Maimutica

Hi Ballerina!

Congratulations!! Was wondering if you have managed with regards to your question? I live "just around the corner" from you in a village called Ameglia. I had my son in Sarzana in 2009 and I am now 25 weeks pregnant with our second son!! Let me know if there are any questions, maybe I will be able to help.

Charlotte T

Hi Ballerina,

Congratulations! I just wanted to say something about epidurals. I have had two babies here in Italy and although the care was different from what I would have expected in the UK I found it to be more than adequate on the medical side if a bit lacking in terms of the mothers personal well-being. Many of my experiences mirror those of other posts on this thread, so I won't say more than that.

As part of the pre natal work up I had to have a chat with an anaesthetist who basically told me he couldn't understand why any woman would not have a planned epidural. I didn't want one and didn't have one for either of my children's births, but my sister in law had one for her daughter born in 2008 and plans to book one for her new baby due this year. The point is that at least in our area (Bangi di Lucca/Barga) you need to 'book' your epidural - it's still not guaranteed out of hours (although my sister in law had her daughter in the middle of the night), but it might help....

I was terrified of giving birth in Italy before my first was born, but it's good to remember that whilst it is different from the care in the UK it is still of a good standard. In fact there are fewer complications and, (even more importantly,) deaths of both mothers and babies during birth here than in the UK.

Do all the research, but try not to worry too much, you will be fine!

gelato

Charlotte - I wonder if in your area you really need to 'book' an epidural ahead of time of just do the visita with the anaesthesiologist? At the public hospital in Rome where I gave birth you had to do the visita with the anaesthesiologist ahead of time. He did a quick checkup to see we were medically able to have the epidural followed by what was (for me) a very interesting lecture on how an epidural works and the risk factors. But of course this did not mean that you HAD to have an epidural during labour. It just meant that if you decided you wanted one you could have one.

But of course this may be completely different in other cities. This is just how it seems to work at most public hospitals in Rome.

Charlotte T

Hi Gelato, the meeting with the anaesthetist was 'compulsory' and we were told that if you didn't request an epidural you were unlikely to get one if you changed your mind during labour. Having said that 'booking' it didn't make it compulsory, I think probably they just make a note that you think you might want one but in the end it would come down to whether there is someone available to administer it at the time. Perhaps if you have requested it they would be more inclined to call someone to come in if necessary...but I really have no idea!

I wish the anaesthetist I saw had talked about risks. He told me that epidurals were 100% safe and he could see no reason why any woman would give birth without one! I used to work in a hospital and anaesthetics was one of my departments so I know that's not true - but I couldn't be bothered to argue so I just sat there until he shut up!!

Stellina

The hospital I gave birth in in Florence holds a sort of seminar every week for pregnant woman where you can go and they explain the whole epidural procedure, including the possible side effects and then at the end you sign a consent form which they keep so if you do ask for one when in labour they already have it. Again, doesn't guarantee that you'll get one, depends if the anesthetist is available at the time

K in Modena

At our antenatal classes they just kind of went, "Hmm. Epidurals aren't easy to get. Pity, that." Good thing I didn't want one really!
Someone I know paid 800 Euros to go over to Bologna and give birth with a guaranteed epidural.

gelato

I think that is so terrible. Having the option of pain relief during labour is IMO a human rights issue. If I hadn't had an epidural I probably would have ended up with an emergency c-section. After 9 hours au naturel and basically no progress the midwife told me that the doctors were talking about doing a c-section for 'failure to progress'. I asked for an epidural (luckily I'd done the visita with the anaesthesiologist ahead of time) and 3 hours later I was holding a beautiful baby girl. I think this happens quite often - I have several friends who have had similar experiences. Anyway my epidural was completely free and at the hospital I went to they're available 24/7. If I had another baby I'd definitely go there again.

K in Modena

What's interesting to me is that they have no other forms of pain relief here. No gas and air, pethadin, or whatever. We were told "no drugs exist that can help with the pain of childbirth".

gelato

Yes it's true. I had friends back in Australia who had gas and air but they looked at me like I was crazy when i tried to ask about this (also - how do you say that in Italian?) I've heard that pethidine is pretty bad as it makes you feel very 'drugged' and out of it. Not sure if that's true.

I have to say I was a big fan of my epidural. It seems that they give quite a low dose of the drugs here so you're still able to change positions, move around etc. I still felt some pain but it was about 10% of what I felt pre-epidural.

I broke my tailbone during birth (4kg baby) and I don't think I would have wanted to feel that without pain relief. It was bad enough when the epi wore off.

K in Modena

My sister had pethadin first time around and the baby wouldn't latch on for several days because he was so sleepy. Mind you, neither would mine and I had a totally drug-free birth.
Ouch at breaking your tailbone, that sounds really nasty. My baby was over 4 kg too so I guess I was lucky to get away with lots and lots of stitches. I had done a hynobirthing course so that was my pain relief- and it worked, pretty much.

Lorna at Vicenza

No mention was made of epidurals when I gave birth in 2000 and no mention again in 2003.
I was given some pethedine in 2000 but I think that was an injection before they started stitching me. A couple of hours later I was violently sick 3 times. The nurse said it was probably the pethedine.
No pethedine in 2003 and no vomiting either.

My friend wanted an epidural last year in the same hospital so I thought they were making progress by offering them. She did all the tests etc. for it. but when she was in labour and started asking about getting her epidural they kept telling her to wait a little longer and when she finally insisted, they told her that it was too late for that now, she was too far gone and she'd just have to push. I've heard rumours that they do that quite a lot as epidurals are expensive. Not sure how much of that rumour is true but my friend certainly didn't get hers.

