experience, this just sounds plain wrong. I think the S1 form is for retired people.
I would suggest going back to the ASL and basically telling them you disagree with their interpretation - indeed, if you go back you may well end up talking to someone different who will have a different interpretation of the "rules".
For my part, I am self-employed and each year I go along and sign a self-declaration that I was fiscally resident in Italy. No need to sever any links with the UK!
There's a bit of info here which you could try to use to push back against any similar requests: Assistenza sanitaria agli stranieri
Stand your ground & good luck!
I would suggest going back to the ASL and basically telling them you disagree with their interpretation - indeed, if you go back you may well end up talking to someone different who will have a different interpretation of the "rules".
For my part, I am self-employed and each year I go along and sign a self-declaration that I was fiscally resident in Italy. No need to sever any links with the UK!
There's a bit of info here which you could try to use to push back against any similar requests: Assistenza sanitaria agli stranieri
Stand your ground & good luck!
#3
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Joined: Oct 2016
Location: Ex Teramo, Abruzzo
Posts: 1,212
Re: Healthcare... here it is again...
I think the reason you find conflicting information is the fact most official bodies don't have a clue what's going on in such a ever changing environment. In the UK this is the official guide - an NHS link. But they refer to an Italian link that no longer exists. They also will give various DWP contact details or HMRC. So it is little wonder people find it hard. The fact the ASL are telling you that you need an obsolete Form E104 would indicate their level of competence. You either have to go back and (nicely) argue it out with them or get confirmation in writing that they are not doing their job correctly. One way may be to get the UK body previously responsible for issuing the E104 to give you such confirmation. I suspect these days that's HMRC, but then again it could be DWP. I would look at the link, find a number for either and call it. Most of the time it takes an age to get through, but when you do they are (in the main) very helpful. As an aside, as far as I know you are covered in Italy for at least urgent medical help by just being there and no one I know has ever been refused treatment. If you still have an EH1C it's likey to still be accepted (should not be really). Good luck!
#4
Re: Healthcare... here it is again...
I have noticed in our ASL office that there are helpful advisors and unhelpful ones. I got my tessera sanitaria with the same documents that you mention. I would just try again on a different day and time.
#5
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2017
Location: Saronno, Italy
Posts: 6
Re: Healthcare... here it is again...
Thank you for the advice everyone.
I'm leaving a note now for everyone else who may encounter this, HMRC and the Overseas Healthcare Team have just told me they will not supply a letter/document to assist you in getting healthcare abroad unless you are in France or Spain. They wash their hands of the other countries, but the woman couldn't tell me why.
So I will be returning to the ASL armed to the teeth with paperwork and fingers crossed this time I can get somewhere... che palle...
I'm leaving a note now for everyone else who may encounter this, HMRC and the Overseas Healthcare Team have just told me they will not supply a letter/document to assist you in getting healthcare abroad unless you are in France or Spain. They wash their hands of the other countries, but the woman couldn't tell me why.
So I will be returning to the ASL armed to the teeth with paperwork and fingers crossed this time I can get somewhere... che palle...
#6
Re: Healthcare... here it is again...
Brexit is not improving the sentiment towards UK citizens at the moment. A few weeks ago the headline on the Umbria RAI was something like local farmers will lose their EU farm payments because of the UK exiting the EU. That sort of news wether true or false filters down to already fed up public workers.
#7
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 474
Re: Healthcare... here it is again...
I think the reason you find conflicting information is the fact most official bodies don't have a clue what's going on in such a ever changing environment. In the UK this is the official guide - an NHS link. But they refer to an Italian link that no longer exists. They also will give various DWP contact details or HMRC. So it is little wonder people find it hard. The fact the ASL are telling you that you need an obsolete Form E104 would indicate their level of competence. You either have to go back and (nicely) argue it out with them or get confirmation in writing that they are not doing their job correctly. One way may be to get the UK body previously responsible for issuing the E104 to give you such confirmation. I suspect these days that's HMRC, but then again it could be DWP. I would look at the link, find a number for either and call it. Most of the time it takes an age to get through, but when you do they are (in the main) very helpful. As an aside, as far as I know you are covered in Italy for at least urgent medical help by just being there and no one I know has ever been refused treatment. If you still have an EH1C it's likey to still be accepted (should not be really). Good luck!
