pugliese

Hi to all the permanent residents here in Italy !

I was just wondering if you have all applied for the card at the questura seeing as though it is not compulsory?
If yes and you obtained it, has there been an occasion when it was necessary to show it?
I still haven't bothered .... I mean, if I stay in Italy, then I don't need it and if I stay in Europe where there are no border checks, I don't need it either. So what's the purpose?

Margaret M

I have sent 2 PEC emails to Brindisi Questura, so far with no response. The first one was on 1st September, then another in December.

PSG2014

I managed to get ours okay...............BUT................communicatio ns with our questura were APPALLING.

The only way I progressed them to completion was to actually go to the office. Once there they were delightful and very helpful...............after the fingerprints and the paperwork, I was told that I would hear in about 4 weeks time.

Many phone calls and emails later (no replies), we went back and, the lady went to a filing cabinet and returned with our cards, and........................they were delightful and very helpful !!

I can only assume they were waiting for us to come and collect them.

Go and knock on their door !

PSG

Lugsbug

Hi Pugliese - we got our cards in March last year. We had a problem when we went to pick them up as we hadn't brought our receipt from when we applied (they didn't say we had to grr) so had to make another appointment. We haven't had to show it yet and don't really expect to unless we have a trip back to the UK.

philat98

They are legally supposed to respond to a PEC within 30 days. It is not very clear who you complain to if they dont bother. I suppose you just have to call them.

Margaret M

Brindisi Questura won't allow personal visits without an appointment.

PSG2014

yes, same as my questura, make an appointment they said, no response to many emails, I went and walked straight in, there were 20 or 30 other stranieri mingling outside.

When I saw lady at the desk, I asked about the card and the Brexit factor and she went and got it from her filing cabinet.

Go and try at their door ! What have you got to lose ?

PSG

pugliese

Thanks for all your replies and I know we have all been told we should getit, but what I really wanted to know is if its really necessary and when are you supposed to use it? I mean the Italian authorities know how long I've been here and the English do as well.
What would be a case scenario where I would have to produce it? Do you have to show it upon re-entering Italy after you've been in a non EC country?
Can't you just use the Autocertificazione (art. 46 del D.P.R. 28.12.2000, n. 445) which you fill in yourself?
Albeit I am a law abiding citizen .... in both countries lol ..... but it just seems like a bit more bureaucracy to me

Just wondering what my fellow expats think ....

modicasa

If they ask you for it, then they would expect you to produce it. You've been here long enough, I suppose, to know that there is often no connection between what you are asked for and what you actually need to have. If they ask you at teh airport and you dont have it, they will probably stamp your passport. However, its not obligatory, its your choice. I suspect it will become more important to have it as time goes on.

Lorna at Vicenza

I got mine this summer. At Christmas I finally went back to the UK with my son. We both travelled with British passports. On our return to Italy I said to the passport control guy, "please don't stamp our passports because my son is an Italian citizen and I am a permanent resident." The guy asked my son if he had an Italian ID card which he promptly showed him and got given a lecture about how he should be travelling with that and not a British passport. Yeah stupid, not possible after Brexit, but we weren't going to argue with him. Then he turned his attention to me. I showed him my permanent residency certificate from the comune, folded up inside my passport and which should be enough ....... but of course he just glanced at it and told me, "if you have this then you must have the new permesso." I took it from my purse, told him that it isn't mandatory to have it and got I given a lecture about how I must show it together with my passport. It was a small, secondary airport but plenty of Brits arrive in Treviso on cheap Ryanair flights to get to Venice so you'd think they'd be updated on the rules. Obviously not.

philat98

As a dual national you are suposed to enter Italy with Italian ID and the UK with UK id. I think it means you have to get two single tickets.

Solarcower

My friend has been refused an update of his health card without the new biometric card.
I have mine; it made travelling back to the UK much easier. No passport stamps either in Milan or Venice.

Lorna at Vicenza

Pointless I suppose for your friend to tell them that the bit of plastic is not at all mandatory. He could try printing this out which states that we have the right to request it, but not the obbligo to have it. Click on the vadecum - Italian version.

Quale documento può essere richiesto dai cittadini britannici e dai loro familiari? L’Accordo di Recesso prevede che i cittadini del Regno Unito e i loro familiari hanno diritto di ricevere un nuovo documento di soggiorno in formato elettronico, ma non l’obbligo di richiederlo, potendo dimostrare con altri mezzi lo status di beneficiari dell’Accordo di recesso.


https://www.poliziadistato.it/artico...c4fc5783277944

C.2s

It might be worth trying to argue the point with the ASL office on the basis of the info on the website (quoted in the above post). I referred my local ASL to the Ministry of Health website when they tried to insist on the card. The website also states very clearly that they can't demand to see it. I sort of helped them 'save face' in front of the big crowd of people who were waiting by blaming it all on the UK and saying "ASL can't be expected to know all the rules caused by Brexit" etc... and they did back down.

Had a similar thing with my mobile internet providers yesterday They 100% insisted that I can only cancel by sending a PEC email or registered letter with ID and codice fiscale, and there's no other possible way. I quoted them their own website which says there's an online form, and asked them to send me a link to it. They didn't accept they were wrong, but suggested a compromise.

It's just sort of expected here that any transaction between a public official/customer service person and a member of the public is going to be a battle... so they always start with an entrenched position of being no help whatsoever.

Maybe getting the biometric card might remove some barriers, but I have never believed it's going to completely change the culture here like some magic 'Get out of bureaucracy' card! ;-)

Lorna at Vicenza

It's just so stupid that the law says we can rock up with our bits of paper that say we are permanent residents before the accordo di recesso, but word got passed about that we all need the new bit of plastic and we don't. But hey ho - every ******* Italian thinks we need the plastic.