I've asked a couple of gynos about gas and air but never ever been given a reasonable answer as to why it is not available here.

Isakat

In 2003 I asked for an epidural and got it, however, when I asked for gas and air both doctor and nurse had a laugh. Apparently it was introduced in the 70's in the hospitals but it was not popular, so they did away with it.
I did have gas and air back in the UK in 2000, but it did not do much for me, the pethidine made me hallucinate, so nothing beats an epidural in my opinion( unless you can take a lot of pain). I do not see why anyone should suffer in the 21st century if help is available.
I am surprised that they do not give epidurals to save money, when many expensive drugs can be obtained in the the Italian NHS and not in the UK one.

Stellina

For me just knowing that an epidural was an option (well thinking it was) made me go into labour alot more calmer as I thought if it all gets too much there is something to help. In the end I didn't need one because it all happened quite quickly but I do think they make you go as long as you can before considering it an option. I also got a TENS machine from Boots as I know in the UK it's widely used in labout wards, but when I asked my gyno about using it she was like "you can't use that in labour, it's dangerous?!!!"

ballerina

i thought I'd update on my experiences so far with antenatal care in both Italy and UK.. I'm 5 months pregnant now and I've had a bit of treatment in Italy, with private gynaecologists and with the consultorio ('free' service, although you still have to pay for stuff) and also in England as I spent some time there recently.

If it were possible, there is no doubt that I would choose to have the baby in England. So far my experiences (in La Spezia) have been dreadful. I first went to a private gynaecologist who charged €100 for a consultation and wanted to to a smear test, even though i'd had one last year so I thought it was uneccessary and perhaps a bit dangerous (?). He was very very dismissive about my concerns and requests for elective caesarean if needed, as I have an injured coccyx which gave me enough pan even before I was pregnant. I then tried the consultorio. The service was no different, the level of 'care' no different. I don't really understand what people mean when they say a private gynae will 'follow' you!

I had an initial scan at the consultorio and then at the hospital for a b-test (12 week scan and blood test). Nobody addressed me directly, even when I attended on my own, they never bothered bloody telling me anything. They seemed to resent being questioned in the slightest! Just questions like 'when is the due date, does everything look ok' etc.

the following week I was in England so I made an appointment to see a midwife, just to find out what was going on, I felt pretty much left in the dark in Italy. The patient care was undeniably much much better, really caring staff, lots of choices for me, right fromt he start, I just felt much more involved in the process. When I discussed my coccyx problem, the midwife told me that different positions for labour would be more suitable and suggested using a birthing ball, pool, physiotherapy if the pain was bad during pregnancy, etc. I was so comfortable with everything.

I was also in England at the time i'd got a 20 weeks scan due, so I had that done. They were very very thorough, explained everything to me, showed me all the different parts and what they look for etc. The next week I was back in Italy and had an appointment to go to the consultorio to show them the blood results, and (i thought) the 20 weeks scan...

When I got there, I showed them the results of the nuchal translucency, the alfa feta protien and all the other tests. They glanced at it, said 'everything's fine'. then they asked me if I'd been to the hospital (in La Spezia) for the 20 weeks scan. I said no, I thought that was what my appointment that day was for, Ithought they would be doing the scan, as they'd done one of them before there. The woman SCREAMED at me saying I was an idiot, didn't i realise how important it was for them to check the growth of the baby, it's a very important scan' etc. Then she said 'get in there, we'll do it now'. I was in shock! head hung down, I sloped off into the other room and I couldn't help myslef but burst into tears. I didn't understand what i'd done wrong, as far as i was concerned that appointment was for the scan and nobody had told me i needed to make an appointment at the hospital for it. The doctor (or nurse? gynaecologist? I actually have no idea) ran the scanner thing over my belly really fast, saying 'yeah, yeah, everything's ok'. She was a bit nicer to me after I told her OH was away on a ship and I was ALL ALONE HERE etc but the other woman (who screamed at me) was still a bitch. They basically treated me like a stupid ignorant immigrant/teenager who was incapable of having a baby properly. I felt horrible and I was crying and shaking all the long walk home.. I'm not normally someone who lets emotions get the better of me, but i suppose a mix of horrid treatment and hormones just overcame me.

If I had a choice, I'd definitely go to England to have the baby. There is no way I'd have it in La Spezia. Maybe a few years ago when they had a lovely amternity unit in Sarzana, but not in the hospital here. They don't have any security at all in the wards, people can just wander around and all the doors are flung wide open with strange, scruffy men (husbands?) wandering in and out but no sign of babies anywhere! It is a horrible horrible place and I don't recommend it!

ahh I feel better now after a rant.

ballerina

ooh i forgot to add, when I said i hadn't felt any movement, she said 'that's because you are too fat'!!!!!! I'm not even overweight! I wish i'd said to her, I'm pregnant, what's your excuse??? Unfortunately i was in far too much of a state to make any witty comebacks.

Also, although i've had many many many visits in Italy, not one person has given me a due date (despite me asking several times) or told me precisely how pregnant I seemed to be. I wasn't offered a photo from the scan either. Gutted. (thank god I went for the scan in england and got a nice selection of photos!

On another note, whenever I have told people I don't want to know the sex of the baby, they have been flabbergasted and cannot understand why i'd not want to know! am I so very strange? I want a nice surprise at the end of it, and apart from running a book on it (family tradition) I enjoy the guessing game. They don't know how to have a bit of fun here!