And when you say "urgent medical help" I presume you mean hospital Emergency services? If so, then it's not even contingent on an EHIC - in a genuine Emergency everyone, regardless of origin, legal/illegal status etc, is entitled to treatment.
However, to return to the original OP's query, I concur with GeorgeYoung and philat98 in that you are entitled to enter the system. And also, that the path of least resistance is to go back to the ASL and try to see a different person. Yes, it is possible to force the issue with the same person, but public servants are usually very, very reluctant to change their minds (i.e. admit to being wrong), and the more you push the more they are inclined to push back. A good Plan B, if you are working for a large company, is to speak to their HR department and see if they can help out.
Last edited by Serrano; Jun 4th 2018 at 1:44 pm.
#8
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Joined: Nov 2012
Location: bute
Posts: 9,740
Re: Healthcare... here it is again...
EHIC is not for use where the holder has become resident in another EU State. It is for those who are temporarily away.
#9
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,508
Re: Healthcare... here it is again...
With your work contract, you are entitled to be registered at the ASL and have a GP. I would very respectfully ask to see the director, as you took all the documentation you needed under the law.
#10
Re: Healthcare... here it is again...
I agree. You have an ITALIAN work contract which means you are automatically paying into the system here. Try taking your last pay slip as well just as extra proof and don't give up. Let us know how you get on.
#11
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Joined: Jan 2012
Location: Dépt 61
Posts: 5,254
Re: Healthcare... here it is again...
Perhaps whatever country you say you're in, they pick two different countries and say they could help you if you lived there
#12
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Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,900
Re: Healthcare... here it is again...
Brexit is not improving the sentiment towards UK citizens at the moment. A few weeks ago the headline on the Umbria RAI was something like local farmers will lose their EU farm payments because of the UK exiting the EU. That sort of news wether true or false filters down to already fed up public workers.
Concur with the others. Try again.
#13
Just Joined
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 2
Re: Healthcare... here it is again...
Firstly, apologies for repeating some parts, but every case I read or hear about is different, so I have a few questions to see if anyone has the same situation...
I've been in Italy now for 8 months, have been a resident for 5 months, work for an Italian company and pay taxes.
For the past 3 months I have tried to get healthcare and for 3 months have been denied.
I went to my local ASL and brought all the documents you are supposed to; Passport, Codice Fiscale, proof of Residency, work contract and my payslips for 3 months.
The woman on the desk said I needed proof from England that says "i am no longer covered by the NHS". Fair enough. She also told me this is the E104 form.
Here's my problem. I'm 25, moving abroad to live permanently and am NOT looking for England to support my medical expenses. I have read through most of these E forms and none of them seem eligible. I also called my surgery in England and they refused to help me or give me a telephone consultation to discuss with my Doctor. I have read about the S1 form, but according to the gov.uk website I am again not eligible...
Any of this sound familiar?
Any help would be greatly appreciated
Thanks,
Simon
I've been in Italy now for 8 months, have been a resident for 5 months, work for an Italian company and pay taxes.
For the past 3 months I have tried to get healthcare and for 3 months have been denied.
I went to my local ASL and brought all the documents you are supposed to; Passport, Codice Fiscale, proof of Residency, work contract and my payslips for 3 months.
The woman on the desk said I needed proof from England that says "i am no longer covered by the NHS". Fair enough. She also told me this is the E104 form.
Here's my problem. I'm 25, moving abroad to live permanently and am NOT looking for England to support my medical expenses. I have read through most of these E forms and none of them seem eligible. I also called my surgery in England and they refused to help me or give me a telephone consultation to discuss with my Doctor. I have read about the S1 form, but according to the gov.uk website I am again not eligible...
Any of this sound familiar?
Any help would be greatly appreciated
Thanks,
Simon
I'm glad I found this thread!! We relocated here from Scotland 4 months ago. We have residency in place, taking out 2 x annual health insurance policies as part of those requirements. We've been to ASL with residency docs, codice fiscale, insurance docs etc and were told we needed S1 forms. I approached HMRC and today received a letter saying we are now out with UK social security jurisdiction, so we need to approach Italian health care system.
My husband is retired and has a vocational pension, I worked for 20 years in public sector. Neither of us are working in Italy and are below for UK state pension age. I think this is where our circumstances don't easily fit a box. We don't rely on Italy for benefits and we seem to be supporting the economy well via purchases etc!!
I'm going to go back to ASL to challenge their position. Good grief it shouldn't be this tricky should it! Imagine trying to do this post Brexit?!
#14
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Joined: Oct 2016
Location: Ex Teramo, Abruzzo
Posts: 1,212
Re: Healthcare... here it is again...
I'm glad I found this thread!! We relocated here from Scotland 4 months ago. We have residency in place, taking out 2 x annual health insurance policies as part of those requirements. We've been to ASL with residency docs, codice fiscale, insurance docs etc and were told we needed S1 forms. I approached HMRC and today received a letter saying we are now out with UK social security jurisdiction, so we need to approach Italian health care system.
My husband is retired and has a vocational pension, I worked for 20 years in public sector. Neither of us are working in Italy and are below for UK state pension age. I think this is where our circumstances don't easily fit a box. We don't rely on Italy for benefits and we seem to be supporting the economy well via purchases etc!!
I'm going to go back to ASL to challenge their position. Good grief it shouldn't be this tricky should it! Imagine trying to do this post Brexit?!
My husband is retired and has a vocational pension, I worked for 20 years in public sector. Neither of us are working in Italy and are below for UK state pension age. I think this is where our circumstances don't easily fit a box. We don't rely on Italy for benefits and we seem to be supporting the economy well via purchases etc!!
I'm going to go back to ASL to challenge their position. Good grief it shouldn't be this tricky should it! Imagine trying to do this post Brexit?!
#15
Just Joined
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 2
Re: Healthcare... here it is again...
Firstly, apologies for repeating some parts, but every case I read or hear about is different, so I have a few questions to see if anyone has the same situation...
I've been in Italy now for 8 months, have been a resident for 5 months, work for an Italian company and pay taxes.
For the past 3 months I have tried to get healthcare and for 3 months have been denied.
I went to my local ASL and brought all the documents you are supposed to; Passport, Codice Fiscale, proof of Residency, work contract and my payslips for 3 months.
The woman on the desk said I needed proof from England that says "i am no longer covered by the NHS". Fair enough. She also told me this is the E104 form.
Here's my problem. I'm 25, moving abroad to live permanently and am NOT looking for England to support my medical expenses. I have read through most of these E forms and none of them seem eligible. I also called my surgery in England and they refused to help me or give me a telephone consultation to discuss with my Doctor. I have read about the S1 form, but according to the gov.uk website I am again not eligible...
Any of this sound familiar?
Any help would be greatly appreciated
Thanks,
Simon
I've been in Italy now for 8 months, have been a resident for 5 months, work for an Italian company and pay taxes.
For the past 3 months I have tried to get healthcare and for 3 months have been denied.
I went to my local ASL and brought all the documents you are supposed to; Passport, Codice Fiscale, proof of Residency, work contract and my payslips for 3 months.
The woman on the desk said I needed proof from England that says "i am no longer covered by the NHS". Fair enough. She also told me this is the E104 form.
Here's my problem. I'm 25, moving abroad to live permanently and am NOT looking for England to support my medical expenses. I have read through most of these E forms and none of them seem eligible. I also called my surgery in England and they refused to help me or give me a telephone consultation to discuss with my Doctor. I have read about the S1 form, but according to the gov.uk website I am again not eligible...
Any of this sound familiar?
Any help would be greatly appreciated
Thanks,
Simon
Funny enough your position “early retirement” is the most common one I’ve ever come across. This is probably due to the fact most don’t seem to take this into account before moving and find it very frustrating when they hit the brick wall. Unfortunately the “goal posts” were moved some time ago and you cannot get a “form S1” until you are in receipt of a UK (or other EU) state pension (Brexit apart).
many thanks